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To shoot rock throwers, or not, that is the Israeli question

To shoot rock throwers, or not, that is the Israeli question

Rock throwing has killed many Israelis, but is shooting rock-throwers justified?

This Thursday Israel’s 10-member security cabinet unanimously voted to approve a series of tougher measures against Palestinian rock and firebomb throwers.

The new measures are being adopted following a heated debate this past week over what the government and police can and can’t legally do (shoot them with live fire? lock them in jail for longer periods? penalize the parents?) to crack down on Palestinian youth who hurl stone and petrol bombs onto highways and city streets with increasing impunity.

There are no easy answers here, or simple solutions.

According to experts familiar with these cases, rock-throwing is mostly being perpetrated by unorganized and leaderless young men, making it hard for Israel’s security and intelligence forces to prevent impending attacks.

These angry Palestinian kids probably aren’t usually receiving direct orders to terrorize Jews. But they’re acting within an ideological environment that encourages and condones these attacks. In addition to incitement by the Palestinian Authority and Hamas, Israeli Arab leaders incite violence by spreading falsehoods about the Al Aqsa Mosque:

The police also singled out MK Hanin Zoabi, accusing her of inflaming the situation with misleading comments about the al-Aqsa Mosque, which sits atop the Mount, as is one of the holiest sites in Islam.

“The puzzling comment by MK Hanin Zoabi, as published in the media, claimed that ‘the closure of the gates of the al-Aqsa Mosque to Muslims is a dangerous step, and perhaps even unprecedented on a holiday. This is the first time that a place sacred to Muslims has been closed. It is a policy that is a declaration of war,’” the police said.

But, the statement pointed out, “Today the Temple Mount was open to Muslim worshipers only, and this claim is entirely baseless and appears designed to inflame passions, leading to clashes and harm to security forces and innocent civilians.”

As Israel continues to debate how to handle it, one thing’s for certain: after coming up with high-tech solutions to halt suicide bombings, rockets, and terror tunnels, it’s now going to have to devote more resources to fight against a “weapon dating back to David and Goliath”—the hurled rock.

Fire-Bombing and Rock-Throwing Terrorism

Rock-throwing has always been a popular mode of Palestinian protest. As Aron Heller of the Associated Press claims:

The Palestinian rock thrower emerged as an iconic image of the first uprising against Israeli occupation in the 1980s and…rock throwing has been a regular feature of demonstrations since then.”

Rock Throwing Palestinian Youth

The mainstream media often portrays throwing rocks or hurling crude incendiary devices as “a rite of passage”. But as Stephen M. Flatlow, a New Jersey attorney whose daughter was killed in a Palestinian terrorist attack in 1995, rightly remarks: “That’s the language one uses to describe a bar mitzvah, not an attempt to murder someone.”

Firebombs and hurled stones may be low-tech but they can inflict unimaginable devastation. (If video not loading, click here.)

צולם אתמול בירושלים , לא נגעתי

Posted by Gilad Hadari on Friday, November 7, 2014

Even pebbles can be deadly weapons (especially when flung via a slingshot) — no less so than firearms.

Recently we posted about a brave and courageous little girl—11 year-old Ayala Shapira—who last December was a passenger in a car driven by her father when a petrol bomb was thrown into it. As we noted, she suffered severe burns on much of her body. Ayala and her family have been trying to rebuild their lives ever since. With the help of family and friends, she’s now re-experiencing the joys of childhood. But the pain she will endure, physically and emotionally, will last a lifetime.

Ayala Shapira photo 1

Ayala Shapira photo 2

Stoning attacks, often with state-of-the-art slingshots that increase their lethality, have also claimed many more innocent lives.

The Holy City Rocks

In recent years, stone-throwing along with the launching of Molotov cocktails has become a near daily occurrence on some of the roadways leading into the capital city and in a number of east Jerusalem neighborhoods, the section of the city that Israel liberated from an illegal Jordanian occupation during the 1967 war.

Just a few weeks ago, in east Jerusalem’s East Talpiot-Armon Hanatziv neighborhood, the municipality reportedly distributed fire extinguishers to residents whose homes and gardens have been routinely targeted with firebombs over the past several months.

There can be no doubt that these firebombers and stone-throwers intend to murder the Jews of Jerusalem in cold blood. This isn’t some prank or merely a nuisance.

As The Jerusalem Post recently notes in a blunt editorial:

Stone-throwers are terrorists in every sense of the word, and they are out to cause harm—preferably fatal, if they ‘succeed’. Hurling rocks at moving vehicles is invariably an extreme act of malice aforethought. There are no pacifist and compassionate stoners. An act of intentional premeditated violence cannot be downplayed as nonviolent and trivialized as frivolous by harried law-enforcers, overworked prosecutors or aloof judges…The tendency internationally to often belittle the crime of stone-throwing and regard it as an expression of youthful exuberance, which is how the Arab communities which send out brainwashed youths to target Jewish traffic like to present things. Unthinkably, stoning Jews has become a popular sport which is glorified in Arab society as heroic…Attacks on innocent travelers mustn’t be belittled merely because the weapon of choice isn’t a firearm…Stones, rocks, blocks and boulders all kill… The very least the state and its legal establishment owe the public is basic protection. If this realization must be reinforced by legislation, so be it.”

In large part, the problem of ongoing stoning attacks in Jerusalem and its environs stems from Israel’s “clogged judicial system” to process cases, which means that offenders are getting negligible and ludicrously light punishments.

Back on September 18, Internal Security Minister Gilad Erdan proposed not to promote judges who routinely hand out light sentences on Palestinian stone-throwers, particularly young offenders.

That proposal came under severe criticism by Miriam Naor, Chief Justice of the Supreme Court, who deemed it “harmful to democracy.”

The proposal isn’t likely to go anywhere. PM Netanyahu has already rejected it.

Still, Erdan has a point.

The heaviest sentence meted out to a stone-thrower this year was only 22 months—and that was in a case where a baby was critically wounded.

And, according to Jerusalem’s mayor Nir Barkat, the judicial system “sometimes allows the guilty to go free…Throughout the last few years, even when police used to catch teenagers throwing stones, they were very, very quickly released by the courts. And so they gained confidence.”

Jerusalem residents have voiced similar complaints.

Some told reporters last week that in their neighborhoods they often see the same Palestinian teenagers throwing firebombs, getting arrested and being quickly freed, and returning only days later to attack them again.

Jerusalem Burning

Riots on Jerusalem’s Temple Mount—considered the holiest site in Judaism and the third most sacred for Muslims—are nothing new. But a recent deadly stone-throwing attack in the capital city makes it clear that new ways of dealing with this “growing epidemic” need to be found.

In an earlier post, we reported on the September 13 violent clashes between masked rioters and police on the Temple Mount.

As we documented, on the eve of Rosh Hashanah (the Jewish New Year)—one of the two holiest dates on the Jewish calendar—Israeli police responded to intelligence reports that a group of armed Palestinians were plotting to attack Jews visiting the site for the holiday.

The night prior, security forces found that he Temple Mount compound had been turned into a “warehouse of terror”. Pipe bombs, stones, and firecrackers had been stashed in the Al-Aqsa mosque.

In subsequent clashes, police were subject to barrages of rocks and petrol bombs.

The alleyways of the Old City turned violent for the remainder of the two-day holiday, with Palestinians attacking yeshiva (rabbinical) students on their way to the Kotel. A number of Border Police, hundreds of whom were deployed to restore calm to the city, were also wounded.

Alexander Levlovitz, a 64-year-old resident of Armon Hanatziv, a neighborhood in southeast Jerusalem where the Jews who drive there say that they’re “used to living in fear” from “constant nightly attacks” by stone-throwing Palestinian youth, was killed at the start of the holiday when his car was battered by a volley of rocks:

The stone throwers, who came from the Palestinian village of Sur Baher, attacked many other cars driving along the road connecting their village to the Jewish neighborhood of Armon Hanatziv. As rocks started raining down on him, Levlovitz lost control of his vehicle, crashed into an electrical pole and was killed. Two young family members in the car with him were injured.”

Alexander Levlovitz

In a violent escalation, riots involving hundreds of Palestinians armed with rocks, petrol bombs, and even open paint cans soon expanded to nearly all neighborhoods in east Jerusalem, damaging buses, homes, and the city’s light rail.

Hamas and other Palestinian groups called for a “day of rage” last Friday to coincide with weekly Muslim prayers—revenge for what they termed an “assault” on the mosque and Muslim worshippers.

This past weekend, Palestinian rock-throwers attacked an Israeli vehicle traveling between Tekoa and the southern Jerusalem neighborhood of Har Homa. A couple and their six-month old daughter were in the car. Ironically, according to media reports, they were driving to get their new car outfitted with shatter-proof windows when the attack occurred.

The car’s windows were smashed, but miraculously the parents and child were unhurt—a rock flew over the baby’s head but was stopped by the child’s car seat, according to the parents who described their ordeal.

The perpetrators are still at large.

But yesterday afternoon (EST), Israel’s media broke the news of the arrest of four Palestinians suspected in the murder of Alexander Levlovitz.

All four are reportedly between the ages of 16 and 19.

New Measures to Counter Rock-Throwing Terror

Thursday’s security cabinet decision, which relaxes existing open-fire protocols and stiffens penalties for offenders, was taken after a number of recent high-level emergency meetings and consultations between Israeli politicians, security experts, and legal officials looking for options to combat the wave of violence that’s engulfed Jerusalem and its roadways.

The re-examination of open-fire regulations convinced the security cabinet’s members that giving police officers a freer hand with live ammunition will both save lives and serve as a deterrent.

According to reports, the security cabinet agreed to back legislation to allow live ammunition in any instance in which lives are endangered; the use of .22 caliber Ruger rifles against rock-throwers; a minimum four-year prison sentence for rock-throwers and gasoline-bomb attackers over the age of 18, including jail-time and fines for minors aged 14-18; and the cancellation of National Insurance Institute welfare benefits for minors in prison.

These new rules of engagement, which were voted on despite the initial opposition of Attorney General Yehuda Weinstein, now authorize the police to use live-fire against people hurling stones and Molotov cocktails when the life of a civilian is threatened—and not only when a police officer’s life is in imminent danger.

Critics have countered that these eased open-fire restrictions will result in more bloodshed and escalate an already tense atmosphere. Israel’s former Shin Bet Chief, Yuval Diskin, said last week that the changed rules of engagement would “worsen the situation.”

Israel’s human rights organization B’Tselem has also condemned the decision, raising concerns over the potential for abuse.

In its statement, B’Tselem noted a number of cases in recent years where Israeli security forces have shot and killed Palestinians when they were no longer posing a mortal danger.

Now the organization thinks that trigger-happy police will also be shooting Jerusalemite Palestinians who’re just fleeing or walking away.

The IDF and police need to be held accountable and prosecuted for illegal actions, including the excessive use of live-fire.

But the reality is that in these instances thorough investigations are conducted. Soldiers, even high-ranking commanders as in one recent case, come under intense scrutiny when they fail to adhere to the rules of engagement.

That goes for the IDF troops who attacked AFP journalists in the West Bank on Friday too. An investigation is underway. But an army spokesman has already indicated that the troops who assaulted the two journalists “acted in an unauthorized manner and will face disciplinary measures.”

Investigations like this when regulations are contravened are the norm—not the exception. B’Tselem wants us to believe that in those instances when IDF troops act in ways that clearly violate approved protocols that they literally get away with murder. But that’s simply not the case.

Still, the security cabinet has recognized that changing the open-fire orders is no quick fix. Nor can they come at the expense of non-lethal measures.

In a controversial move, they’ve also called for an inquiry into the legal possibility of imposing minimum fines on the parents of rock-throwers aged 12-13, and requiring the parents of children under the age of 12 to post bonds for a year.

Conclusion

Israel’s security cabinet decision to modify open-fire rules against Palestinian rock and firebomb throwers in Jerusalem is the start of a new approach to the sustained Palestinian rioting that has plagued the capital city in recent years.

On Saturday Secretary General of the PLO and chief Palestinian negotiator Saeb Erekat denounced the move reportedly accusing Israel of continuing to:

incite against Palestinian lives, with a culture of hate that dehumanizes the whole nation…the new decision expands the level under which Palestinian demonstrators’ lives can be directly targeted…It [is] a mere pretext to justify the escalating crimes against the people of Palestine.”

Saeb Erekat (credit: ElderofZiyon)

Saeb Erekat (credit: ElderofZiyon)

Erekat also warned that he would report on the new change in policy to the International Criminal Court and called on the international community to take “effective and consequential measures in order to protect our people under occupation, and to end the Israeli government’s systematic oppressive policies and crimes committed against Palestinians on a daily basis.”

Palestinians are entitled to march and protest, and to exercise freedom of speech. But apparently for some bizarre reason Mr. Erekat thinks that this right includes lethal Molotov cocktail-throwing and wielding a deadly slingshot.

As noted in the security cabinet’s statement, the easing of live-fire regulations will apply only under specific circumstances where civilian lives are in imminent danger. Permission is only being granted in very limited instances and there’ll be “lots of restrictions”. Police won’t be allowed to use live-fire during mass demonstrations, for example.

Experts claim that permitting officers to shoot live, yet relatively weak, rounds from Ruger rifles offers a quick neutralizing response against stone-throwers and firebombers without being as “potentially deadly” as heavier weapons:

[Israeli] Central Command soldiers have been using low caliber Ruger rifles for a long time to deal with life-threatening rioters. These means are justified and proven methods of quelling very violent and dangerous incidents, and saving lives.”

But ending the surge of violent attacks on Jerusalem’s streets and roadways will take more than easing the rules governing the use of live-fire.

Israel will need to invest in new surveillance and advanced tracking software to “make charges stick” against stone and firebomb throwers.

The deployment of more uniformed and undercover police, and the use of “breathing checkpoints” (where residents can move in and out by car or foot, but are subject to searches) at the entrances and exits of Palestinian neighborhoods where armed gangs now come and go with impunity will also be required.

Other “stabilization efforts”, including “stepped up police presence and law enforcement and legislative changes to enact more severe punishment,” are also likely to prove effective.

As Kobi Michael and Oded Eran of Tel Aviv University’s Institute for National Security Studies (INSS) write in an insightful new paper, these measures can be combined with a “diplomatic and public relations effort to expose the true nature of the events on the Temple Mount to the international community, with an emphasis on the riots and violent confrontations aroused by Palestinian groups.”

Heavy fines for parents who fail in their responsibility to keep their children out of trouble and harm’s way and administrative detention for adult stone-throwers can also round out the mix of new initiatives.

These aren’t likely to be quick fixes. But half-measures are no longer working.

Credit: YNet News

Credit: YNet News

In a statement released on Friday, the Jerusalem Police said that they’ve arrested 137 suspected stone and Molotov cocktail throwing Palestinians in the eastern part of Jerusalem in the last ten days. Some 61 of the suspects are minors, according to the police.

Gidon, a 27-year-old from the Jerusalem neighborhood of Armon Hanatziv who requested that his last name not be published puts it well:

Listen, it doesn’t matter if a nine-year-old throws a rock at my head or a 20-year-old throws a rock at my head. It’s a physical threat to my life. It doesn’t matter which hand throws the rock. Anyone who tells you any differently has never had a rock thrown at their head.”

—————————-

Miriam F. Elman is an associate professor of political science at the Maxwell School of Citizenship & Public Affairs at Syracuse University. She is co-editor of the book, Jerusalem: Conflict and Collaboration in a Contested City, published last year by Syracuse University Press. She lived in Jerusalem from 1985-1990.

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Comments

Shoot em. They’ll stop soon enough.

Don’t shoot em. They’ll keep doing what they do.

This one is easy.

    Estragon in reply to Barry. | September 27, 2015 at 4:55 pm

    Rocks aren’t cream pies or rotten tomatoes. They are deadly missiles, a weapon used in cruel executions to this day in the barbaric world of islam.

    Yes, shoot them. If they twitch, shoot them again. Repeat as needed.

Yes, shoot them. Those who say no should imagine how they would feel if people started throwing rocks at their family.

“Rock throwing has killed many Israelis, but is shooting rock-throwers justified?”

Yep. Absolutely. Good and hard.

Stoning is an aggravated assault that can cause severe injury or death. Piling up stones or lighting a fire bomb, would seem to be acts in preparation to commit murder. It would seem to me that any person witnessing such acts would be justified by simple self-defense or defense of a third person in shooting the perpetrator dead, not just restricting shooting to specially armed police units.

To document the justification for shooting and to conclusively refute false claims, the police may want to mount video cameras on their .22 rifles.

Deadly force is justified against the potential of deadly force – ask a guy named Branca (he shows up here every now and then)….

And now for the snark. More sporting, respond with paint balls. There is a paint ball loaded with tear gas. Double your pleasure, double your fun….They become easy to identify with tears, a dye mark, and typically a good welp.

Dial it up, and freeze the paint ball.

“Rock throwing has killed many Israelis, but is shooting rock-throwers justified?”

Yes.

These angry Palestinian kids probably aren’t usually receiving direct orders to terrorize Jews. But they’re acting within an ideological environment that encourages and condones these attacks.

And so you get…Palestinian Lives Matter.

Yes.

Next question?

There are no easy answers here, or simple solutions.

There is a very easy answer, and it’s been obvious for the past 28 years: treat every Arab holding a rock or a firebomb, regardless of age or sex, as an enemy soldier in uniform on the battlefield, and shoot to kill. Once they know that they will be treated so, they’ll stop doing it.

Enemy soldiers are fair game even if they are not in the act of shooting; even if they pose no danger at all at the present moment, even if they are running away or asleep, they are to be killed. That’s the rule in any open war, and the same rule should be applied to this war.

And in war there is no effort at all to minimize enemy casualties. On the contrary, the number of enemy killed is proudly reported, and treated as a sign of victory to be celebrated. The same should apply here.

All of this has been painfully obvious since the “intifada” started in 1987, and if it had been applied on the first day there would have been 100 or 150 killed and it would have been over. Instead there’s been 28 years of war and thousands dead on both sides.

And all of this could have been implemented long ago, if not for the judicial coup that has taken over Israel’s government. The fact that the cabinet needed Weinstein’s permission says it all. No victory is possible for Israel until its elected government overthrows the dictatorship of the legal establishment, fires Weinstein and his entire brigade of “legal advisers” to each government department, and the judges who gave him this power. Naor calls it “harmful to democracy”? She and her fellow judges are the ones who have destroyed democracy in Israel, and they need to go. Appoint a new High Court with a democratic mandate, and new legal advisers whose role is merely to advise, not to dictate, as it is in every other democratic country.

And do the English language the courtesy of using the correct term for this office: Legal Adviser, or Office of Legal Counsel, or Solicitor General, not Attorney General, which in English means a politician, a minister in the government, in other words what in Hebrew is called שר המשפטים.

Shoot them and prepare for the usual sh*t storm of whining and carrying on. Oh well. A better solution would be to relocate all of them into Egypt or Jordan and let their security forces shoot those who won’t behave. Same amount of whining and carrying on, better long term results.

    Estragon in reply to DaMav. | September 27, 2015 at 5:08 pm

    The sh*t storm will go on no matter what. Egypt doesn’t want these violent criminals, and it was Jordan throwing the scum out – after years of the Kingdom caring for the refugees, they responded by becoming criminals to prey upon the loyal citizens and plot assassinations and coups.

    There is a good reason the Arab world doesn’t want the “Palestinians.” Nearly all the productive and law-abiding ones already relocated.

The Israelis need a Charles Napier.

Let the Palestinian youths have their rights of passage. It is our custom to shoot back at those who attack us with deadly weapons. Let us all act according to our national custom.

Rubber bullets. They are looking for justification to escalate

    redc1c4 in reply to rayc. | September 27, 2015 at 3:22 pm

    maybe not… the last civilized country to use rubber bullets as an interim alternative to deadly force caught hell for it…

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZdHI3LrAYiE

    Valerie in reply to rayc. | September 27, 2015 at 7:01 pm

    ” They are looking for justification to escalate ”

    That particular ship sailed years ago. They have already repeatedly shown that, when Israel refuses to give them reason to escalate, they will simply make something up. They do this to the extent of killing their own people, and blaming Israel for the “atrocity.”

    The kids-throwing-rocks meme is as false and deadly as the “unarmed child (Trayvon Martin) and “Hands up, don’t shoot” (Mike Brown) memes.

    Juba Doobai! in reply to rayc. | September 30, 2015 at 8:23 pm

    There is no escalation. There is just business as usual. “Look, said the tree, there’s a Jew hiding behind me; come and kill him!”

I can’t believe this. Israel is debating whether or not throwing or slinging rocks, the method by which David killed Goliath, deserves a deadly force response?

The Roman army recruited slingers from Crete and the Balearic islands precisely because stones and lead shot could kill beyond the range of archers. Actually a skilled individual slinger using lead shot was deadly out to 300 yards, which is essentially equal to a modern rifle in above average hands.

Throwing stones is also lethal. There are records of Gallic towns siding with one side or the other in Rome’s civil wars in hopes of currying favor with the side they calculated would come out on top. I believe it was either Polybius or Tacitus who observed that the Gauls didn’t have conventional arms but, “They were very good stone throwers.”

It’s deadly force. That’s why Iran and other Islamic theocracies use it as a method of execution.

That’s why the Palestinians are using it as a method of execution.

So to hell with them and the UN. Always respond to deadly force with deadly force.

to reiterate the above comments, thrown stones are potentially deadly force, and should be responded to with deadly force as well…

additionally, any marches, public displays, etc by HamAss Hezbullies, etc, should be treated as military targets, and be bombed or shelled at every opportunity.

“Death to Israel” or “Death to the Jews” should be treated as valid threats, and the speaker, whether a single person or a crowd, should be rendered harmless by the most expeditious manner available, be that sniper bullet, J-DAM, or cluster bomb/FAE.

they want war, so you might as well give it to them: the only solution to the “problem” they are interested in is a Final Solution.

Milhouse: Attorney General (Yehuda Weinstein), abbr. A-G, is the term used in all English language media, including Times of Israel, J. Post, AP, NYT etc. The Justice Minister is Ayelet Shaked. She had some choice words to say to A-G Weinstein last week, dismissing his objections: “the government’s legal advisor’s opinion is not binding”. She thanked him for his opinion, saying he has a “right and an obligation” to give it, but “At the end of the day, if something isn’t unconstitutional [in terms of the Basic Laws] it is the cabinet that decides whether to legislate or not”. So, yes, at the legislative level, the decision belongs to the cabinet ministers. Note however that Weinstein was supportive of the use of the Ruger rifle; his view is that this is a sufficient measure for the time being. Shaked is the minister pushing for fining parents of children under age 12 caught rock-throwing. The lawfulness of that proposed measure will now be further examined.

Shoot ’em, rinse, repeat.

Well I will say this, if I am out in public just minding my own business or doing my job and someone decides to pick up a rock and run towards me in an aggressive manner, then that someone should expect to catch a bullet in the arse.

Shoot them with rubber bullets, birdshot or rock salt.

Use a sabot round to get some range with too much spread.

Usually not mortal but it’ll hurt like a b!tch and give them something to remember next time they start.

    Milwaukee in reply to jakee308. | September 27, 2015 at 6:36 pm

    Wrong.

    The intention is great bodily harm or death while not claiming responsibility. One of the reasons for stoning as a punishment is that the whole village participates, but no one person is responsible. Firing squads have 1 live round and the rest blanks so the shooters don’t know in fact that they fired the fatal shot. Having minors throw rocks further muddies the waters, but still leaves the victim injured or dead.

    Hopefully jake308, you will never have anyone with murderous intent throwing rocks at you.

Israel needs to reform its rock control policy. Once you get the rocks off the street…

ScottTheEngineer | September 27, 2015 at 8:19 pm

Being stoned to death doesn’t sound as appealing as being Rocked to death.
I agree with whats posted above. Shoot a couple and it’ll stop. Tolerate it and it will get worse. Its stupid to give looters “space” they’ll only respond to outrageous force.

Of course once Israel finally decides to shoot a few of these rock throwing animals, THEN the international media will flood the zone and give us continuous coverage such as: “Today 3 Palestinian youths were shot and killed by IDF soldiers in Gaza as tensions mount in the occupied territories…”

    continuous coverage such as: “Today 3 Palestinian youths were shot and killed by IDF soldiers in Gaza…”

    Actually I expect it would read “3 unarmed Palestinian youths were shot…” Since they weren’t carrying guns, y’know.

Rock throwing should be responded to with rifle fire. Rifle fire should be responded to with machinegun and mortar fire. Mortar and rocket fire should be responded with massed artillery counterbattery fire or airstrikes. Pound them until they scream for peace at any price. Make that price steep.

Please allow me to point out there is a significant difference between being rocked and being stoned.

Of course you shoot them. You make one public announcement that you’ve changed policy effective tomorrow and then you follow it. Self defense is a universal right.

Throwing stones is attempted murder and justifies the use of lethal force to protect oneself or another. The fact that the attempted murderers are using inadequate weaponry either because they lack better or because this is better PR does not mean they aren’t trying to kill. This isn’t rocket science.

The Jews of Israel will get blamed whatever they do, so they might as well engage in self-defense. This also is not rocket science.

The best way to circumvent the evil of a judiciary that promotes felonious violence by issuing unjustly soft sentences is to kill the perpetrators in self defense. In a moral society the pro-crime judges would be dealt with, too.

A long time ago, right after the Kent State riots, John W. Campbell dedicated an editorial on how deadly thrown rocks can be.

He knew a fella who worked for the railroads, and on this particular day his friend was walking the line, inspecting a track in the wilderness, only to come upon a black bear with a bad attitude. BA Bear started shambling towards our hero, who played local league baseball as a pitcher. The ballast rocks on the track were close to baseball size, and this fellow had a wicked fastball. After a shot or two to the forehead, the bear was dead.

I’m afraid I don’t understand the alleged moral nuance here. The basic legal standard in the U.S. is that citizens or the police are allowed to use deadly force when their lives or the lives of others are threatened with imminent bodily harm. A rock is a projectile weapon that can easily cause severe injury or death, so, a person throwing rocks at moving cars is intending to cause severe injury and/or death by either hitting the occupants inside, or, distracting the driver and causing a collision, so, using dealy force to prevent such attacks is totally justified. It doesn’t matter whether the culprit is a teenager, “youth,” “kid,” etc.

“Rock throwing has killed many Israelis, but is shooting rock-throwers justified?”

To ask the question is to answer it, Miriam, unless you think Jewish lives don’t matter. I know not all Israelis are Jews, but the Islamic aggression is directed specifically at Jews. The existence of Israel, post-Holocaust, says Jewish lives do matter and must, therefore, be defended. The lack of defense against slaughter by stone (when your culture teaches stoning people to death, you tend to develop good and deliberate aim) is contrary to the raison d’être of Israel.

For those who would argue against shooting rock-throwers, women who have been stoned to death have no comment.

Miriam, smetimes I wonder about some of the “head in the sand” things you think and write. Things like, “These angry Palestinian kids probably aren’t usually receiving direct orders to terrorize Jews. But they’re acting within an ideological environment that encourages and condones these attacks” makes me wonder what world you’re living in and if you’re acquainted with the Koran in the world. The most direct orders to not just terrorize but to slaughter Jews and Christians are found in the Koran.

Do me a favor, please, Miriam. Take your head out of the sand and see these people as they are, as the Koran and the darkness of Islam has made them. There is no crime in telling it like it is, Miriam.

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