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If you were as deceptive with the FBI, as the FBI was with the FISA court, how quickly would you be charged?

If you were as deceptive with the FBI, as the FBI was with the FISA court, how quickly would you be charged?

Hopefully the statements issued by John Durham and Bill Barr reflect that the FBI officials behind this will be treated the way the FBI treats others.

The report of DOJ Inspector General Michael Horowitz on the FBI investigation of the Trump campaign was as expected.

As with his prior report on FBI Director James Comey’s leaking of information, Horowitz provided a headline version allowing Comey and others to declare exoneration because no criminal referral, while the details were devastating.

And the details were devastating, as John Solomon catalogs, Just how bad was the FBI’s Russia FISA? 51 violations and 9 false statements:

To understand just how shoddy the FBI’s work was in securing a Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act warrant targeting the Trump campaign, you only need to read an obscure attachment to Justice Department Inspector General Michael Horowitz’s report.

Appendix 1 identifies the total violations by the FBI of the so-called Woods Procedures, the process by which the bureau verifies information and assures the FISA court its evidence is true.

The Appendix identifies a total of 51 Woods procedure violations from the FISA application the FBI submitted to the court authorizing surveillance of former Trump campaign aide Carter Page starting in October 2016.

A whopping nine of those violations fell into the category called: “Supporting document shows that the factual assertion is

For those who don’t speak IG parlance, it means the FBI made nine false assertions to the FISA court. In short, what the bureau said was contradicted by the evidence in its official file.

Solomon then makes the key point:

To put that in perspective, former Trump aides Mike Flynn and George Papadopoulos were convicted of making single false statements to the bureau. One went to jail already, and the other awaits sentencing.

The FBI made nine false statements to the court.

So the question is:

If you were as deceptive with the FBI, as the FBI was with the FISA court, how quickly would you be charged?

The answer is:

Pretty damn fast, and pretty damn hard.

Hopefully the statements issued by John Durham and Bill Barr reflect that the FBI officials behind this will be treated the way the FBI treats others.


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Bury the details in footnotes and an appendix, where have we seen this before. At least they can claim it was in the report, somewhere.

G. de La Hoya | December 9, 2019 at 9:18 pm

Been hearing “nobody is above the law” a lot lately. Oh wait, that’s just for Trump 😉

    TrickyRicky in reply to G. de La Hoya. | December 9, 2019 at 9:45 pm

    I suppose it depends on which set of “laws” are to be applied to you. Are you a swamp creature or a deplorable? Therein lies the rub.

      rdmdawg in reply to TrickyRicky. | December 9, 2019 at 9:49 pm

      Indeed, we live under 2 tiers of justice. I’m tired of this.

      Something has to be done. Under Obama conservatives were actively targeted by the IRS, the ATF, the EPA, and every other alphabet executive branch agency. What happened with Benghazi? We still don’t know why an American ambassador and three other Americans were slaughtered. We don’t know what the hell Fast and Furious was about or why Brian Terry lost his life to Holder’s and Obama’s gun-grabbing dreams. Congress doesn’t delve into any of this, but they have spent almost four years and multi-millions of our dollars looking for an impeachable offense on Trump. It truly boggles the mind.

Subotai Bahadur | December 9, 2019 at 9:57 pm

In 1789 French terms, when the First and Second Estates are treated the same as the Third, and vice-versa I might believe something might be done to salvage a Constitutional Republic. Unfortunately, any claim of such, like most government reports by the “Deep State” begins with the words ‘once upon a time’.

Every previous fairy tale that was not followed by action lessens the credibility of the rule of law.

Subotai Bahadur

When you lie to the FBI, you get convicted and go to jail.

When the FBI lies, its a “lack of candor”, and it gets noted in your personnel file.

    The FBI relies on pubic trust, and that trust has been tested. Yes, lying to the FBI is a federal offense, but most people the FBI interacts with during investigations are not under suspicion of crime. What happens when the public just won’t talk to them because there is no trust, no respect?

    Virginia42 in reply to Aarradin. | December 10, 2019 at 8:27 am

    In Flynn’s case, when you *don’t* lie to the FBI you go to jail.

    Operation Downfall in reply to Aarradin. | December 10, 2019 at 9:09 am

    Aarrardin said, “ When you lie to the FBI, you get convicted and go to jail.”

    With Form 302, it probably doesn’t matter if you even talk to the FBI, you’ll get convicted and go to jail.

The FBI/DOJ are clearly corrupt and no one should ever talk to them period. Even with a lawyer present because they will threaten the lawyer also. I mean, never. Call another law enforcement agency and tell them that you have information, but it must be recorded and in the presence of your attorney. But not the FBI.

Paul In Sweden | December 9, 2019 at 10:50 pm

The FISA program comes to an end in March 2020 unless it is renewed. This program is necessary but can only operate if it is operated with the utmost integrity. This has not happened and information gathered has been maliciously released and warrants issued for partisan political motives. This cannot be allowed to happen and the only way to prevent abuse of FISA is to severely punish those that abuse this authority. Heads must roll.

    and yet, nothing will be done.

    and name a FISA success story, because i can’t think of one off hand…

    better to let it die.

    oldgoat36 in reply to Paul In Sweden. | December 10, 2019 at 4:58 am

    If you were a judge hearing from the FBI on any requests, and knowing what all was uncovered acting against a candidate for the office of President, how confident would you be that they would be giving you valid information on ordinary citizens and people?
    The FBI has been full of itself, and worked on questionable, and even illegal grounds from it’s inception. Hoover got results, but for those targeted due process was a joke, you were more likely to be killed, shot dead, than see inside a court.
    J. Edgar almost succeeded in taking over all aspects of what the CIA does now.
    The legacy lives on, corruption, not necessarily in the form of being bought, but in how they target, set up, manipulate information against you, essentially removing protections you are supposed to have through the Constitution.
    We live in a dangerous world, and the FBI can be doing important work to protect us, but how much of their work is really valid, and how much is enacting their own agendas?
    Comey and McCabe and Stzrok and Page demonstrated actions which apparently were set up against one party’s candidate for President because they didn’t like him, and were not going to allow the will of the voters to be honored.
    The Democrats are acting the same Fing way.
    The arrogance displayed in all this, which despite the swamp creature Horowitz’s claims, is politically biased for the benefit of one party at the expense of another. This should make everyone’s blood boil.
    I don’t see how you can fix this. I don’t see how Horowitz should be allowed to keep his job. If high up heads aren’t rolling from this abuse of power our country is not a country of laws, it is a dictatorship run by some shadow government against us.

My dad, a military vet and my hero, said to me that he has become truly concerned about our country only now.

He always told me we could survive Obama, crazed lefties on campuses, and a host of other woes, but the one thing we couldn’t survive was the loss of the rule of law. When the FBI began to collude against the duly elected president, my dad said, that’s it.

With the loss of the FBI, I guess he thought that there was nothing left to protect our Constitution, our country. I’m not sure why he felt the FBI was so important, and I should ask him next time I see him, but it was so poignant, so final that it stuck with me. And it haunts me now.

    Paul In Sweden in reply to Fuzzy Slippers. | December 9, 2019 at 11:33 pm

    This has the possibility of bringing communities together and stimulating new business. I see thousands of Town Hall Meetings with streets lined with vendor stalls displaying vats of hot tar & bales of feathers, next to talented American wood workers crafting stocks and pillories fashioned out of recyclable renewable domestic hardwood. Not to mention all the food vendors… We need to get back that good ol’ New England backbone and swagger that forged this county and made America Great!

    Boy am I steamed. If government prosecutors and law enforcement that have been given the highest level of public trust are not accountable to the law, there is only the illusion of law. We are deluding ourselves and refuse to face the reality of a ruling class and its subjects.

    Now, I am going to grab some coffee and read this IG report for myself.

    the only thing left now is the 2nd Amendment. it’s our last protection against tyranny, which is what we are facing.

      Walker Evans in reply to redc1c4. | December 10, 2019 at 1:10 am

      Have at least 1000 rounds for every firearm you possess, and enough repair parts to keep them running. Remember: Two is one, and one is none.

    I have to wonder if the FBI was ever a bastion of respect for the Constitution and the rule of law. For decades it seems to have been slowly evolving into an American version of the Gestapo: trigger-happy and willing to murder those whom it considers “enemies of the State”. The ongoing coup against Trump is just more of the same old same old.

      Look at the criminal acts done by the FBI against MLK, look at the criminal acts against the Constitution done by the “untouchables”, the FBI has a long history of working for the agenda of the FBI, not necessarily this country.
      How many cases have been prosecuted and won due to malfeasance of the FBI, ignoring the “protections” we are supposed to have under the Constitution.
      The CIA is probably worse, and I guarantee you Brennan was up to his butthole in assisting these crimes against Trump being set up.

      In WWII, Churchill was reluctant to meet with FDR because of how compromised WH security was. He persuaded FDR that the FBI itself was particularly suspect largely because J Edgar Hoover was such a publicity hound and power grabber. So they started assembling what became the CIA, one man at a time starting with “Wild Bill” Donovan.

      Those meetings between Churchill and FDR were conducted in secret on battleships in secret for a reason. Our government and the “top secret” (cough, cough) Manhattan and Norten Projects were hopelessly compromised by communist spies. It was no secret at the time that even Robert Oppenheimer and wife were communists and. They were finding Soviet WWII listening devices in the WH and Pentagon right into the 1970s.

      The only people our government has been successful at keeping secrets from are we citizens.

    NavyMustang in reply to Fuzzy Slippers. | December 10, 2019 at 6:53 am

    I have defended this country for close to 40 years. 25 in the Navy, 3 years as a cop, and the rest in various government intel jobs.

    The way all of this is going I feel more and more every day like your father and that my efforts were all just a big waste of time.

      Walker Evans in reply to NavyMustang. | December 10, 2019 at 12:20 pm

      Your experience mirrors mine, and it now appears we were both seriously in error. It’s disheartening to think that an entire career – over 40 years – of honorable service may have been wasted.

        Gentlemen, your effort was not wasted. In spite of our corrupt government you have kept us free. While our freedom and liberty are under attack, as long as there are those like you, we shall remain free.

        There will be a cost to freedom however. As is often stated it’s not free.

        Thank you for your service.

My big question is about the FISA judges. When are they going to demand accountability from those who lied to them? Or in the case of FBI officials, “unintentionally misrepresented the truth”? I would think a judge who approved a FISA warrant under false pretenses would want those disbarred.

    oldgoat36 in reply to Milwaukee. | December 10, 2019 at 5:20 am

    Given that these are powers which essentially strip the law and normal protections from citizens, any who were involved in the approval should lose their jobs, and frankly have to serve a minimum jail sentence.
    Rosenstein, Mueller, Comey, McCabe, the judge, are all part of a system that failed.
    This can’t be sugar coated. This has always been far worse than any political crap that went on with Watergate. This is abuse of power for political purposes (all this was done against one party and is currently being used and lied about by one party to overturn an election, can’t get more political than this).
    This runs right up to the top of our government, who happened to be Obama at the time these abuses were set up. The media who has been covering for these crimes, and are still out there crowing about this white washed report which is part of the cover up of these crimes, all need to be held accountable.
    This isn’t “innocent” errors made, this was purposeful in direct political opposition to the will of the people who elected Trump.
    All deplorables should be marching on Washington right now in protest against these abuses, and with the demand that all involved be thrown in prison, all their assets taken should trials find them guilty. The worst offenders should be treated as those who committed treason in the past were dealt with.

    Terence G. Gain in reply to Milwaukee. | December 10, 2019 at 5:30 am

    When are the FISA judges going to be impeached?

Terence G. Gain | December 10, 2019 at 5:15 am

Horowitz’s conclusion that there was no bias notwithstanding a mountain of evidence of bias and incompetence is proof of Horowitz’s bias and incompetence.

    It sure points to all his actions as being part of the cover up for these criminal behaviors which have led up to this sham impeachment and utter abuse of power at the highest levels of our government.

    Horowitz made no such conclusion. You are responding to left wing talking points. Absent clear evidence to refute the explanations given to Horowitz, he can only say it is unproven.

    They got to Horowitz, plain and simple.

    I am not saying Horowitz was dishonest or colluded with them, just that they scared him. In his investigation, he saw how far they would go and they let him know he and his family were fair game.

    His fake report was to save his own life and those he cared for. The swamp creatures are pure evil.

So what is the status of FISA renewal?

The timing of this is very curious to me. This report could have been released months ago and yet, knowing what was in the report and knowing that Durham and Barr would immediately pounce to negate his conclusions and misstatements, Horowitz came out with it anyway. And worse, it was a Comey-fied presentation of incontrovertible evidence of guilt with the opposite conclusion. And worse, framing it so Comey could claim exoneration. Why would he do that? What is the pay off? So now his own reputation is trashed forever. Isn’t this malpractice too? Is Horowitz now liable to be investigated himself?

I suspect that Horowitz was waiting it out hoping that something would happen before having to present his report to a boss who has even better information. If so, I feel much better about AG Barr and how this is going in general. It tells me that Trump is not alone. Not everyone in his circle is looking to put a knife in his back.

Let’s see what happens now with the Gang of McConnell/Graham and their sneaky deal handing the Dems their victory. They must now refuse to accept the Articles of Impeachment. Do it crashing down on them with a scathing, nationally televised rebuke. Stop the impeachment in its tracks you Swamp Rats! Send it back to the House!

Feeling more hopeful today. WINNING!!!

The other shoe is the likelihood that the saving grace, the Mifsud connection, is a fraud. If so, the predicate is a fraud, and the whole house of cards falls.

Since the Democrats on the Judiciary Committee want to base their findings not on facts, but on what they say is the inference of Trump’s actions; then I will infer from the actions of the DOJ purposeful bad intent and bias. Fire them all.

There is only one solution. The FBI, CIA, and DOJ must be dissolved.
All employees fired with NO benefits and no more government service.
I say this with some nephews and nieces working for them.

The FBI is so corrupt, I’m surprised they even bothered to apply for a warrant! Warrant? We’re the FBI, we don’t need no steenkin’ warrant!

The warrant was the insurance policy.

The FISC has been an unconstitutional entity from its inception with its broad coverage, secret warrants and complete absence of due process.

Knowing as we do how government expands its purview well beyond anything ever contemplated by its enablers, we should not be surprised at the flagrant abuse of power exercised by our leading federal investigative body.

Enact stupid laws and and this is what we deserve.

Just wait to see what happens when ‘Red Flag’ laws are implemented…

Must read from John Nolte at Breitbart:

Thank God Nolte is on OUR side! I can’t wait to see the day Comey arrives in prison either.

Imagine the Department of Justice inspector general (IG) conducting a review of the Jeffrey Epstein case. It might read something like this:

“While it is clear that Mr. Epstein abused minor girls, there is no documentary or testimonial evidence that he was motivated by a deviant sexual interest in those young girls.”