Republicans Risk Running Headlong Into The “Rally-Around” Trap
Team Trump tactically is conflating defending against the attacks on Trump with the necessity of having him be the nominee. That’s understandable as a campaign tactic, but there’s no reason Republican voters need to go along, at least not this early.
Donald Trump’s campaign and supporters are trying to kill Ron DeSantis’ campaign in the womb. It hasn’t been born, but since two days before the 2022 midterms Team Trump has been attacking DeSantis relentlessly, crudely, and falsely. But it didn’t work. While there was some movement in polling towards Trump, the attacks failed in the mission of prematurely knocking DeSantis out.
Then came Alvin Bragg. If Donald Trump becomes the Republican nominee, he has Alvin Bragg to thank for single-handedly making Trump a martyr, causing a substantial rally-around effect. It’s understandable and predictable. We’ve rallied-around Trump as a target, as has DeSantis. There is truth to the claim that Trump serves as a proxy for the way many of us are abused by institutional rot.
Even Jeb! is getting in on the act:
Bragg’s predecessor didn’t take up the case. The Justice Department didn’t take up the case. Bragg first said he would not take up the case. This is very political, not a matter of justice. In this case, let the jury be the voters.
— Jeb Bush (@JebBush) April 1, 2023
Two things, however, can be true at the same time: It’s possible to defend against Trump being targeted, but also to understand that a Trump general election candidacy is a likely disaster for Republicans.
With the benefit of hindsight, it’s clear that 2016 was a fluke. It was a unique confluence of a large anti-Hillary vote, Trump bringing new working class voters into the GOP, and a Democratic apparatus and media that did not take Trump seriously.
People tend to underestimate just how uniquely hated HRC was. Also, in 2016, iirc Trump was viewed as the more moderate candidate. He’s got a very different ideological profile now that further disrupts comparison.
— Matt Knee (@matt_knee) April 2, 2023
They didn’t make that mistake in 2020, or the 2022 midterms where Trump candidates did mediocre at best, and they won’t be asleep in 2024. That’s not to say that it is impossible for Trump to win a general election in 2024, but ignoring the problems in favor of rallying-around him could be electorally fatal.
Yet Team Trump tactically is conflating defending the attacks on Trump with the necessity of having him be the nominee. It’s understandable as a campaign tactic, but there’s no reason Republican voters need to go along, at least not this early. You can defend him and also recognize the risk of him being the nominee.
A poll just released by YouGov reflects the Trump surge post indictment:
A new Yahoo News/YouGov poll — one of the first conducted after former President Donald Trump was indicted Thursday for his role in paying hush money to a porn star — shows Trump surging to his largest-ever lead over Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis, his likely 2024 GOP primary challenger, as Republican voters rally around the only president in U.S. history to face criminal charges.
In the previous Yahoo News/YouGov survey, which was conducted less than two weeks ago, Trump (47%) led DeSantis (39%) by eight percentage points in a head-to-head matchup among registered voters who are Republicans or Republican-leaning independents. As recently as February, it was DeSantis who was narrowly ahead of Trump, 45% to 41%.
But the new, post-indictment poll suddenly finds Trump lapping DeSantis by 26 percentage points — 57% to 31% — in a one-on-one contest. The former president even attracts majority support (52%, up from 44% previously) when pitted against a wider, 10-candidate field of declared and potential GOP challengers, while DeSantis plummets to 21% (down from 28%).
No one else cracks double digits.
The Bragg-effect is clear in the YouGov chart, it’s where the lines sharply diverge:
That rally-around effect is being exploited by the Trump campaign — my text and email boxes have lit up with fundraising pitches centered around Trump as the victim. For the first time I saw on Tucker repeated anti-DeSantis advertisements by a pro-Trump PAC.
As a campaign tactic, I can’t blame them.
But that YouGov poll showed the downside of the rally-around rush. First, it may be fleeting:
The survey of 1,089 U.S. adults was conducted in the first 24 hours after a New York grand jury voted to indict Trump, as news about the case continued to break and sink in. For many respondents, the opinions expressed may be tentative and volatile — and some of the shifts evident in this immediate snapshot may be fleeting.
Just 34% of Americans, for instance, said they had heard “a lot” about “Donald Trump being indicted on Thursday in Manhattan” — a number that will rise in the coming days. And while the former president has reportedly been charged on more than two dozen counts, the public still doesn’t know what those charges are. They are likely to be unsealed when he is arraigned Tuesday in Manhattan….
So even though some pro-Trump respondents may have been especially eager to register their opposition to the indictment by expressing support for Trump, it’s far from clear that Trump’s legal woes will actually help him regain the Oval Office in 2024.
In fact, the latest Yahoo News/YouGov poll suggests the opposite may be possible. Most Americans, for instance, think Trump should not be allowed to serve a second term if he is “convicted of a crime in this case” (52%). Perhaps even more ominous for Trump is how few think he should be allowed to serve as president if found guilty: just 31%. Another 17% are unsure.
Second, it has not helped Trump versus Biden:
Meanwhile, the new survey shows no change at all in preferences for the general election, with President Biden maintaining the same two-point edge over Trump (45% to 43%) that he enjoyed in the previous Yahoo News/YouGov poll.
We don’t know how this will play out over the rest of the year. To annoint Trump at this early point would be suicidal as to chances of winning back the White House for Republicans.
The NY Times reports (and take it with a grain of salt):
His indictment is forcing Democrats to wrestle in public with thorny questions they have discussed privately for months. There is a broad consensus in the party, supported by ample polling, that the former president would be the easiest Republican rival for Mr. Biden to face next year, if he runs as expected.
Mr. Trump is saddled with legal problems, similarly aged and polarizing even within his own party, and his nomination would let Democrats and Mr. Biden use their 2020 playbook of running as the candidate of normal against a chaos agent.
The White House’s own polling backs up this theory. Surveys done for the White House in recent weeks found Mr. Biden in a more favorable position against Mr. Trump than he finished in 2020 in all of the closest battleground states.
The same polling showed Mr. Biden faring less well against Gov. Ron DeSantis of Florida, a likely contender for the Republican nomination, who has had a rocky rollout on the national stage and trails well behind Mr. Trump in national Republican primary polling. Yet a matchup between the president and the Florida governor is far more competitive, according to people familiar with the polling.
Yet those supposed Democrat insider polls also are reflected in public polling showing that DeSantis remains a better or at least equal general election candidate:
🇺🇲 2024 Presidential Election Poll
(R) DeSantis: 45%
(D) Biden: 45%(D) Biden: 47%
(R) Trump: 45%Trump performs 10 points worse than DeSantis among swing voters and 8 points worse among Independents @cygnal (A) | Mar 26-27 | 2,550 LV https://t.co/EikhS4MqMK pic.twitter.com/lZTV5yoYTB
— InteractivePolls (@IAPolls2022) April 2, 2023
Democrats have a long history of interfering in Republican primaries to promote the candidate they think will be weakest in the general election. Expect them to cheer on the rally-around effect – it’s where NeverTrump and OnlyTrump converge.
I agree that Democrats are probably celebrating the rally-around effect.
It’s true. The Trump indictment pretty much guarantees Biden gets re-elected. It means trump will get more support from the right, win the nomination, then lose independents again in the general. It’s unavoidable at this point. Sucks, but our side is too dumb to see it. https://t.co/sLUmVxg1Zp
— Aidan Kearney (@DoctorTurtleboy) April 2, 2023
It’s far from over. At the end of the day, I think a majority of Republicans vote for the person they think can win the general election. Team DeSantis likely understands that, and when the Bragg effect wanes, and DeSantis declares his candidacy, expect them to focus on that.
The people telling you the race already is over are afraid of the electability question and primaries, which is why they keep telling everyone it’s already over. They don’t believe what they are saying. If they really believed it was over, they wouldn’t keep attacking DeSantis while also expecting him to rally around Trump.
There is too much at stake to rush off the cliff. If Republican voters fall for it, they deserve what they get.
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“There is too much at stake to rush off the cliff. If Republican voters fall for it, they deserve what they get.”
People who have been involved in Republican politics all this time are in no place to say this since what we have been getting can be directly laid at your feet. Open Wars, abortion, homosexuality all up in our faces, busted up schools, Leftists always doing what they can to upend the Constitution, the list goes on. And where have all of you conservatives been?
Miss me with this nonsense article.
You say “you conservatives” as if you are not one. Or are you just the dutiful acolyte ready to lead (and by lead I mean follow) some kind of Puritanical cleanse fantasy of your whims?
Yeah, you, the rambling infantile narcissist blaming everyone else for not getting his way. You are the worst one of the cultist lot. You’ve already missed yourself with any semblance of intellect and farmed out your good sense years ago.
I blame Mitch McConnell for continuing to cave to whatever the Progressives want rather than his base.
Mitch McConnell’s “base” is his donors.
Here’s what I can not figure out: how does Kentucky keep electing McConnell and by HUGE margins when they also elect Rand Paul? Talk about apples and oranges. I’ve often wondered if there is some kind of McConnell machine reminiscent of the corrupt Harry Reid’s Nevada machine. He’s never sweat a race; he just glibly asserts he’ll win. And he does. I don’t get it. I mean Trump won Kentucky with 63% of the vote in 2020 and with 62.5% in 2016. How does a state that goes that hard for Trump continue to elect (again by staggering margins) Mitch freaking McConnell? It makes no sense to me. At all.
Incumbency confers a huge advantage. Rates of re-election are in excess of 95% and that’s the general election. Rarely is an incumbent defeated in a primary. The old adage about ‘if you strike at the King do not miss’ holds true.
Yeah, he really caved on the Garland SCOTUS nomination. I know it feels good to always fight fight fight, but fighting for fighting’s sake is dumb.
KY keeps electing McConnell, but they also elected Gov Bershear – a very partisan Democrat – who is up for reelection this year. KY isn’t the solid red state that most people think. A lot of voters have interests that aren’t exactly red meat for ideologues.
2 downvotes. Mitch fans aren’t happy.
The votes don’t matter unless you are just self-absorbed. They disappear in a week or two. Go back to old posts, the comments are there, but no votes. There is no reason to focus on trivia like this.
There’s a serial down-twinkler on LI
“You say “you conservatives” as if you are not one. ”
I have to say, this statement startled me.
The rest of your response was very disrespectful, healthguy.
This particular person has done the opposite of earn respect. He has earned disrespect, and I do not apologize for a thing I said about him. If you follow the history, you might know why.
You didn’t debunk a single thing Prof. Jacobson said but to get to your insane points.
1. So you have such a moral opposition to war do you? Did you oppose the military spending hikes of the Trump administration? Did you furthermore oppose the killing of a senior officer of the Iranian military in what was an overt act of war followed by refusing an Iraqi government request to leave Iraq (an act of hostility and clear violation of Iraqi sovereignty) and earlier in the administration did you oppose either the bombing of Syria or the completely unprovoked murder of Russian soldiers in Syria? You do realize if the answer to that is no it makes your fantasy about how you are fighting the evil pro-war Republican hypocritical at best. It is easy to oppose a war a decade after it ended, it is not so easy to oppose acts of aggression while they are popular (which I actually did) or be against militarization that has bipartisan support from all sectors of society (I thought the military spending hikes to have been absurd).
2. Abortion-If you missed the firm opposition the Republican Party and conservatives took to abortion and the fight that conservatives across society took against it you are nowhere near as smart as I assume you are. Tell me which states caused the end of Roe and which states are advancing pro-life laws that get us closer and closer to the end of the monstrosity? Is it NY VT and CA?
Homosexuality-For your sake I am going to pretend I didn’t see the satirical level of stupidity that you think homosexuality is a Republican plot.
On issues like CRT and connected issues, Gender Ideology, the massive decline in American education, freedom of speech, and freedom of religion Ron DeSantis is leading the fight.
So I have a question for all the anti-Trump folks on here.
What good have ANY of your candidates done? I see DeSantis as having a chance of being good, but do you honestly believe he’ll get anything done at a national level? He’ll get rolled just like any Republican candidate.
None of any of your preferred candidate or indeed already elected officials have done anything. Yet a you people act like they’re just fantastic. Well you are either stupid or lying. I’ll let you pick.
1. He will actually fill all positions and replace hostile office holders with ones friendly to his agenda resulting in the same anti-DEI actions in the federal government he took in Florida.
2. Reverse Biden’s pro-DEI agenda
3. Put the Department of Education on our side of DEI and Gender ideology
4. Work towards legislation against google and other leftist mega corporations control of the flow of speech and information in this country
5. Actually control the military instead of letting it go woke as Trump did.
6. Pass regulations protecting us from discrimination
7. Curtail the DOJ including the FBI.
8. Curtail the CIA
Ron DeSantis doesn’t empower his enemies with reckless statements, he does a good job winning people over to his point of view, and he has a great record on getting legislation, and he has a great record on turning small majorities into large ones.
If elected he will be a very strong president.
You are free to insult and lie like your idol Donald Trump but the legislative victories in Florida are what both fighting and winning looks like.
There’s a lot of hoping and wishing in that list Danny. DeathSantis hasn’t done any of those things at the national level and doing those things at the national level with departments entirely staffed by Democrats is very different from doing those things at the provincial level in departments made up of mostly willing staff.
And, Karl Rove is helping him pick those Administrators right now.
LOL, this is utter BS, and you (I would hope) know it. Why do you say things that are patently false? Do you imagine it helps Trump and/or hurts DeSantis? It doesn’t because the only people who would believe such a transparent lie are already so far down the Only Trump-DeSantis Derangement rabbit hole that the truth no longer even matters to them. Pathetic.
There is another factor which could make Trump a stronger general election candidate than DeSantis. Trump’s affiliation with the religious right was purely transactional, whereas DeSantis is really anti-abortion. But abortion is popular in the country as a whole. If Trump pledges to veto any federal legislation banning abortion nationwide he would be believable, but no other Republican would be. Trump and Mitch may have got Roe v Wade overturned, but Trump is not the kind of guy who would actually want a nationwide abortion ban.
Mew Cat,
That is a good observation about abortion in general. Frankly I would expect DeSantis to avoid that trap as well by arguing for virtues of Federalism. Especially when he has used that power to chart a different course for his State.
If CA wants X policy that’s up to CA, equally if Alabama wants Z policy that’s up to Alabama. Ending the foolish, narrow minded demand to impose one size fits all nationalization of every issue is a far better idea than handing power to make those decisions to the DC establishment.
So if a state wants to reintroduce slavery, you’d be OK with repealing the 13th amendment to allow it?!
For someone who really does believe that abortion is murder, and millions of abortions is a holocaust (and thus many times worse than slavery), if there is a realistic chance of shutting it down nationwide how can he turn it down in the name of federalism?
If there is no realistic chance of doing it anyway, then championing federalism is good politics. But only someone who doesn’t actually believe in the anti-abortion cause could plausibly promise to veto a national ban even if one were to pass, and even if it looked like it would otherwise stick.
The point is not being “anti-Trump”.
It is being realistic, having an open mind, and understanding that all the candidates haven’t even announced yet, the primaries are 14-18 months away, and the election is 22 months from now. There is much to discuss.
Instantly attacking any other potential Rep candidate because TRUMP! rather than discussing the options, as compared to inventing shit to throw at them, does nobody any good and spreads hate and discontent amongst allies.
If you are a rusted-on, cemented in, voter for Trump then good for you.
Attacking and insulting other potential voters for Trump isn’t a likely to gain you any votes but it may turn them away.
They are simply following their leader.
I’m not anti-Trump. I am pro winning elections. As much as I like Trump, he has too much baggage with people we need to convince for us to win.
Rabid Trump supporters have to stop thinking of it as anti Trump and start thinking of winning. How many votes cana candidate get from those who do not identify as conservatives? That’s the question.
So far, Trump hasn’t given an answer that shows me he can get those votes.
The libs will foist baggage on DeSantis. I talk with L.A. liberals and they say blithely say, “Well, DeSantis is racist and anti-gay.”
They will foist, and DeSantis will do what he always does when they try that here in Florida: come out swinging with ALL the receipts. He’s really good at it, too, by the way: https://nypost.com/2023/03/08/desantis-plays-graphic-video-of-pornographic-books-found-in-florida-schools/
He did this during the covid craze, too, came out with pressers detailing hard facts that refuted what was coming out of Fauci/Birx and the CDC. Here in Free Florida, we know that DeSantis can not only take the heat but bundle it up and pitch it right back at the foisters. ;P
This has been my message from the moment that Trump went after DeSantis even before he decided to run. Why? I understand fear but most of us have been raised with fair play as a built-in genetic code and Trump violates that almost daily. Why? Why have the Trump worshipers condoned this terrible policy? It’s fine to love and want your guy to win but why insult and demean a fellow Republican? What if something does happen to Trump such as a medical or legal issue preventing him from running and you MAGAs have crushed the only viable candidate we have left? What is your position then? “Oh well, my guy isn’t in it so I don’t give a siht what happens to our country”. Is that going to be your position?
Yeah, he really caved on the Garland SCOTUS nomination. I know it feels good to always fight fight fight, but fighting for fighting’s sake is dumb.
The only polls on the election of President that count are the some of electoral votes state by state especially the pivotal states. A national poll makes no sense. The president is elected by electors not popular vote
That is true. And a Joe Manchin independent candidacy would change the electoral calculus considerably.
Yeah. It would. Let’s just hope he doesn’t know it.
He won’t know it unless he’s paid to know it.
I wouldn’t underestimate a Manchin ( I ) presidential bid. He isn’t going to run as a spoiler – he will run to win. He has to know he will never win 270 EV outright against a (D) and an (R). Therefore, his only viable strategy must be to (1) win enough states to throw the election into the House, and (2) run or back House candidates in strategically picked districts that will allow his new Party to control the balance of power in a few State delegations. Remember, when the House picks a President, you need 26 States to win. His plan has to be to become the “compromise” candidate who becomes viable after multiple ballots in which the D and the R fail to get 26 States. This procedure was last done about 200 years ago.
The R’s currently control 26 State delegations – just enough if all R’s vote for the R candidate, and there is no telling what the balance will be in the next House in 2025.
These are what we call the small c conservatives. They pretend they are conservatives. The huff and puff like they are conservatives. Yet the accept abortion and having Democrats decide who they can vote for and they do that all with a smile.
It’s Trump or bust
So “Bust” is your answer if Trump isn’t the nominee? Why not join the DNC and help them out?
Just have to join in with any RINO to do that.
Trump performs 10 points worse than DeSantis among swing voters and 8 points worse among Independents. That pretty much says it all.
This was the key takeaway for me, too. Trump may win the GOP primary, but there is no way he wins the general. Meanwhile, another possible candidate does have a shot at winning it.
Of course, Trump can’t win… for the same reason DeSantis can’t win. For the same reason any other candidate but the chosen Dem candidate can’t win. 2024 will verify that. The only scenario for a GOP win is that the country is in impending collapse and the Dems… after collapsing it will step aside and let the GOP Prez take the hit.
I think the financial disaster will start accelerating before the 2024 election. A stagflationary recession.
Pointless….look how far we are from the election. Get back to me in Sept.2024.
I just can’t believe the level of indifference towards winning that the Trump-loyalists have. He has zero shot of winning a general election, zero. It’s hard to argue against it being a cult with the amount of ignoring reality that’s going on.
Is there a translation available for this comment?
Great observations, Prof J!
Look out….incoming from the cultists in 3..2…oh nvm they are already in with their cognitive reflexive hisses.
And you wonder why there is a division in our ranks??
We know that is exactly how the Republican in office feel about us too. It’s quite obvious.
Yeah, it couldn’t possibly be the Only Trumpers shrieking daily that anyone not on board the Trump Train 3.0 is a:
Marxist
Globalist
RINO
GOPe
Traitor
Disloyal Trump-hater
Stupid, ignorant, [insert similar term for lacking intelligence]
Out of touch
Never Trumper (including, of course, those of us who voted for him TWICE and wrote reams defending him throughout his entire presidency and beyond)
oh, and a RINO globalist neocon Marxist sell-out.
Nope, none of that is the least bit divisive.
I’m pretty sure there’s enough blame to go around if you read our comment section. BOTH “sides” are rather vile (and yes, I am including me, I can be very biting when called these names unfairly or lumped in with the Lincoln Project and other assorted anti-America, unAmerican grifters).
I see it on the Trump-skeptical side, do YOU see it on the Only Trump side? This comment makes me think you don’t. I would like to be wrong about that. 🙂
You are just about the most vile, single-minded NeverTrumper here. People like you who call the most innocent man on earth and most effective and consequential conservative president in our history should be required to take a competency test. Infantile.
Hilarious considering I voted for him twice.
Trump is not the most innocent man on earth…that is also laughable.
He is innocent of the bullshit he is being charged with, but he is not an innocent little lamb. Please get off your hero worship and quit crying.
“Trump bringing new working class voters into the GOP.”
Keep in mind those voters will leave the GOP should the GOP choose another disingenuous candidate, and the GOP can’t win without those voters. Not unless you make a deal with the green hairs.
As for 2020. Look at the unprecedented efforts to dethrone Trump, including two impeachments, both based on largely false accusations,
As for 2022, it was largely a result of the GOP undermining Trump candidates. Guess what those Trump candidates they undercut, will run again and win primaries, or a different Trump candidate will win those primaries. Why because the people like the Trump candidates.
People the GOP needs will not vote for disingenuous candidates, and Ron DeSantis feels disingenuous.
Trump for all his foibles and flaws is not disingenuous.
What we see is a New Yorker of the 80s.
The only other politicians I see that are that way are RandPaul, (and I’ve added two to my list though they are not going to be 2024 candidates ) Sarah Huckabee-Sanders and Kari Lake.
Four final points. Trump is just Ross Perot 2.0, but a saner and more volatile version.
LI is going down the same rabbit hole. that it did in 2016.Repeating the same mistakes. Back then Trump won in spite of them.
The establishment GOP treats populists the same way the Dems treat blacks. The difference is that the populists won’t stay on the plantation like blacks tend to do. The populists won’t hold their noses and vote for someone they don’t like.
Keep in mind that in the primaries every person who votes for Trump is a person who will not vote for DeSantis in the general election.
Mitt Romney won the white working class be a very significant margin. Trump just accelerated an already existing trend.
Furthermore Trump’s white working class share of the vote went down a great deal for the 2020 election which is why he lost.
“Mitt Romney won the white working class” Haha,
I can believe someone would bring Mittens up in this discussion. Next thing will be maybe we should be voting for Mittens buddy Egghead..
You mean you are offended that someone brought up reality that debunks your mythology.
The myth is that white working class voters uniquely boarded the Trump train.
The reality is that the Republican Party has been improving with white working class voters for decades and that Trump wasn’t just not the first person to win their votes they literally voted Republican the election cycle before and frankly from the study
“Most white working-class voters cast their ballots for Trump in 2016 and 2020. But most also cast ballots for Mitt Romney in 2012, George W. Bush in 2004, George H.W. Bush in 1988 and Ronald Reagan in 1980 and 1984. Other reliable data sources suggest most also voted for John McCain in 2008.”
If you have proof Obama won the white working class voter besides being personally offended by the assault on your princes majesty make with the proof.
I know, ridiculous, the white working class did NOT come out to vote for Romney, they simply did not come out to vote
Period
Until Trump
And then, and now, that’s who they will vote for
Period….
I’m sorry but you are just wrong
https://www.vanderbilt.edu/unity/2021/04/15/trump-didnt-bring-white-working-class-voters-to-the-republican-party-he-kept-them-away/
White Working Class voters did come out for Mitt Romney.
The issue Romney faced is the white working class portion of the electorate shrank.
You are just refusing to accept results of elections that contradict your narrative.
https://www.vanderbilt.edu/unity/2021/04/15/trump-didnt-bring-white-working-class-voters-to-the-republican-party-he-kept-them-away/
“Among GOP voters, working-class Whites make up the same percentage they did in 2012
If we define the working class this way, there’s no real evidence the Trump era changed the demographic makeup of GOP voters. At least since the 1980s, White working-class Americans have never made up a majority of Republican voters in presidential elections. The share of Republicans who are white and working class has increased slightly in the past few election cycles, but not under Trump. The biggest single-year increase in the white working-class’s share of GOP voters came in 2012, when Mitt Romney was the party’s nominee. Since Romney, the share of white working-class people among GOP voters hasn’t budged. Lower-income white voters without college degrees aren’t a majority of Republican voters, and they aren’t increasing as a share of GOP voters.”
Also interesting from the article
“Contrary to the idea that Trump rearranged the political landscape, white working-class support for Republican presidential candidates has been slowly increasing since 1992.”
You are entitled to what you want to take away from what happens in this world but you are not entitled to your own alternative reality.
I proved my position easily because it actually was reality now lets see you prove yours.
Lets see you prove Obama won the white working class in 2012.
There is an Italian proverb that laughter is the language of a fool.
I think that proverb definitely applies to somebody who laughs at something that could easily be proven correct wouldn’t you agree?
Sorry, meant to upvote Danny.
“There is an Italian proverb that laughter is the language of a fool.” Good point… look who laughs…Hillary and Harris.
“Keep in mind that in the primaries every person who votes for Trump is a person who will not vote for DeSantis in the general election.”
I hope that is not true. Similarly, I hope if Trump wins the nomination that DeSantis voters back Trump in the general election. I hope all Republicans have learned that withholding their votes is just plain dangerous.
That should have been,
I hope all Republicans and conservatives have learned that withholding their votes is just plain dangerous.
Keep in mind that those making those claims are the ones who will never ever accept Trump as the candidate. The hate is going only one way in this debate. It has been very revealing to observe how quickly DeSantis ditched his support of Trump as soon as Trump secured his victories. People are glossing over that as if it doesn’t matter.
I have given up on Republicans and I don’t know what “conservatives” are anymore. It’s like asking people to explain what constitutes being a libertarian (long delay followed by a couple of “duhs” and ending with “socially liberal but economically conservative”). That is why I have only made 2 exceptions to being an unaffiliated independent (Reagan and Trump). It offers a more solid base for arguing by constitutionalism and “both” parties have to beg me to vote for them.
Phil, no one talks about DeSantis “ditching his support for Trump” because it never happened. Trump is the one who turned on DeSantis when DeSantis bucked the Trump admin (led by Fauci and Birx) on covid.
Besides, it was DeSantis–who was in the U.S. House of Representatives at the time–who threw HIS support behind Trump when Trump won the 2016 GOP nomination, and the party was fracturing. DeSantis called on the GOP to unify behind Trump as the candidate and to stop the circular firing squad. If anything, Trump OWED DeSantis his support in 2018 as a result, though I somehow doubt DeSantis is that petty and keeping score. Tiny little men do that, not mature adults fit to lead this great nation.
It’s like you have a different fact book than everyone else because your assumptions are so wrong. Many of us will “Accept” Trump as our candidate if he wins the nomination. The issue is will the Trump supporters do the same if he DOESN”T win the nomination? Forget all the names groups have and just do what we all did when Hillary was running and that was to vote against her. No matter your mantel, vote against any Democrat or we all perish.
Phil, will you accept DeSantis when he is nominated as the GOP candidate?
“Keep in mind that in the primaries every person who votes for Trump is a person who will not vote for DeSantis in the general election.”
If you think this then you are a stupid unpardonable fool. Doesn’t our country rate a little higher than Trump? That is the stupidest statement I’ve ever read on this site. If you and your ilk think this way say hello to four more years of destruction of our country by Biden and his thugs.
That’s what they actually want, it seems. They want to burn it all down, anarchist style. No different than Bernie Bros, really.
In fact, Trump is kind of the Bernie of the GOP. He has a good-sized and extremely loyal following, and he has a seat at the table as a result. But he, and they, are never going to be allowed anywhere near actual power (in Trump’s case, again. Even he acknowledges that he “got them by surprise” in 2016.).
Ridiculous. What did Sanders ever build? You are projecting your wish. Remember Obama dropping the mike?
If DeSantis wins, we shall see.
“Doesn’t our country rate a little higher than Trump?”
Show me someone who is really higher than Trump and I will vote for him.
Don’t try to pawn off trash on me though.
Literally every other Republican because they could actually win elections.
But gigantic compared to Trump are Republicans who actually get results like Ron DeSantis does.
Well they haven’t been winning recently.
Well, not every Republican can win the GOP nomination (which is based on primaries) and not every GOP primary winner can win the general (which is based on the EC). It’s a fine line to walk, and Trump cannot do it in 2024.
Asa Hutchinson for the 2024 win!!!
It’s not someone, it is your f-king country! Do you really think that we can survive four more years of the scum running our country now? I’ll take a RINO before Biden any day. It’s like you are in a burning plane and won’t bail out unless you have a reserve chute. Go ahead and burn baby, the rest of us are jumping with the only chute we have.
“”Trump is just Ross Perot 2.0″”
Yeah, I couldn’t agree more – but Perot’s intent and purpose was to destroy the GOP and elect Clinton. He was half successful.
The Dems are proving that they can prosecute/persecute any of their real or perceived political enemies.
I am reminded of a famous statement from revolutionary war day “we can either hang together or hang separately”.
If the sane voters throw Trump to the wolves they may not be next, but they will very soon have to bow down before the ruling class repeatedly to avoid their turn for punishment.
So far polling shows Trump is so unpopular you are more likely to find a backer of Alvin Bragg than Donald Trump.
I wonder if Trump is the nominee and then manages to win the White House, who would work for him? Who would be willing to withstand the kind of Senate confirmation process he will be subjected to? Probably no one we would like to see as it would likely be a RINO squish who probably would like to please the ruling class as opposed to Trump and his voters.
I think that same consideration applies to any Republican president from here on, no matter who it is. It was already the case to a large extent, but now it will be many times as intense and vicious. Remember, every Republican presidential candidate has been dumb, and Literally Hitler™, no matter how the news industry fawned on him earlier.
Trump going up against Biden, outside the basement this time and having to defend his lies and disasters, the largest of which would not have occurred under Trump, may not bring forth the lopsided win for Biden some anticipate. Not only can Trump make an excellent comparison, the fact is that he grew his support in 2020.
Trump is as likely the present target of Democrats and Never Republicans to keep him from running, not the other way around, and the persecution of Trump, as it plays out, may mean more to people, inlcuding independents, than realized. Frustration of people with the direction we are going means something, and it’s Biden that drove into the ditch, largely by reversing policies that worked under Trump.
There is nothing inappropriate with throwing support based on the latest events, and the principles they represent. People have their reasons, and it’s not like anyone quit the race or changed unless so inclined. It may be a mistake, however, to imagine Biden now as Biden will be, or the Democrats for that matter, as their antics are finally exposed. The unknown awaits and will happen in spite of punditry. Things do appear on the brink.
If the sup[posed Ukraine offensive fails, Biden will effectively running as the first president to have lost two wars in one term ( also two terms ).
The economy is more of a concern for Biden. We could have a severe recession in a presidential election year for the first time since 2008.
You keep saying “When the Democrats are exposed”. By whom? The msm will never print/air any such message and that is what we have to live with. Trump’s “Message” won’t get out except here and FNC/NewsMax. Biden’s daily lies are never corrected or pointed out by the msm. No one will be “Exposed”. Trump, if elected, will be a total lame duck not only by the Dems but his own party. No one will stick their political necks out to support him. Can’t any of you see this? He’ll be on the nightly news calling everybody names and ranting and carrying on. In the meantime, nothing good will get done. Four more years of our country being ignored by both parties.
There have been multiple hearings concerning Biden’s corruption, the weaponization of government, covid, etc. And there will be more that is exposed. But why bother? So many already know what will happen. But do they really?
We all know what will happen and as Rush used to say, zero, zip, nada. With the human lizard Garland as AG there will never be anything done to a high-ranking Dem while he is in office. The House committees mean absolutely nothing except fodder for conservative websites and the two TV channels. This is why every vote for whoever the R nominee is, is so critical. Remember when the Evangelicals were not that happy with some of our nominees? Their votes were absolutely critical and when they were denied, the outcome was horrible. It’s been almost four years since Hunter’s laptop has been made public and how many cases have been indicted against him? Do not expect any indictments against any Democrat under Garland.
But we don’t know what will happen. That is the point. Look at all the unanticipated events and changes that habe taken place. Yes, we are under bombardment by the powers that be. But trust in them is at or neras an all-time low. Got to keep the faith.
Why not pick someone who doesn’t have baggage and who Americans have not decided they hated already?
Most Americans don’t like Trump, winning them over to voting Trump is the same problem as winning over the residents of a blue state to voting the red team in general.
You might as well plan Trump’s victory in New York and Vermont if you are planning on Trump winning again.
Famous last words.
Danny, I would like to agree with you but if Trump is our nominee then we should all support him. I agree that he is not bringing any new voters to the party and he is a very polarizing figure but it is what it is. We are on the USS Titanic and no matter who we support as our captain, we are trying to miss the Democrat iceberg ahead.
I will support and vote for whoever the Republican Nominee is.
However think about it this way if you had figured out Titanic was in a Cold Water Mirage you would have told the captain immediately to get the ship stopped right?
Have the Left ever been damaged with a rally around trap? Right now they rally around those involved with the disasters of Covid, vaccinations, Afghanistan , Benghazi, open borders and more…. where is the damage to them? Maybe there is a danger to not rally-around? Right now, watching and waiting is all that can be done until starting Tuesday. But I think we should open up an office pool on how long the jury deliberates before convicting Trump. A pool for how long an appeal takes. A pool of whether this even gets resolved until one week before election. This is NYC, This is New York state. This is One Party Rule.
A hung jury is a possible outcome, and would only add to the drama.
Bob, you are right and this is the strategy of the Dems. There are four more indictments waiting if this one fails. The left knows that the msm and the general public will not blame them for any of this evil. Just look at the Russian hoax for guidance for blame after it was exposed. There was NONE! The DoJ, FBI, NSA, CIA, FISA, State, DNC, Hillary, and not one of them was ever charged or punished in any way for this terrible crime. There will be no justice for Trump ever in this country as long as the msm and Democrats rule.
You do realize that the reaction by the left to Bernie Sanders an unpopular socialist doing well in a split primary with a plurality was to remove all non-Biden options to Bernie Sanders.
So yes the left does exactly what you claimed it doesn’t.
The rally around the leader thing to do would have been to react to unfair attacks on Bernie Sanders by backing him they did the opposite.
Heh, not sure there were any unfair attacks on Bernie. He’s a commie (of the Stalinist variety) lunatic who has been trying to destroy American for the better part of a century. That said, he could never win a general election, even though the Democrat base wanted him as their nominee, so they stole the nomination from him. Not once, but twice. And the Bernie Bros were plenty ticked off, so they voted for Trump in 2016 (the first steal of Bernie’s nomination in favor of the much-hated Hillary) or stayed home. This is all well-documented, and we’ve posted about it here at LI.
Correct… the voice of the people was crushed in the back room. Dem elite select the candidate and all the voters really do is confirm the choice…just as in the Soviet Union. Bernie was a legitimate candidate that represents the new core Dems. With the Dems it is Menshevik v. Bolshevik (little versus big).
By unfair attacks I was referring to the he is an ist phobe etc attack at the last minute when he was gaining steam.
By the standards of the Republican Party changing rules or getting people out to make sure he didn’t win is rigging.
However out of the two major parties the Republican Party is the outlier in the western world for not having a set of people able to do that.
If Bernie Sanders had been running in Europe the same thing would have happened.
It isn’t fair but then again capitalists generally don’t like a communist takeover of their party.
Pretty sad article to read professor. I didn’t know about this blog in 2016, I’ve been here a few years, maybe 4 or so, not sure, didn’t know it was a full anti Trump blog… very sad
And very wrong.
After everything President Trump tried to do for us , and in fact had many successes, despite all the incredible lies and millions spent trying to pin urinating Russian prostitutes, abusive phone calls and Jan 6 so called riots, the DOJ, FBI, CIA, Globalists , Democrats, RINOs, Media/Entertainment , 5 Eyes, etc .. The actual stealing of his Presidency in 2022, he still has the courage to fight for us.. for us…
Now he has ridiculous indictments in NY of course, and THIS is what you choose to write?
Cold, just cold and wrong on every level
DeSantis has been running a shadow campaign since 2021, that’s very clear… it’s also clear he voted in the Congress very much like a RINO, said he admired and wanted to emulate Paul freaken Ryan and has hired a Rino cartel of who’s who…his money mainly from the big Rino crowd
Trumps is from the working class, that’s people like me
DeSantis will turn his back to the highest bidder, that much is clear
It’s Trump 2024 or nobody
I was here for 2016… SMH. I understand that the Professor is not a Trump fan.. I am sure he has great reasons.. and this is his house. I really dislike seeing the term cultists thrown around willy nilly.. I hated the ad hominem attacks then.. I hate them now. Sad and distasteful.
Respectable people just don’t “get” deplorable people.
I don’t understand the MAGA crowd I voted for Trump twice and will again but the man is terribly flawed. He cannot do the things he claims he wants to do without Congress yet he insults them almost daily. Then there is the MAGA crowd that states Trump or I won’t vote. Where are the patriots in this crowd? Is your country not more important than one man? Why insult anyone who is trying to overthrow biden and aoc, schumer, pelosi, waters, schiff, swalwell, and any of the scum now in office? (No caps for the scum).
Nothing “sad” about it at all. I voted for Trump twice and killed myself knocking on doors for him in the fall of 2020 in Luzerne County, PA. Also knocked on doors for his chosen candidate, Mehmet OZ, last fall (Got yelled at by Republicans who were not voting for him.)
I am DONE with the out of control, bizarre behavior; the petty narcissistic self centered, rants.
I will be voting for the measured, disciplined DeSantis.
Trump is too old, too toxic and will never be able to win a general election gain
DeSantis by the way, was born to working class parents. His father was a Nielsen TV box installer and his mother was a critical care nurse. Unlike Trump he wasn’t born with a silver spoon in his mouth or given a million dollars by his father when he started out in life. Worked his way through Yale, on a scholarship.
He will “retire” a very rich man, just like Obama…
Extremely childish and silly for you to say “Trump or nobody.” You’re not thinking tactically for the General. Trump would be a galvanizing Get out the Vote for Dems. He won’t get any Independents, Moderates or Dems. He’s lost a slew of two time Trump voters like me who are not rabid MAGAs.
He is way too old, is out of control verbally and emotionally and has become more toxic. Also concerning is his dangerous weight gain in recent months. He is one step away from a heart attack or stroke.
It’s extremely childish and silly to call people with different opinions than you a cult, when we are supposed to be on the same side. But here we are.
This comment would make sense if Mercy actually said that, but she did not. Why are you misrepresenting what she said?
Here’s the problem that I am seeing: if one supposed “pro-DeSantis” commenter says something, you Only Trumpers paint everyone with that same broad brush. That is intellectually dishonest and morally wrong. If you can’t refute her points (i.e. what she actually wrote, not what you imagine in your fevered Only Trump dreams), just don’t comment. Better not to say anything than to outright lie when we can all see what she wrote. You look like a liar here, and that’s probably not the look you were going for.
Pretty Extreme and silly to say NO TRUMP ever….What will YOU do if he wins the nomination?
Nope, I voted for every loser Republican, I’m only proud of my votes for Trump
The RINOs are worse because at least with the set, you know where the knife will be shoved
Trump is NOT from the working class; he has born wealthy.
It is DeSantis who is from the working class. Do your homework
She didn’t say Trump was from the working class, she said Trump’s money is from the working class. To which I would say yeah, because he’s a con man and a grifter, and has been ripping off the working class for decades. But not really. The bulk of his money in his election campaigns came from the rich, just like the bulk of everyone else’s money.
I see. I missed the “s” after Trump in that original post, although there was no apostrophe
“didn’t know it was a full anti Trump blog” – You insist on absolute fealty to the man, and anyone who deviates is an “anti-Trump” heretic. It’s a religious fervor in which you allow for no disagreement or other viewpoints, and like a small number of other commenters here have totally bought into the paranoia about DeSantis spread at conspiracy websites and by Trump social media influencers. They are selling you out for their own self-aggrandizement. I think almost all DeSantis supporters would support Trump if he becomes the nominee, but the opposite is not true. Your “Trump 2024 or nobody” isn’t going to intimidate anyone, but it is really destructive.
If you think almost all DeSantis supporters would support Trump were he to win the nomination, why don’t they say so? The hate is coming almost exclusively from the DeSantis Republicans.
And if we are ever going to have an intelligent discussion here about Trump, most people here have to ditch the Republican vs Democrat dynamic. We are engaged in a global struggle that is well-funded and organized globally and has captured both wings of the Uniparty. Why is that?
I will continue to repeat this until people’s heads explode if I have to but there is a “big discussion” going on in the world right now and almost no one here is engaging in it. Nor is there any indication that any are even aware of it. Most everyone here is stuck in their comfortable echo chambers and running around and around in their mazes like lab mice repeating the same arguments over and over again. The reason the DeSantis arguments are not resonating are many but it mostly that he is not engaged in that discussion. Those of us who are actually framing Trump in the global context are arguing to people who are just impervious to anything that violates the peace and quiet of their personal echo chambers.
Is anyone here ready or even interested to have the “big global conversation” or is everyone stuck in their provincial mazes? America is NOT the middle kingdom. There is a big world out there and that is where the answers to everyone’s frustrations will be found. We are collapsing to globalism and here in America, the dirty money is organized to convince us to vote for it while Europeans are out in the street fighting. I am not arguing for street violence but if we can’t even engage in the discussion, what’s the point?
That’s why I prep. I have little faith left in Americans doing the right thing. Our Greatest Generation died and took America with them.
Just stop, Phil. Please. You sound a big unhinged.
Pot talking to kettle.
You wrote a whole article about how the indictments were imaginary or something. This is a perfect example of how LI has split into camps..
Actually, no, I did not. I knew that the Grand Jury was seated (the one in NY) back in January, that Bragg had run on prosecuting Trump, and that it was extremely likely they’d vote to convict. Everyone knew that. Except all the Only Trumpers who apparently had no clue at all until Trump’s announcements. Which brings me to my post: it was about Trump lying about being “arrested on Tuesday” and calling on his minions to “PROTEST PROTEST PROTEST.”
Clearly, you did not read what I wrote or that I was quoting Trump’s own lawyer. You can gripe about things I actually write all you want, but I would appreciate your sticking to my actual words and not inventing things that fit your narrative. Not too much to ask, one would hope.
Tell that to the former Republicans like Bill Krystal and his ilk.
That was for the comment that DeSantis voters would vote for Trump, when in 2020 many Republicans voted for Biden instead of Trump.
Wendy: You’d have to source that claim. Trump drew far more voters in 2020 than in 2016. I haven’t seen any real evidence of significant numbers of Republicans voting for Biden.
Here you go texvet2!!
https://www.cnn.com/2020/08/18/politics/republicans-supporting-biden/index.html
CNN???
Huh?! There is nothing in that article that would give any support to your claim that significant numbers of Republicans voted for Biden.
“”If you think almost all DeSantis supporters would support Trump were he to win the nomination, why don’t they say so?””
Many of them have, right here. OTOH, virtually every Trump “supporter” here, including you, has declared that they won’t vote for anyone else if Trump loses the nomination.
“” The hate is coming almost exclusively from the DeSantis Republicans. “”
Once again, a bald-faced lie. This whole Trump vs. DeSantis thing was started by Trump supporters last year, despite the fact that virtually everybody here rallied behind Trump after the MEL raid, and it hasn’t let up.
Trump supporters are all of a kind: You intend to bully everybody else into allowing Trump to be installed as the nominee, with the expectation (which you have explicitly stated) that everybody else will be forced to vote for him, even as “LOTE” (once again, your term).
Do I refer to you as cultists? You bet. If you don’t like it, don’t act like it.
Really smart tactic to completely ignore the actual opposition (Democrats) and fight out the primary.
That’s like putting everything out to win the conference championship and ignoring the final. Pure stupid.
We are in uncharted waters. No one knows what is going to happen, though one would never know from reading some comments. As such, what DeSantis or Trump voters will do in the end is not at all certain.
As for interactions between commenters, it goes both ways. Paranoia spread about Trump at conspiracy websites is legend, and DeSantis social media influencers have continued in this vein. Not all, of course, but look right above and you will discover that Trump is “a con man and a grifter, and has been ripping off the working class for decades.”
In fact, a fair share of “anti-Trump” rhetoric and remarks sound much like they came from a Democrat. Some worry more about how Democrats will react than how they act. Some illustrate a parallel “fealty” and suggest that “anti-DeSantis” rhetoric means you belong to a cult. Once again, look above. Totally unprovoked. It goes both ways, and it should be acknowledged, too, because it is no less destructive.
What Milhouse wrote is correct, and it’s the same thing he wrote in 2015(ish)–it may have been 2016–long before DeSantis was a thorn in your Dear Leader’s side. You know why? Because it’s true. It was true then, and it’s true now. And it has nothing at all to do with DeSantis, who only became a rising star because Trump botched the WuFlu response in 2020.
And yes, “fealty” is the correct term. Even suggesting Trump can’t win the general (which he can’t) gets one called a long list of names, including Marxist, globalist, GOPe, NeverTrumper, and stupid. Only Trumpers are very clear that they will not consider or vote for anyone but Trump. That is the very definition of fealty. And it’s unAmerican and gross.
You, too, think Trump is “a con man and a grifter, and has been ripping off the working class for decades?” Please clarify because it seems he has suffered great personal and financial loss taking on the Establishment.
One can like Trump and his policies and message. That does not make him “Dear Leader.” Nor does responding to anti-Trump comments. Your gratuitous remark was uncalled for.
“Only Trumpers are very clear that they will not consider or vote for anyone but Trump.” Only Trump supporters have fealty. Laughable and false on its face.
Bwahaha! So your brain scientist (that’s a deliberate melding of two well-known cliches) response is: a.) Un-huh! and b.) no way!
I am bowled over by your rhetorical finesse.
Dear Leader?? There you go. WHY would I want to vote like you when you feel this way about us?? What difference does it make?? You sound just like the Progressives.
LOL. This is an insipid and sophomoric argument because it suggests there is any chance you would not vote for Trump. And you have made it clear where you fealty lies, where your “us v. them” lines are (hint: they are far too far to the right for your guy to win the general).
And LOL some more at the oh-so-tired “you sound just like progressives.” You know who sounds like progressives, Only Trumpers whinging that any pushback is “progressive.” You all do it. It’s transparently desperate. (And let’s not forget laughable. If I were going to be intimidated by being called names, it would not be by some rando in the comment section of a blog. It would be by the resident of the WH telling me I am a threat to the very soul of our nation. But yeah, not intimidated by that, so spare me.).
Can you engage without being insulting? It’s a poor representation of the site when you call people mentally challenged or ridicule as you often do. It’s sad that you have such a problem engaging in actual discourse and need the surplusage.
Says the guy who routinely insults anyone not flying the Trump flag while marching in the Trump parade. Your need to feel perpetually outraged is duly noted. And dismissed.
“Says the guy who routinely insults anyone not flying the Trump flag while marching in the Trump parade.”
Find one example, please.
Let alon, “routine.” That seems to be YOUR game. You have shown it all over this thread. It drips from your comments. You’re just an editor here, so no big deal.
Trump is a con man and a grifter. His entire career has been one long saga of cheating and dishonesty and ripping people off. That’s why it made so much sense that he was BFF with the Clintons, who wrote the book on grifting, until he decided, mid-campaign, to challenge Hillary for real.
Says the pretend expert on everything. Debunked your gruel elsewhere.
Self-awareness isn’t your strong suit, I take it? You’ve never debunked anything anyone here has ever said, and that definitely includes Milhouse (who regularly takes you to the woodshed for a good drubbing).
Professor
Not one of your posters appears to support Trump, including you, and very much promote DeSantis
So it is what it is
What, exactly, do you ever gain by posting such ridiculous crap????
There was nothing in that spam about the article written by Prof. Jacobson.
Of course there wasn’t. She can’t wrap her mind around logic because, as she relentlessly types in weird poetry format, Trump is THE ONE, He suffered and pretty much DIED for us, He is a SAINT, we OWE Him our fealty, loyalty, and vote because of all he suffered FOR US.
One Only Trumper even declared that Trump is the ONLY thing standing between us and Satan. Have you ever?
The professor is right; it’s a bizarre religion with these people; their language is cringey and sacrilegious. So Trump is the new Jesus standing between humanity and the Enemy? Um, yeah, no thanks, I’ll stick with Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior, thank you very much. This weird quasi-religious fervor from Trump’s worshipers is very very off-putting to normal Americans who understand that our Constitution and the Republic it forms has no room for kings, anointed rulers, or godlets.
The thrust, then, of gonzo’s comment intentionally ignores the Professor’s points because these people can’t refute a single point he makes, so they don’t even try. They KNOW Trump can’t win the general, but they just don’t care. Burn it all down, they cry! Don’t make America great again, just burn it all down.
I think we have a sunken cost fallacy taken to extremes even for a sunken cost fallacy.
That said reality does tend to re-assert itself.
I just hope it happens before the primaries so we could avoid a second Biden (or any other Democrat) term.
Actually nothing means anything anymore because not only have we made voting unnecessary, because we have month long voting now and 100 ways to effectively cheat, and they do, and they will, so it’s useless actually
Got to admire how effective they have become since 2016, boy they really upped their game
They win all the big ones now and our courses just refuse to deal with it
No standing, guess being an American citizen has no standing anymore at all
It means something if you consider it a duty…
And so you won’t vote in the next presidential election. No point in you preaching to us then, is it? Sort of hypocritical.
Although we seldom agree, she’s probably right about the next election, and we have Arizona to prove it.
Then why do you care so much whether we vote for Trump?
With the benefit of hindsight, it’s clear that 2016 was a fluke. It was a unique confluence of a large anti-Hillary vote, Trump bringing new working class voters into the GOP, and a Democratic apparatus and media that did not take Trump seriously.
Sure it was a fluke. Yea, they could not pull their creating off. They mastered it by 2018 and are skilled experts by 2020. Guessing the red wave really did not happen?
Problem is that the election fraud is huge. With over 1000 affidavits claiming voter fraud, with census information showing that over 60 K registered voters did not live in the district and some areas were there were more votes than actual voters. Just looking at voting patterns alone is enough that things are rotten in Denmark. You can pretend all you want about Orange Man bad, but not even acknowledging that their is voter fraud means the problem is not fixed. I do not see DeSantis solving that problem really soon.
2016 was a fluke because they could not cheat enough.
Nah the Democrats didn’t think they needed to cheat in 2016. The polls were so in favor of Hillary that the Dems didn’t bother to crank up their vote fraud machine. 2020 was the result of the Dems doing anything and everything to beat Trump, including cheating.
I guess you are unaware of the call Hillary made to Obama on election night 2016 when she asked him if there was anything more he could do and he told her there wasn’t. Thus, we are left to wonder what the phrase “is there anything more you can do” actually means? I am sure it had nothing to do with helping her cancel her election night celebration. The Dems had their cheating plans for 2016 in place — they just underestimated how many illegal ballots they were going to need. The Dems knew the pre-election polling was rigged in order to suppress the Trump turn out and they failed. It really is that simple to explain.
You know what has always bugged me? Hillary reportedly told Obama she was “sorry” after she lost to Trump. That just clangs wrong to me. Sorry for what? For losing? Well, maybe, but I sincerely doubt it. Why would she tell him she’s sorry if she’s the one who lost? I wondered then, and I wonder now, if she didn’t mean she was sorry for not taking him up on his offer of “anything more he could do” earlier on. Was she so convinced of the inevitability of her win against Trump that she wanted to try to do it on her own? Without the usual Democrat election distortion/meddling/theft?
I obviously don’t know the answers to those questions, but it still nags at me. What did she mean by “I’m sorry“?
Wonder if it has to do with a promise to keep (protect) Obummer’s secrets? Media would have fawned over her for 4 years and we’d never been the wiser about Obama. But Trump comes in like a bull in the china shop and keeping the secrets falls to the deep state and media. So instead of being lied to and lulled to sleep for 4 years, it was a blitzkrieg on Trump and the right … it forced Obama and his tentacles to hide out for 4 years … generally and metaphorically speaking, anyway …
Census information cannot possibly tell you what you claim. Not only because there is no information about any individual, but also because (1) the census is not taken on election day or even in election month, and (2) it counts a person where they’re currently living, not where their legal residence is. Many people are temporarily living away from their legal residence but still vote there.
Also, there are no areas with more votes than voters. No matter what you mean by it. And the census certainly can’t tell you that, not only for the above reasons but also because it doesn’t even tell you whether someone is eligible to vote.
There has always been election fraud. What matters is the margin of fraud relative to the margin of ballots. And the 2022 “red wave” was cancelled by the Dobbs decision – which permanently changed the national political landscape.
2024 is a totally new contest, and it won’t pay to fight the last war. I am expecting some big changes in the landscape between now and then. A severe national recession is probably in the cards, and the way Biden blew the SPR for the Midterms means there is nothing left in the tank now, and rising oil prices will result in a severe stagflationary recession. Manchin will probably run for President as an Independent, and he will draw both disaffected Biden voters and anti-Trump voters. It is not beyond the realm of possibility we will see the first Presidential Election decided by the House in 200 years.
I doubt Dobbs changed the landscape, at least in the way you imply; that d/prog will enjoy a perpetual electoral advantage b/c of it.
Frankly people figured out since Dobbs that if their particular State is Blue then not a whole lot changed for them due to Dobbs if anything. Most everyone in Red States who was an ardent pro abortionist was already voting d/prog. Exceptions at the margin sure not really consequential long term but for one midterm cycle sure. Maybe even a Presidential cycle.
IMO as more folks on all sides of the abortion debate come to realize that Federalism is working and individual States are now free to adopt the policies that the voters of that State desire v a one size fits all badly reasoned judicial decision they will come to appreciate the wisdom of Dobbs in that respect. They don’t have to worry about policy changes from Congress on the issue impacting them in their State, which on balance lowers the temperature on the issue.
I think Dobbs did permanently change the Federal election landscape in one way – Republican voters who care about abortion rights in a red or purple state are perfectly willing to put up with the inconvenience of driving over a state line or two, or flying to California, to get their daughter an abortion. Therefore, they may still vote (R) in State elections. However, the one thing they will not tolerate is the possibility of a Federal ban on abortion, and this will motivate them to vote (D) in Federal elections if there is the slightest hint that a national ban is a possibility.
I don’t believe that, the cheating is what changed the election in 2018,2020,2022….
They have gotten increasingly expert in it and Covid gave them the lightning in the bottle
We will NEVER have an honest election again
Votes don’t count, ballot harvesting count
We live in a banana ret
New Judicial Watch Study Finds 353 U.S. Counties in 29 States with Voter Registration Rates Exceeding 100%
Colorado settled and agreed to clean up its voter roles.
This is pretty common, unfortunately. People move and they don’t “de-register” to vote in their old state, they just move to their new state and register there. Supposedly, those abandoned registrations are not used ever again because the person associated with them never votes there again (unless they move back, I guess). Also, when someone dies, they are not removed from the rolls in most states, either. I think some states are moving toward automatic removal of dead people (it’s automatic with things like SSI, so the functionality is there). It’s up to the state to clean up their rolls. They don’t unless forced to by the courts. I’m sure some of it is shady shenanigans, but some of it is also just bureaucratic business as usual (do as little as possible to hit the subpar “good enough for government work” bar).
Motor voter made accurate voter list maintenance an affirmative requirement. It does often take individual litigants to force the County and State to comply.
IMO the easiest way to fix it is to require each voter to reregister in their birth month. Just purge the list and start over from scratch. Anyone could try and reregister at any point but those born in that month would have priority. There are plenty of NGO with plenty of funds they spend on other things to redirect to secure transportation to accomplish this so no excuses relating to transport or access.
As long as some states are allowed to mass-mail ballots to all registered voters, alive or dead, there will be massive voter fraud. The amount of ways to easily defraud that system boggles the mind.
Ballots with dead people’s names on them are still going to get voted as are ballots of people who have since moved to Timbuktu.
Well sure which is why we should hold States and County Elections officials accountable for performing their affirmative duty to maintain an accurate voter registration list.
It seems like states have gone backwards in cleaning up their rolls with the implementation of motor voter registration. In Michigan it used to be if you didn’t vote for four years straight your registration was cancelled. Simple, and effective. But now no one is ever cancelled, and automatically renewed with any change to a state ID.
Note that census data are only a rough indication of how many people might be eligible to vote. But more importantly note that this does not validate either of two common claims: (1) that some states/counties/precincts count more votes than they have registered voters, i.e. their turnout is over 100%; (2) that some states/counties/precincts report more votes than the number of eligible voters the census indicates them to have. Neither of those claims is even close to true. But that there are more people on the roll than the maximum that there should be is not surprising, since there’s no proper process for removing people from the roll, and the courts have often made it difficult to clean the rolls even if an election board is interested in doing so.
Sorry, down voted you by accident. That is a major part of the “big conversation” that is out of bounds, a rule being enforced by our “move on” enforcers here. Why? Because Republicans steal elections too. And they are now gaslighting us for their next bipartisan election steal in 2024. Yes, a conspiracy theory and yes, we know that there is no such thing as a conspiracy. Life is just one long series of ironic coincidences.
Phil, you can have any discussion you like here as long as you do not insult, denigrate, or otherwise engage in ad hominem against our readers as people. Ideas are free game. We are actually far too lenient with you on this because you have been around here for so long, but to make this claim is to lie. Stop it.
If we are a part of the big Uniparty conspiracy, go away. Don’t be tarnished by our uniparty blah blah and just leave. What the heck is wrong with you? Do you even hear you? It’s completely unhinged raving from here. What do you hear? Insight? Some sort of marvelous knowledge no one but you and your fellow rabbit hole dwellers can understand? You’re not even original. you just repeat nutter conspiracy crap you read on nutter conspiracy sites. Here’s a hint, if what you believe is so obvious to you and completely crazy to pretty much everyone else, you may be the problem. Think about it.
“you can have any discussion you like here as long as you do not insult, denigrate, or otherwise engage in ad hominem against our readers as people”
Like YOU have in some above comments??
Right. I get some leeway, too, apparently, since I’ve been here at least as long as Phil. You? Not so much.
I’ve been here for years. I don’t post a lot. YOU are rude.
I am rude to people who are rude. It’s sort of all they understand, as you’ve proven here.
You have been very insulting today, which surprises me. You aren’t typically like this. I’ve been here since the second month this blog was in existence.
It’s true that I tend to avoid being insulting, but when I see people being needlessly insulting to others (or to me), I tend to respond in kind. It’s a human failing that I’m not even working on. Insult and attack me, and I will insult you and attack you right back. In spades.
We went through all this in 2015-16, too, though, so maybe you forgot?
To debunk that moronic post right now
ROMNEY won more votes in Wisconsin in his 2012 landslide defeat there than Trump in 2016 in his victory. If they had been able to pull off a cheat there 2018 2020 or any other year than making the man who attracted fewer votes in Wisconsin than MITT ROMNEY would have been easy as can be.
It is far past time to end this horrible mythology.
It is extremely helpful if you are a Democrat candidate. If you are a Republican it helps if you don’t want to win.
2016 was a fluke because not only was there a hated candidate as the Democrat but she literally didn’t visit 3 vital swing states she interpreted as a blue wall and thought was out of play.
All true. One thing I found interesting was that her team (and Hilary herself) were mocking Bill Clinton for saying that they needed to go up there. I wish I could remember where I read that, but apparently, Hillary’s team was so confident of their online outreach and algorithms that they thought Bill Clinton was some doddering old fool who just didn’t get it. Say what you will about him (and I’ve said plenty), but he’s one of the most savvy and capable politicians of the past century. To have that powerhouse of teflon and just plain political acumen at your fingertips and to dismiss him as a relic . . . that’s how you lose elections.
Intellect sometimes turns into hubris. Something we know about Hillary is she does try to surround herself with the people with the best theoretical qualifications, and they have a tendency of failing spectacularly (remember how she is just like your Abuela? That was not a Hillary Clinton idea it was one her team came up with).
Bill Clinton is a brilliant politician and we are fortunate Hillary listened to “the best and brightest” over someone who actually understands the politics of all 50 states.
If the GOPe bails on Trump and allows the wacky left to railroad him I predict that millions of populist and conservative voters will refuse to support whoever the party nominates to be beltway candidate.
Conservatives are the ones that want Trump out of the party. We would return to voting Republican (instead of third party or NOTA) for President.
Yep run another Romney type ticket. If the GOP runs a pro open borders amnesty, perpetual war, big government, anti individual rights platform they will get the same results they will lose the White House and both houses of Congress.
I have no problem with DeSantis in what he has done in Florida but if the establishment throws Trump under the bus to destroy populist policies they have no chance at victory.
The left and all the totalitarian proponents will vote Dem even if they run a mannequin. There are not enough country club voters to elect a Democrat lite candidate.
If Trump physically cannot run the DeSantis is the best alternative. A better solution is Trump in 2024 and DeSantis in 2028.
Replacing populist policies with conservative ones IS victory.
Define “throws Trump under the bus”. What can the GOP do both theoretically and practically? PS Not nominating him in the upcoming primary isn’t throwing him under the bus.
When you mention “pro-war, big government, anti rights” I assume you are railing against praising Putin for invading and committing war crimes and genocide, central economic planning such as tariffs that screws everyone using steel for the benefit of steel producers and war powers executive orders that effectively nationalize companies, and trying to ban guns?
Trump 2024 results in either eight years of Newsome or a slim chance of four years of Trump followed by eight years of Newsome. In neither case will Desantis 2028 be a thing.
Who are these so called conservatives you speak of? 😂😂
I am Tea Party, and I am WAY more conservative than many in the Republican party that are serving today. THEY are not conservative. Many should be running as Democrats…not Republicans because they vote against us with Democrats over and over and over again.
I agree. A lot of “Republicans” aren’t conservative and should have remained in the Democratic Party.
That seems rather like cutting off your nose to spite your face, no? I mean, if you want to save America, make her great again, why on earth would you willfully sit out an election that will surely sweep a leftist lunatic with a radical leftwing, anti-America agenda into the WH? I’m not saying rally around some odious piece of RINO filth (like Mittens McRomneyCare . . . or Asa Hutchinson), but there are other choices, no? Or will be. You’re not even curious to see who throws his hat into the ring? To hear what he has to say? You’ve already decided that anyone but Trump is worse than any and every Democrat? I just don’t get that.
I agree it seems unwise. He still isn’t wrong about a lot of Trump voters.. Maybe my take is skewed because I am surrounded by almost exclusively poor, rural white people. Most of them don’t vote, or only vote local. That is the status quo that Trump broke. Those people voted for him. Without him, they’ll go back to the status quo. You’ll call them names or point out a flaw in their logic and they won’t care. They’ll see you as a well-off “one of them” Republican and they won’t give a damn what you think or say. If they perceive the R party as a party of disloyal betrayers (which is happening), then they just shrug, make sure they have food and ammunition, and turn off of politics again.
I am not saying that is wise and good, but I am saying that an awful lot of people are that way. I don’t know if one can generalize much from the people I know, but it sure seems a danger.
If enough of those people decide only the third box matters it may get a little more spicy than some people want.
Asa Hutchinson just announced that he is running and has called for Trump to drop out of the race. That is effectively what the professor is arguing for but not being explicit about it. But it is the same condescending attitude towards us Trump supporters. As if we don’t have very good reasons to fight this fight.
For the Uniparty, getting rid of Trump gets rid of the last (unexpected) obstacle to Bush’s dream of the NWO of globalism. The Uniparty hates us because they are owned and controlled by billionaire globalist dirty money.
For the GOPe, it’s their final battle for their cavalry in saving the Democrats before the GOP is replaced by a second party.
Desperate people say very complicated and confusing things. This Rube Goldberg Theory is desperate and I deeply resent being condescended to. Like many here who support Trump, I am a very intelligent thinking person who is perfectly capable of thinking for myself. If the corrupt RINOs have run out of arguments to make their case of how snatching defeat from the jaws of victory at the last moment is worth voting for one more time, it is time for them to just leave. History has passed them by while they desperately grasp the last straws of their corrupt little racket.
BTW, notice that while we Trump voters accurately describe this struggle as a final battle between voters and the corrupt Uniparty globalist system. the insipid DeSantis crowd continues to insist that this is a battle between Republicans and Democrats. BOTH wings of the Uniparty are fragmenting horribly right now (has anyone noticed?). Understanding that explains everything about why Trump is so enthusiastically supported by the broad sensible middle voter. Most of America chooses loyalty to country over loyalty to party.
How about LI hold a private office pow-wow and discuss that major point? I just don’t care about either of the Uniparty wings and would welcome the destruction of both. That is what we are now at the brink of succeeding. I know, political parties being replaced is too confusing a concept for the “intelligent people” to understand. It’s a Declaration of Independence concept… way over the heads of party uber alles cultists.
Phil, pull yourself together. This is crazy talk. We are not in any way affiliated with the GOP or any of its parts, including state parties or even local ones. We are a non-profit working on things that used to be important to you: things like supporting the First and Second Amendments and fighting against CRT, child mutilation, abortion, antiSemitism, “anti-racism,” and a host of other offenses perpetrated on the American people by the radical left. There is no conspiracy of any kind involving this website or anyone here. I would know if there were, no? And if you don’t trust me or the Professor or our legal representative (who is an AMAZING man and appears “on every page” because it’s a sidebar; everything on the sidebar appears on every page. That’s how sidebars work, right?), then what the heck are you doing here? I’m seriously asking because all you are doing is making up lies about us and ranting at and about us . . . in our own house. Do you get that?
I would like to second Fuzzy’s analysis by noting I am a “No Party Preference” voter in California.
Phil isn’t crazy when looking at the whole picture. We are furiously arguing the merits of one candidate versus another. The Dems already have a war chest of 1 billion dollars and counting. Good investment… one billion to control the (once)_most powerful country in history and in that history… controlling much of the rest of the world. The goal is pulling the plug (intentionally or as a result of stupid ideology) on the USA. The best argument is having the real movers and shakers (not the established loser advisers) and have the GOP candidates figure out who has the best chance to win and the other(s) support that. Does that sound like the Left… well.. yes… but this is war. If DeSantis… fine… if Trump..fine. But at that point any naysayer is for the Dems…. this is Travis and the line in the sand.
Phil, you’re too far down the rabbit hole if you see LI is part of a uniparty conspiracy. Please hear that.
I object to your description of DeSantis followers as “insipid.” I defy anyone to work as hard as I did knocking on doors in rain (and one day snow) in Luzerne county in PA from September through the day before Election Day in 2020
You are not taking into account that some of us who routinely vote Republican and who did vote for Trump are tired of him and his antics, narcissism and unhinged attacks. I am very grateful that he defeated Hillary, but his act and stunts he is pulling now will not work again. I am done with him. I need someone more disciplined, measured, smart and ruthless
In my eyes, that is DeSantis. When I go in for a candidate, I go all the way.
Don’t know who and why you were downvoted for telling the truth…
In my opinion, you are way, way overestimating Trump’s sway and power at this point and time and are underestimating how tired even some of his most devout followers might be of him this time next ye
Assume all studies and all polls are written to mislead.
Implication: any decision made based on poll numbers is a foolish one.
Conclusion: you must make choices that you can morally defend, even if the entire world condemns it.
Welcome to the land of illusions. Don’t eat the food and don’t drink the water.
2016-Polls were right, Hillary was an idiot to dismiss polls placing WI, MI and PA being in play. When it came to the popular vote polls got that right to.
2018-Polls correct
2020-Polls correct
2022-Vindicated again that Trump candidates like Masters and Mastriano did horribly.
Now lets go farther back
2014-Close but slightly underestimated Republican performance in a couple of races.
2012-Over estimated Republican performance
Losers shut their eyes to what is actually happening, winners take the opportunity to change course when they see they are going down a losing road.
It is nice of the Professor to point out that what matters is not the standing of potential candidates in the primaries but in the general election. IMO this latest stunt reduces Trump’s chances of winning in the general election and increases DeSantis’. As Vince Lombardi said, ‘Winning isn’t everything; it’s the only thing.”
The Dems are jumping up and down over improving Trump’s chances to get the Republican nomination, like they helped get the Republican candidates they thought they could beat elected in last year’s Republican primaries. They have overlooked that they have also improved Biden’s chances to be the candidate, which could be a real problem if the Republicans do not select Trump.
Losing with Don Quixote (DJT) does not do it for me who, by the way, cares for his supporters a lot less than you think. Has he lifted a finger for the Jan 6 folks?
A new single, “Justice for All,” featuring former President Donald Trump, from the J6 Prison Choir, reached No. 1 on iTunes’ top songs on March 11.
https://variety.com/2023/digital/news/january-6-prisoners-choir-song-number-one-itunes-donald-trump-1235550422/
All proceeds to the families. He also said he would use his pardon power. What should he do? Lead an assault on the jail?
He chose not to use his pardon power when he still had it. He could have pardoned everyone involved in the Capitol invasion who had not committed an act of violence, but he chose not to.
The comment asked, “Has he lifted a finger for the Jan 6 folks?” Thus, the response showing that he has. Unsurprisingly, some people will never be satisfied and find fault no matter what.
Milhouse is ABSOLUTELY right.
The Jan 6th people with the exception of a very limited number of people all are ordinary people some of whom got misled others of whom made a dramatic mistake after weeks of being incited to anger at these rallies by Donald Trump.
The least he could have done after placing them with FBI and Capitol Police provocateurs near the capitol while working triple over time to make them as furious as humanly possible (an ideal circumstance for making a stupid decision) was pardon them with a mea culpa.
Proceeds to their families?
That is absolutely a joke compared to the fact that he could have prevented them from having their free lives taken from them and being dehumanized by NOT HOLDING THE GOD DAMNED RALLY or if he had to GO TO ALEXANDRIA where the FBI and Capitol Police wouldn’t have incited a riot or failing that PARDON.
Options that would have not made political prisoners to serve his own pride was available to Trump.
Anyone who thought there was a question about who would be president on Jan 6th was an idiot.
Is that your defense of Trump was he an idiot? Was he just two stupid to know the election was over? If so you should be glad the giant orange stupid man who needs assistance to get dressed isn’t president so he could focus on learning the alphabet.
Trump can do no right. Understood.
However, to REPEAT, the comment asked, “Has he lifted a finger for the Jan 6 folks?” Thus, the response showing that he has. That is a fact and it disproves the remark. No more, no less. Do you dispute that what occurred at Waco was “lifting a finger?”
If someone wants to jump elsewhere, by all means. Trump can do no right for them either. And because you are not satisfied that he did not meet your expectations, of course it makes your assertions ABSOLUTELY right. Got it. So certain, so objective!
You may not think the proceeds for families matter. Maybe they feel otherwise, than those who claim to be ABSOLUTELY right!
If you want to talk about the Abraham accords fine.
If you want to talk January 6th everything Trump did was wrong.
He literally spent weeks making the people who attended the rally angrier and angrier than made a speech designed to get them angry that did get them angry while there was FBI and Capitol Police provocateurs in the crowd (which if he didn’t know about from the Whitmer plot he was an idiot).
The absolute LEAST he could have done was pardon them.
The best would have been not hold the rally the election was long over on Jan 6th.
They are in prison in because they let themselves have their anger run away with them.
Why were they in a situation where that would be fatal to their freedom?
If he insisted on larping that the 2020 election was ongoing Alexandria was a few miles away and was FBI free.
It was also capitol free so even if a protestor gets angry enough by the time they ride the metro into D.C. they have cooled down and will just ride the metro back.
If I steal 2000 dollars from a charity and give that charity two cents that does not make me charitable.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. He said “peacefully and patriotically make your voices heard.” Yet, to you, “everything Trump did was wrong.” The bias is spectacular. Is that why you deem raising money for the familes a “joke?”
Abraham Accords? What are you talking about? Not much to do with Jan 6 political prisoners. It only became clear they were political prisons AFTER he was long gone from office. You forgot to mention that he was under impeachment at the time, or that provocateurs may have played a role in intiating the riot. So easy to criticize in 2023. Why not criticize him for coming down the escalator, too?
As always you ignore THE major thing. I NEVER said he was guilty of the crime of incitement.
I said he made a speech designed to get them angry and that they made him angry.
As always you seem to think that him not meeting the (extremely high ask any lawyer) standard for what incitement is that somehow makes everything all better.
I gave the example of Abraham accords as something Trump did well.
If you want to talk about things Trump did right that is NOT Jan 6th where EVERYTHING he did was wrong.
You didn’t debunk a god damned thing I said all you did (and yes you are getting insulted now) was prove you are a liar and a cultist and not someone with a brain capable of making up a singe thought worth having.
And no you do not get to be disrespectful and not get insulted.
You get to acknowledge that there isn’t a god damned person in this country who cares that Trump’s be angry speeches for weeks didn’t meet the legal standard of incitement.
He worked hard making them get angry and in that anger ordinary people made a dramatic mistake.
It was atrocious and it was selfish. The election was long over Jan 6th and the people he got furious enough to make a big mistake deserved much better than the prison cells Trump brought them to.
But he hasn’t. He didn’t when he could. Now he says if ever gets the chance again he’ll do it. And you believe him?! This is the same guy who promised to “lock her up” but he never meant it.
Danny,
YOU ignored the comment, even as it was explained a second time. So complain away.
Once again, the comment asked, “Has he lifted a finger for the Jan 6 folks?” The response showed that he has. But you are always the authority. Got it.
Milkhouse… didn’t you earlier say that since none had been convicted that he couldn’t pardon before the fact? How would one determine before evidence finding that one was violent or not in the time left of the Trump admin?. Wouldn’t a global pardon be picked apart? The shaman guy was in solitary confinement for 317 days before pleading guilty. It took how long to get some of the video evidence needed and even so…much is still hidden.
No, I never said that, because it isn’t true. It has never been true that you need to be convicted before being pardoned. Blanket pardons have been accepted as valid since the very beginning of the USA. George Washington pardoned everyone involved in the Whiskey Rebellion, without any need for trials or convictions.
All he had to do was announce that he was pardoning everyone involved in the Capitol invasion, so long as they did not commit any act of violence. It would then be up to the FBI, when it investigated someone, to determine whether they were covered by the pardon. To charge someone the prosecution would have to show evidence that they had been violent, and therefore had not been pardoned.
Millhouse, you know as well as I do that if Trump left a loophole in his pardon for the J6 people as big as “as long as they did not commit any act of violence” that every J6 arrest would have included trespassing as a violent crime, parading as a violent crime, etc…
Yes, he has paid many legal bills. He doesn’t toot his own horn when it comes to private charity.
Trump is an extremely charitable man…
Extremely
I agree, Professor. Good to see that someone isn’t afraid to say what he believes, while knowing that his opinion will draw criticism.
9 million people voted for both Obama and Trump. They are the true swing voters. They do not care about political parties.
Ordinarily, all you’d have to do is figure out which candidate appeals to them and that’s your winner.
But Democrats exploited Covid to change state and local election laws to benefit them. Not sure if a GOP candidate can even win any more given the structural unfairness. And then there’s the seemingly systemic cheating that always must be overcome.
You’re looking at someone who voted for Obama the first time; Romney in the next election and Trump twice. But I am never voting for Trump again
I can tell you voted for Obama.
Catty much?
Jesus, really?
Yes, really. I guess you noticed that I don’t engage in snide side-swiping as you do. I call it like I see it, I don’t snivel around whining about down votes or having one-sided conversations with nameless invisible, imaginary haters. I’m weird that way.
Some people just can’t step outside of their bubble and see or try to understand that others don’t vote the way they do. I used to think it was just liberals who did this, until I noticed the mean jabs coming my way from Trump supporters when I said I would be voting for DeSantis
Mostly it brings out the vote among Trump supporters rather than changing preferences of a given voter. A voter population change.
Even though my strong inclination is to vote for Trump, I agree with the professor that it is way too early to commit. The last two years have been ever so clarifying as we see evidence of financial connections between Republicans and the Chinese, including Mitch McConnell, Ron Johnson, the Bushes, and probably others. We are likely to find out a lot more about potential candidates in the next year.
One reason for the absolute push back against Donald Trump (in my opinion) is that he blew the whistle on the Chinese gravy train in DC. The case against Biden’s payments from China appears to be moving slowly because others with Chinese interests likely worry that their connections might be revealed.
This takes me to one Ron DeSantis. He appears to have garnered the early support of mega-donors and political backing from Karl Rove and the Bushes. Why? What is it about DeSantis that gained the support of international investors with ties to China? Has he pledged to go soft on China or is it because he’s not Trump? These questions need answers before I can consider supporting DeSantis.
Gov DeSantis is doing extraordinarily well in Florida, but most of what he has done has benefitted the financial community and has been supported by a friendly legislature. Sure DeSantis opened up Florida during Covid, but that was a popular decision within the state, and it was good for the economy. But how would he do on the national scene when his decisions on China could harm his financial backers?
DeSantis is a giant question mark on the national scene. Plus he could have at least acknowledged Trump for an endorsement that helped put him over the top in his first very close race for governor. This would have made him more appealing to Trump voters.
We still have a ways to go until the primaries. From my perspective anyone looking for loyalty oaths for ANY politician can go pound sand. And the primaries are supposed to be a fight among the party’s candidates. Acting like we OWE any one candidate the nomination is distasteful, to say the least. I will make my decision on whom to vote for on the day my state holds it’s primary.
It is not a sure thing that Trump’s endorsement that put DeSantis over the top. Some have pointed out that DeSantis won because his opponent Andrew Gillum wanted Florida to be a sanctuary state. If Trump’s endorsements always worked, then we would be seeing Kari Lake as Governor and Mehmet Oz as PA Senator. I don’t think Trump’s endorsements have the power he likes to think they have
Don’t fall into the trap of echoing Trump’s whining and panicky gripe about DeSantis and the endorsement.. This is not a contest for student council in high school. This is high stakes and anyone who wants to run can run.
Also, DeSantis has spoken up about Bragg’s politicizedl prosecution. Trump is in a complete meltdown and panic about the formidable and 33 year years younger DeSantis running. The stupid gripe about his endorsement is a red herring
And may I remind you that in 2016, Trump gleefully gloated on Twitter about Paul Ryan endorsing him.
We’ll call this the professor’s Rube Goldberg Theory. Most of us who support Trump really don’t care about the destruction of the Republican wing of the Uniparty. So that removes one of the key underpinnings of this theory. The Republican cavalry is once again coming over the hill to rescue the Democrat wing of the Uniparty. The GOPe is committing suicide and is too corrupt to save itself, it will be replaced by a truly second party that will be dominant.
I ask again: why is RNC super-lawyer Ron Coleman featured here on every page of LI? Someone please explain why anyone feels the need to do this on his blog. Maybe Mr Coleman could introduce himself and explain this himself.
To me, LI looks like it is captured by the GOP.
Nah. Just a different view.
Phil, your constant attacks and conspiracy theories about Ron Coleman are disgusting. He was one of our first readers in 2008, and has given us and many other conservative bloggers free legal help for almost 15 years. He walks the walk while people like you just talk and talk. Of course you knew that because it’s been explained to you before, but you are so caught up in conspiracy theories and paranoia you refuse to listen. You are sinking deeper into your “connect the dots” fantasy land, I hope one day you can snap out of it.
First of all, I have only mentioned Ron Coleman twice in my comments. Neither time did I attack him so let’s get that straight. Both times I brought him up because his picture is conspicuously dominant and he is a “super lawyer” for the RNC. You don’t think that merits an explanation given the overt GOPe leanings here on LI?
Below are three videos. One is Meghan Kelly interviewing Ric Grenell. Another is Tucker Carlson interviewing Glenn Beck. The third is Nigel Farage on GBN
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dVO_ld0CX54&t=574s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ZbzMuckGTg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-6C-A6dDMQ
Please note that they are telling the same lies and paranoid conspiracy theories I keep pitching around here. Note how easily Kelly and Grennell navigate the territory? Note how Kelly refers to unspecified sources regarding her opinion of DeSantis not being ready for prime time? Note how Farage explains the global significance of Trump getting arrested?
So how about getting over your hatred for Trump and dropping the condescension? Most of us Trump supporters liked DeSantis until you fanboys started attacking us as being a cult. Coming from you, it is inexcusable and hypocritical. The hate has been coming almost exclusively from one direction.
I am a very intelligent and thoughtful person capable of forming my own opinions. I deeply resent being called a liar, cultist, conspiracy theorist and other false lies by condescending know-it-alls who issue their opinions as “the truth”. Nobody KNOWS anything. I make every effort to explain why I BELIEVE what I BELIEVE and expect people who disagree with me will respond to what I actually say rather than using as a bouncing board to display their own ignorance.
Yes Professor, you hate Trump and it warps your judgment as it does the judgment of all of the NeverTrumpers who are rallying to DeSantis around here. You refuse to even consider what the world is learning, thatTrump has already grown to be an American colossus for being willing to take the fight to the global enemy. As you will see from the Farage video, the rest of the world is watching and desperately praying that Trump prevails. Trump is going to become a global colossus as he keeps up the fight.
We should be getting into that fight but can’t even have the “big conversation”.
Of course you are attacking Ron Coleman, from your first attack: “I am curious if the Professor chastising her comes at the instruction of the official LI lawyer Ron Coleman who has been having run-ins with Sundance at Conservative Treehouse lately? CT has been a very reliable source for the many years I have been visiting that site daily. Why does LI see any value in declaring on every page that “their lawyer” is a high profile lawyer for the RNC? That is what got me miffed in the first place. I feel like I’ve been had.” You accuse Ron Coleman of giving us instructions as to the comment section, and then suggest we’ve deceived you? Now you bring him up again with the same theme that our connection to him suggests we have been captured: “I ask again: why is RNC super-lawyer Ron Coleman featured here on every page of LI? Someone please explain why anyone feels the need to do this on his blog. Maybe Mr Coleman could introduce himself and explain this himself. To me, LI looks like it is captured by the GOP.”
Why do you care that Ron Coleman is on our sidebar? Why do you keep claiming his law firm’s involvement with the RNC is suspicious when the RNC is run by the person Trump supported, Ronna McDaniel? Why didn’t you know that his law firm also represented Donald Trump before casting aspersions? Seriously, why do you care? He’s our lawyer, he’s been in our sidebar since at least 2013 as our way of saying thanks for the free legal help he has given us (and many conservative bloggers) faced with legal threats. You do it because you have bought into the conspiracy “connect the dots” paranoia, so you could use it to paint everyone who disagrees with you as a “Trump Hater’ and “GOPe”. Trump and DeSantis and other supporters are welcome here, we don’t welcome toxic commenters. I’m done arguing with you, Goodbye.
That lawyer doesn’t owe you one second of his time, jackass.
This is a free blog. You are free to go if you think it is some kind of “conspiracy”.
Maybe if they had released their own NFT deck then they would be legit.
One final thing: This Puritanical fantasy you have of purifying the country with magical people from both sides of the aisle is pure lunacy. It’s also not “true conservative” of you (as you like to continually claim as your stock in trade). You have more in common with the voters you call “GOPe” than middle road Dems. There are virtually no Dems that want small government. They just have factions that want the government to do different things for them. It’s why the payouts when they are in power have reached insane levels (to enrich themselves, pay the progressives, and pay the union rank and file).
Hey Phil, this is the law firm in which Ron Coleman is a partner https://twitter.com/pnjaban/status/1643331602511011848 “Congratulations to President Trump on this final attorney fee victory in his favor this morning. Collectively, our firm obtained over $600,000 in attorney fee awards in his favor in the meritless litigation initiated by Stormy Daniels.”
You going to apologize? or nah?
The primary contest is gonna be fun. Each candidate will have the opportunity to earn the most delegates to the nominating convention. Things will get real this summer once all the potential candidates decide if they are in or out. Then we can view head to data of the entire field of declared candidates, listen to their speeches, view their ads and read their policy papers. Then compare and contrast as we make an informed decision about who is the better candidate for ’24 to solve our current problems.
You’re kidding, right?
You mean some folks won’t wait until all the potential candidates have declared and the primary season kicks into high gear this summer? That some folks might hang their hat on one particular candidate or potential candidate before they even evaluate them with all the evidence they can garner from speeches, debates, policy papers, their reactions to success, defeats and missteps along the campaign trail? /s
It’s gonna be a fun primary season as folks begin losing their damn minds obsessing over X poll but downplaying Z poll, bitching and moaning about relative fundraising totals. I enjoy the cut and thrust of politics in general. I really do give every candidate an opportunity to earn my vote. Call me old fashioned but I try and let 8th grade Civics ideals guide me.
I am withholding judgment until I hear what Stormy has to say.
Her mouth is probably too full to talk.
Why? Is she a candidate?
Weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!
I’ve been trying to remember who Bragg reminds me of.
“Show me the man and I’ll show you the crime” . Lavrentiy Beria
The problem is that a lot of people will jump on Trump’s wagon in order to stick a finger in Bragg’s eye. Unfortunately, not many will be independents or democrats.
Following Pasadena Phil’s sentiments,
I think America would be in a much, much better place if it elected Trump. Trump has become the symbol of the fight against leftism and wokism. America’s electing Trump would be a beautiful signal that America has recognized the miserable cancers that leftism and wokism are.
That being said, in much the same way DeSantis (and perhaps others) would also be great for America.
But Trump is the shining symbol. However, if Trump keeps violating the Republican’s 11th Commandment, he will convince me that he is no longer fit for the job.
Now is Trump’s great opportunity to start praising the likes of DeSantis and Abbott and others as examples of what Republican conservative leadership can do for America, thereby really getting the “rally-around” phenomenon going.
That is the trouble with Trump. He can’t not stop attacking DeSantis in ugly creepy ways. He is too old to change and has become even more petty and narcissistic in his attacks. He is also the most un-selfaware person I’ve seen
Two weeks ago on Truth Social Trump suggested that DeSantis was a gay groomer who had been with an underaged boy. A creepy, weird, bizarre attack that I will not forget, I knocked on many many doors in Scranton and Luzerne County for him in the fall of 2020, but I am not voting for him again.
“”He can’t not stop attacking DeSantis””
I don’t think that’s what you intended to say.
Right. He can’t stop attacking DeSantis and it will get worse.
I agree with you. I am pretty sure exactly what Trump is going to do if elected. I would like to think DeSantis and all the others would fight, but there is more evidence of Republicans, once elected, withering under the bright lights of the presidency. That was my main disappointment with Bush and nominees like McCain and Romney and even Scott Walker. They were more interested in the social graces of the process than doing what needed to be done to further the causes they were supposed to represent.
Trump’s polling is rock solid, he is savaged 24/7 and the media uses his name as a slur.
How well does DeSantis poll after 6 months of being savaged by the national media non stop?
You know exactly what Trump will do? Yeah, we all do. He’ll hire crap people, let them run amok and undermine him, sort of get a clue he’s got bad people around him, fire one or two, and keep the rest . . . who will torpedo him again. He hasn’t learned a thing. He’s still acting like a novelty, like a celebrity candidate circa 2015 not like a successful (and he was a successful) president. He’s playing a role for his fan base cum loyal followers, and it’s not working outside that niche audience of fervent acolytes. It’s old, it’s tired, it’s weak, and it’s incredibly toxic to vast swaths of the voting public.
Pretty hard to hire qualified people when they slow walk, block, undermine and even arrest your qualified nominees. How many times was he setup, betrayed, impeached and investigated? I will give him the benefit of the doubt on his nominees. The larger picture is that he decided to trust the GOP and they took advantage of that to really do some damage. He probably should have known better. It is also hard to get qualified people to work for you when most people aren’t in for being run out of restaurants, having your career ended and being vilified. To me the real issue is our toxic uniparty politics and the traitorous GOP that allowed that to happen. Maybe you have noticed that Trump has been working hard at bringing in people and getting candidates elected? That directly translates to moving his agenda forward and blocking the nastiness of the left. that is also a pool of people that he can draw on for his government positions.
All true and completely, horrifically unfair. I agree. And that changes how by putting him right back there?
Currently, Trump is snuggling with McCarthy, raving about how great Ronna Romney McDaniel is, and his BFF is Lindsey freaking Grahamnesty. This is all good . . . how?
Oh, I know, the Only Trumpers don’t care about RINOS if they are Trump-approved, they don’t care about a sitting president literally saying “take the guns first, go through due process later,” and they definitely don’t care that Tump sat limply by as Fauci and Birx led us (against Trump’s own better instincts) to lockdown, voter fraud, and ruin.
But hey, how’s about moving to a Trump city on federal land, controlled by the feds, to pursue your American Dream? Doesn’t that sound all American and yuge? Of course, it could go kinda bad when a Democrat wins the WH, but hey, not Trump’s problem! He made Trumpville; it’s not HIS fault Newsom turned it into a dystopic hellscape more akin to Pottersville than Bedford Falls. Who coulda seen that coming? Oh, right, EVERY freaking ONE.
Again, this changes how if he is elected as president? He’s still up against the swamp, and he is still surrounding himself with the swampiest swamp creatures out there. You’re good with this?
You are missing the larger point, It is big new bold ideas to reignite the American Dream. He never says it will be a federal city. It would use federal land. The idea I go was that the land would be given/sold to the developer(s).
So if Trump tries to get along with McDaniel and Lindsey boy that he is corrupt or bad?
Fauci and Birx were bad decisions, but I would rather fail by being overly cautious. When the thing started, nobody knew how bad it was. He was right about stopping travel to China and HCQ.
Well said.
“He’s still acting like a novelty, like a celebrity candidate circa 2015 not like a successful (and he was a successful) president.”
Exactly! Thus my earlier comment, “Now is Trump’s great opportunity to start praising the likes of DeSantis and Abbott and others as examples of what Republican conservative leadership can do for America, thereby really getting the “rally-around” phenomenon going.”
In 2016, many Republicans did rally around Trump despite Trump’s “boorish” behavior. Unfortunately, that behavior has worsened. Trump needs to change and improve his game because there are clearly not enough only-Trumpers to cary the day.
Trump had been praising DeSantis until DeSantis revealed himself when, after Trump endorsed him 3 times and campaigned for him to take from also-ran to winner, DeSantis was asked by the media if he would be endorsing Trump. His reply? “No comment”. Stab in the back.
Second, that fabled Republican 11th Commandment did not exist until Reagan revealed it as HIS 11th commandment. He was the only one who honored that commandment.
At this point, IMHO (emphasis on H), it is up to DeSantis to clear the air, not Trump. DeSantis has already crapped on the possibility of inheriting Trump’s legacy and gliding into 2028 as a sure 2-term president. That was his exit ramp off of his current doomed rush over the cliff.
Until that “no comment”, I was onboard for DeSantis as THE GUY to follow Trump into the WH. Now that he has hooked his future onto the Bush/Rove loser train, it’s going to be a really big question whether I would vote for him. But then again, unless the elections are again stolen, Trump will be the winner. (Keep in mind that Reagan was cheated out of the 1976 nomination so that sacrificial lamb Ford could lose to Carter. BIG opportunity lost. And we are about to do it again?
That is why I am not a Republican. But sincere thanks for backing my reasoning. Much appreciated.
And nothing here is remotely true. As usual. When did DeSantis literally say “no comment” when asked about Trump’s 2024 bid? DeSantis is not a “no comment” guy, so I want to see the video of this or read the report (from an actual news source not some guy who used to stock shelves at a grocery store before becoming your go to guy for the “insider” view).
And DeSantis, in every action and word, has been the anti-Bush/Rove candidate. He’s against pretty much every single thing they stand for, and he’s vocal about it, and he acts on it. There is zero actual evidence that anything else is going on behind the scenes (and no, again, your former Publix employee doesn’t have a clue what is going on with DeSantis’s team.).
There is literally nothing DeSantis can say to “clear the air” with you people beyond, as you’ve laughably suggested, destroying his own political career by becoming Trump’s ring-kissing butt boy. That’s not going to happen, so forget it.
Trump may win the GOP primary, but he cannot win the general. The numbers just aren’t there. And no, it will not be “stolen,” it will be exactly what everyone has been saying since Trump started bashing DeSantis the week before the 2022 midterm elections (that’s when he lost me, by the way): Trump is toxic, and he is alienating voters who voted for him TWICE while not picking up enough to off-set that loss nor to make up for his inability to win over indies and moderates on both the left and right. Nor can he earn a sufficient number to overcome Democrat voting fraud. Look at the numbers, Phil. It’s all there.
You keep stating stuff that is patently false, and you never provide any evidence (again, the nuthouse is not evidence; it’s a crazy place for paranoid people who cannot think for themselves–you do realize, on some level, that you are just regurgitating loopy crap from a blogger who makes big money suckering you guys, right? You don’t have a single original thought or viewpoint. It’s all a script you learned and are busily spewing all over our pages.).
Fuzzy, why even respond at all if the only argument you have is to call me a liar.
If there was no fraud, why not investigate and prove it? NOPE! You just can’t wrap your brain around how the Uniparty works. Have you not been paying attention to the new discoveries in Georgia and elsewhere? Have you been following Keri Lake’s efforts in AZ? Ohio? PA? WI? NOPE! You made up your mind in 2020 and history went right past you. Face it, your precious Republican Party and precious McConnell rig as many elections as the Democrats.
Trump cannot win the general? “The numbers just aren’t there”? Is this your first rodeo? How many times have we heard that? That is your desperate attempt win an argument but have nothing but empty claims. The numbers aren’t there? Well, the polls say otherwise. What numbers are you looking at? All of the major polls are showing Trump running away. Are you now going to point out that polls don’t mean anything at this point? So if not polls, what numbers are you looking at? The numbers that “aren’t there” so you make them up?
Who is that blogger making “big money” suckering “you guys”? I get a lot of information from a lot of varied sources and unlike you, I’m not stuck in an echo chamber.
This is the dumbest post the Professor has ever posted and your comments here are just plain stupid.
Cause that’s what she does, yet she responds to me is hilarious
Fuzzy Slippers in reply to gonzotx. | April 3, 2023 at 1:45 pm
Yes, really. I guess you noticed that I don’t engage in snide side-swiping as you do. I call it like I see it, I don’t snivel around whining about down votes or having one-sided conversations with nameless invisible, imaginary haters. I’m weird that way.…
There’s more, but ,
DeSantis never said “No comment” when asked about Trump. This is not a high school contest. DeSantis doesn’t have to kiss Trump’s ring… Why isn’t Trump ranting about Nikki Haley being in the race? Because she’s no threat to him.
Are you living in solitary confinement? That is one of the most obtuse comments I’ve heard in quite a while. DeSantis was not only kissing Trump’s ring when he was begging for his endorsement when he was losing big in the FL GOP primary, he was kissing his ass and biting “the big one”. Trump is the guy who saved his career. In my world, but obviously not yours, loyalty is a virtue. There are a lot of Republicans who are in debt to Trump but stabbed him on the back on the first chance. So blow me will you?
I get it your upset with these posters that refuse to do their own research on DeSantis
Who by the way voted 3 times to make changes in SS , not good changes, less money and you get to get a few bucks back, according to DeSantis, at 70, yup ,
There’s a whole lot that could be done to make SS solvent but cheating the American citizens is not one of them.
They have stolen the money from the lock box, they have given the SS benefits to people with alcohol issues, bad back, depression… so it’s not for retirement really anymore and people given the opportunity will scam it.
But don’t give them ammunition telling them to blow you
This is the day AMerica died and this group thinks DeSantis will fight for them if he gets in the WH
If it happens, I’ll come back to say, “I told you so”…
There is no place to go unfortunately
We threw the Country away to scum
The only person saying that Trump saved his career is Trump. As I ‘ve stated here before, many believe that DeSantis won because his opponent wanted Florida to be a sanctuary state. You’re just parroting what Trump said, without questioning it. Trump is not a kingmaker and no candidate has to kiss his ring- especially now that he is so toxic to so many.
I’ve noticed that you asked another person who commented here with whom you disagreed whether they were drinking when they commented… I have been reading Legal Insurrection since before Trump became President.. I remember when commenters were respectful here. Surprised by the insults by your kind and the sarcasm in your question about whether I was living in solitary confinement. Have you checked out Breitbart? Seems like you would be a good fit there. Although I can tell you there are DeSantis supporters there too who can punch back pretty hard.
One of the many reasons I left the Dem party was because Dems were so intolerant of others who did not vote the way they did. You are reminding me of them here.
2018 was an extremely blue year with a blue wave which DeSantis managed to defeat in a swing state which he then set about turning red.
You really hate reality.
The source and only proof that Trump helped DeSantis is Donald Trump says so.
Well the Trump effect is the more it is about Donald Trump the more we lose.
How many defeats in Wisconsin do you need before you get it through your head?
Is there a path to the white house without Wisconsin?
Are you deluded into thinking he will make Oregon red? Or are you deluded into thinking he will take Minnesota? What is your path to the white house for Trump?
Or does that just not matter.
You do a great job at insults and sneering you do a horrible job when it comes to actually answering important questions.
Phil, I too love Trump. Past Republican presidential nominees Romney and the now-deceased McCain have been disappointing as post-election senior leaders of the Republican party. So, of the past 3 Republican presidential nominees, only Trump has been a star, imperfect as he has been.
As for the DeSantis “no-comment” response, I don’t recall it.
However, there is this from https://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/politics/elections/fl-ne-florida-gop-reaction-20201106-pjqk73ln3jcojggkp2rhezz7ay-story.html :
That was before the cartel got to him, notice it’s 2020, think 2021
abbott?
abbott? really?
On a related topic, tomorrow is a special election in Wisconsin to decide a seat on their supreme court. It is quite possible that the next presidential election gets decided in that court.
If you are a Wisconsinite, vote! If you have friends in Wisconsin, remind them to vote!
Dang, so it’s moments like this that I wish I hadn’t quit Twitter after they banned Trump. I have so few followers now that tweeting about this won’t make any difference. (Not that I had a bazillion before, but . . . it was more.)
Don’t worry, even if the Republican wins, Milwaukee and Madison already have the. Allots ready for the D win…
Probably by 8-12,000
Oh so close, if we just had a beer tee candidate!!!
Dang phone … hate it, really didn’t say that ballots
And better candidate
But drinking beer is a Wisconsin thing, we use to be the beer capital of the world
Of course, like everything, those jobs were lost and shipped out too
I’ve generally been a Trump supporter on a “not as bad as the others” basis. (I’m 69 years old and there hasn’t been a good President since I was 7 or longer – Eisenhower may have been the last good one, but I wasn’t paying much attention.) But his narcissism is becoming too much.
Possibly the worst part of his administration was Mike Pence for VP. Does anyone think this narcissist will pick anyone better this time, or anyone that is capable of replacing him? Trump will be 77 by election day. That may not be too old to be President (if his health holds up better than Biden), but it’s certainly old enough for his designated replacement to be a major concern.
Trump’s and Biden’s VP picks should have been a major issue last time, except there were nullities on both sides. Now, there’s a pretty good chance Biden will be dumped for someone who will live through the next term, so the Dem’s will be in a good position to ridicule Trump’s choice.
If he’s serious about running, he needs to either persuade DeSantis to accept the #2 spot if he can’t beat Trump in the primary, or find someone else who is credible as his replacement. Because win or lose in 1924, he’s done after 1928.
Coincidentally, I just watched an anti-DeSantis advertisement on TV sponsored by the MAGA Pac. I’m thinking that doesn’t bode well for a VP offer.
I suspect that after Trump insinuated on Truth Social on March 20 that DeSantis was some sort of gay groomer who had possibly been involved with an underaged boy, this would not endear him to DeSantis.
Anyway, DeSantis is too strong and outspoke to be VP to the increasingly toxic Trump. As he told a reporter a couple of weeks ago, he considers himself “the Executive type.”
I 100% agree but would add in the example of how Trump treated Mike Pence with no provocation at all.
You must be drinking early, pence was a traitor through and through
No, Gonzo, Pence is a true conservative and patriot, and a far far better person, better conservative, and better patriot than Trump. Or than you.
Trump’s picks have been very enlightening. Prior to being VP, Pence was respected as a Christian conservative. But he wasn’t very Christian as a VP unless being a backstabbing plotter is now considered Christian.
Chris “Two Ton” Christie is the guy who recommended that Trump hire Wray as the replacement for Jim Comey as FBI Director who he had just fired.
But McConnell recommending Garland as FBI director was even worse. Luckily, Trump said NO! Later, McConnell would vote to confirm Garland as Biden’s nominee for AG.
I don’t blame Trump for those picks. He was operating in a snake pit of Deep State Republicans who were protecting the Deep State (and Democrats).
The only thing I saw there was Phil being utterly and completely disgusting.
Mike Pence followed the law that was it. If you want a system where the VP gets to decide which electoral votes to read might I suggest moving to a country where the VP has such authority if one exists.
After reading you suggest that it is treason to follow the laws of the United States of America I didn’t bother reading the rest of your rant.
Oh dear God…
Pence was a plant, pretty sure, he was the one that made sure General Flynn got the boot, definitely a big mistake by Trump to listen to Pence
Pence was “in charge” of the Covid response, he literally was back stabbing Trump and refusing to carry out his concerns. He was the one that selected Fauci and the scarf lady and sent her state to state to shut down America
She even bragged about it in her book, how pence shielded them from Trump, how he refused to put other scientific minds with differing opinions on the committee.
Pence is scum throughout
Yes, I think Trump should have fired Fauci, but if you recall, everyone was in love with “I am the science” Trump was threatened with another impeachment
It was circus city, now we have lost America
And we play fiddles while the Country burns
Never in my life would I have envisioned an America that hated its citizens so much that they promote sexual predators, cut children’s organs out of them and put them on hormone blockers and arrest parents for speaking at schools or just recently convicted a man for making a mene in 2016, freedom of speech?
Nah…
Oh how about 100 billion to ukraine, Ron was against it till his handlers told him , no, you are against Russia and he came out and “admened his comments…
Geez, when your explaining Ron, you’ve already lost
Then Disney, that didn’t exactly work out the way Ron thought it did
What We Know About the DeSantis-Disney Dispute
After the Florida governor gained control of the board that oversees development at Walt Disney World, the company quietly sidestepped the effort to limit its autonomy.
https://www.nytimes.com/article/disney-florida-desantis.html
But Ron with the help of bush, Karl, and the billionaires will fix it
You make me laugh
America is already gone…
As always you have written nothing worth reading.
Trump gave Flynn the boot because he was being an overall incompetent at that point.
The Covid Task Force was directly beholden to Trump who was not against what it did (far from it he attacked governor Brian Kemp for reopening Georgia).
Trump also had years to go over who was in charge of what. While it is hard work hard work is what being the president is all about (look at how Obama’s hair looked in 2008 vs 2016). Why was Fauxi still in charge while doing illegal things where was the presidential oversite before it became a catastrophe?
About 100 billion to Ukraine I will not listen to you be against it because you think the invasion is a genocide (Trump’s words). If 100 billion isn’t worth stopping a genocide….I am assuming you are a good person yes? I will have a nuanced conversation about Ukraine and I have been accused of being pro-Russian a lot. I will not discuss how horrible 100 billion in spending on Ukraine is with a Trump supporter in light of Trump calling it genocide. In this country we believe genocide is the ultimate evil. When you have broken from Trump on this issue we could discuss what if any level of support Ukraine should get.
By the way because you either are a NYTimes subscriber or just skim headlines lets take a look at this
https://twitter.com/theflstandard/status/1642906989306032131
Do you EVER get tired of spouting out leftist talking points on behalf of Donald J Trump?
Not quite it. Pence followed the legal advice he had received. Which is exactly the right thing for anyone to do.
Eastman’s argument that the USA is precisely such a country is not obviously wrong. It’s not obviously right either, but the major flaw it has applies equally to the Electoral Count Act.
In my opinion Eastman is correct that the Electoral Count Act is unconstitutional, but incorrect in his alternative. The correct answer, in my view, is that there is no answer; the 12th amendment is very badly drafted and an answer cannot be squeezed out of it.
The point, though, is that right or wrong, a person should follow his lawyer’s advice, not that of someone else’s lawyer. Trump was right to accept Eastman’s advice; Pence was right to reject it.
Eastman not only had no leg to stand on he when asked refuse to tell Mike Pence in decisive terms that his claims were actually true.
The professor did a very decisive article on what the constitution does and does not say concerning what the VP is to do and every instruction it gives is a direct order with no room for wiggle room, and the authority to reject electoral votes just isn’t there.
The only historic precedent brought in by the people who thought Pence had veto powers was when a miscommunication resulted in a state sending too many electoral votes and Thomas Jefferson mistakenly counting all of them (which is word for word the opposite of the historic precedent they needed and would imply the founding fathers themselves didn’t think the VP had any authority on this).
Eastman did nothing wrong a lawyer must within the law give his client his full and unrestrained zeal, I’m not attacking him as a person.
However his argument was bad enough and Eastman is intelligent enough for what I got out of his inability to create an argument that could stand up to any scrutiny or stand by his theories when Mike Pence gave him a yes or no question that the system is very clear that he was wrong.
Pence was the best part of his administration.
I am seeing reports that the charges tomorrow may also relate to a second woman- Playboy Playmate Karen McDougal
I don’t care if there are 20 women, they are all adults and consensual
I don’t pick Presidents or Generals to be saints
I’ll go to church for that delusion thank you
Whereas Biden was trying to have sex with his own daughter in the shower
Her words, not mine
As you know, Bill Clinton was disbarred for lying about Monica Lewinsky to a grand jury, not for the consensual sex . I never said this was about consensual sex re: Trump. I merely pointed out that it appears that some charges may be related to monetary transactions he might have had with a second woman named Karen McDougal…
That has been widely expected. I also expect Bragg to somehow throw racketeering charges in.
You usually do have money transactions with prostitutes…
I was still a “democrat “ when Clinton had his dalliances, it made me sick, she was so young and he took advantage of that, but I didn’t want to see him impeached over it
As it is, his sex history is pretty disgusting, Epstein and all. Clinton was in the thick of it and is a nasty nasty man who is a pedofile
Epstein did not kill himself…
Clinton of course has acquired hundreds of millions of dark money through his so called non profit organizations
How’s all that Haiti money going bill and hillary?
How about Waco and the murder of religious American citizens, many children
I’m just so disgusted with all of it
Didn’t you just, in this very same thread, make fun of someone who switched from Obama to Trump?
Wow…so you are much better because you switched at Clinton. Ironically, Trump and Bill were great buddies then!
Matt colangelo.. lawfare , he’s the one that connects Obama, Biden to Bragg…
How about looking into that!.
Health guy
I didn’t bring up Clinton, I was responding to someone who did… might want to read that
President Trump was a business man at the time of Clinton, he gave millions to democrats, and I’m sure he gave millions to republicans
It’s called business, not friendship
There are no quote marks, so as it stands it looks like your statement.
If that’s not you, then you might want to proofread to make that clear (with quotations). While we’re correcting people, you should hit the reply button on the last available in the thread and it will index your comment at the bottom of that thread. Failing to do that is why you keep ending up with random statements all over the comment board.
Trump was a self-described Democrat in principle at the time. Heck, he was a self-described Democrat under Obama. See wiki.
“Donald Trump registered as a Republican in Manhattan in 1987; since that time, he has changed his party affiliation five times. In 1999, Trump changed his party affiliation to the Independence Party of New York. In August 2001, Trump changed his party affiliation to Democratic. In September 2009, Trump changed his party affiliation back to the Republican Party. In December 2011, Trump changed to “no party affiliation” (independent). In April 2012, Trump again returned to the Republican Party.[4]
In a 2004 interview, Trump told CNN’s Wolf Blitzer: “In many cases, I probably identify more as Democrat”, explaining: “It just seems that the economy does better under the Democrats than the Republicans. Now, it shouldn’t be that way. But if you go back, I mean it just seems that the economy does better under the Democrats…But certainly we had some very good economies under Democrats, as well as Republicans. But we’ve had some pretty bad disaster under the Republicans.”[5] In a July 2015 interview, Trump said that he has a broad range of political positions and that “I identify with some things as a Democrat.”[4]”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_positions_of_Donald_Trump
Also, is he magically not a businessman now? Somehow, he is this savior that is above all of the grift in Washington out of the kindness of his heart?
Funny how he spent plenty of time in the corporate sleaze political cesspool, and now he wants to pretend to be clean. Phil/yourself want to hero worship him like a baby lamb on the cross for us….it’s twisted.
President Trump had everything…but… he choose America
https://twitter.com/Lauren3veMemes/status/1642991441785032704?s=20
This is not a reply, just an observation after reading about 20% of these comments. It seems as though lI readers have become more interested in “Twitter fights” and proving that they are more clever, smarter or stronger than the other guy.
Anyone who has had their eyes open since 2016 should be able to see that Federal elections have little to do with candidates quality (eg. Biden, Fetterman….), Fairness ( Zuckbucks, vote harvesting….)
Lawfare, votefare and just plain survivefair says that all of you better start working NOW at ways to get more votes for a Republican , November 2024
I usually enjoy a good, fun, mud-slinging descent into over-statement and non sequitur. Yet this Orange Crush / Orange Be Crushed, DeSantis / DeInterloper, blah, blah, blah has become tedious to me.
It’s messing with my self-image. Thanks a lot.