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Prisoner X — Further Questions Not Needed?

Prisoner X — Further Questions Not Needed?

This is a follow-up to our posts about Prisoner X.

Our resident reader from Down Under s_dog sent me this link to Andrew Bolt’s blog, An Israeli tragedy, an Australian silence:

Greg Sheridan dismisses conspiracy theories in the Ben Zygier case, following the report released by Foreign Minister Bob Carr into Zygier’s death in an Israel prison:

Good grief, Zygier was visited by his family 50 times in his short 10-month detention in an Israeli prison. He was visited by his lawyers. He was not physically or psychologically abused.

More than that, he had migrated to Israel, taken out Israeli citizenship, served in the Israeli Defence Force, worked for the Israeli government and married and settled in Israel.

At no stage did he or his family request any consular assistance from Australia…

The idea that Australia retains responsibility for them in criminal cases, especially in a democratic country with an independent judiciary such as Israel, and in circumstances where they do not request assistance, is ridiculous…

Two definitive statements stand out.

Carr said there was no evidence Zygier was in any way involved in the 2010 assassination of a Hamas leader in Dubai, in which Mossad agents used Australian passports.

Recently, Israel’s Prime Minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, said ASIO had had no contact whatsoever with Zygier.

It is extremely unlikely that Carr and Netanyahu would make such statements if they were not true.

Yet Zygier was held in secrecy in prison for reasons we do not yet know. But for me the silence of his family suggests there is little to be gained in the national interest by demanding answers, much as I’d like them….

I agree. And I suspect there was a lot more that ASIO knew about Zygier than anyone wants to lay claim to….

Sounds like Prisoner X got in way over his head on something. What, we may never know.

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Comments

The most troubling aspect of this case, in my opinion, is not that Ben Zygier was imprisoned to protect Israeli state secrets, but rather than he (somewhat conveniently)
“committed suicide” while being incarcerated.

This issue will remain a thorn in the side of any Pro-israeli advocacy in civil rights issues, and the damage it has done to Israel’s already tenuous public image will linger for a long time to come.

Sad, but the Media gag order was probably the most damaging aspect of the whole affair.

BannedbytheGuardian | March 6, 2013 at 10:25 pm

This is silly . PM Netanyahu lies because he must. No one expects an Israeli PM to let out negatives but the gag order post outing annoyed Israelis & significantly weakened Netanyahu.

Everybody here expects Bob Carr to lie. He is an ( appointed sub for a resignation) labor Senator in a minority government up for re election currently running 45-55.

I agree his family do not care that he died In an Israeli uber security prison by hanging himself adeptly by a bed sheet. Or that he was even there. ( Zyglier was not permitted lawyer presence when facing undisclosed charges ) . They did not care that almost 9 months had passed without a tribunal or court .

But no one can claim he was not Australian for he returned & applied for & gained public funding for his Masters in 2009 as a citizen. Australia is not responsible for him in Israel it is true , but Israel is responsible to Australia for his death in custody.

Interestingly the 2 officials who were in full knowledge of the case are a former PM Insider who is now the Ambassador to China & the other a high intelligence honcho who’ is now the Defence guru. No doubt they are skilled & judicious officials & saw the bigger picture.

An interesting facet not covered is why a man gets to be super secret Prisoner X , yet when he dies , the enquiry is handled by a mere District Court Just after the traffic offenders ?

Ps in reading the latest I saw a good joke.

A Polish patient when asked if he could read on the chart XYZJWUTV he replied – Read it ? I know him .

    You do love to spout malicious nonsense about Israel, don’t you?

    This is silly . PM Netanyahu lies because he must. No one expects an Israeli PM to let out negatives but the gag order post outing annoyed Israelis & significantly weakened Netanyahu.

    Weakened him how? He is still PM, the case is still secret, the Aussies are still keeping shtum and so is the family. The Israeli press have also quiet after the initial hoo-ha.

    I agree his family do not care that he died In an Israeli uber security prison by hanging himself adeptly by a bed sheet.

    And you know this how? Are you personally acquainted with the family? Have the family made any announcements to prove your disgusting assertions?

    Or that he was even there.

    But of course they did know he was there. They said so. Read the various reports.

    ( Zyglier was not permitted lawyer presence when facing undisclosed charges ) .

    Another lie. His lawyer, Avigdor Feldman, was even interviewed.

    They did not care that almost 9 months had passed without a tribunal or court .

    And another lie. See above.

    Australia is not responsible for him in Israel it is true , but Israel is responsible to Australia for his death in custody.

    No. Zygier was an Israeli citizen. He made aliya, took Israeli citizenship, served in its army, married an Israeli, had Israeli children. And Israel did inform the Australians anyway. So… more lies. How unsurprising.

    An interesting facet not covered is why a man gets to be super secret Prisoner X , yet when he dies , the enquiry is handled by a mere District Court Just after the traffic offenders ?

    Ooh! Let’s start another conspiracy theory! Could it be because… drumroll… the district court is where prison deaths are handled? Nah, couldn’t be. This is Israel we’re talking about. The most evil, illegal and malign country in the world.

    I don’t know why you’re banned by the Guardian. You’d fit right in there perfectly.

BannedbytheGuardian | March 6, 2013 at 11:58 pm

I just read an articles http://www.aijac.com.au/news

(Australia israel Jewish affairs Council. .)

Jewish Disloyalty -The Myth That Will Not Die.

ouch . We just got compared with The Dreyfus affair from France 1894 I don’t suppose we can claim Blood Libel.

We are sorry we had the audacity to care about a fellow citizen dying alone in an Israeli cell anonymously. Especially as we wasted a good Masters place on him .Don’t suppose there is a refund?

Somehow it is our fault zionists have gone wild. blerchhh!

How suave and caring seem the gentle folk who unselfishly help us see the evil lurking deep in the hearts of those involved in the apparently failed democratic experiment called Israel. We owe these seekers after justice a huge debt for bringing this possible tragic miscarriage of justice to our attention. Hopefully, in that otherwise peaceful and tranquil neck of the woods, Israel’s leaders will see the error of their ways and magnanimously allow a multitude of deserving neighbors to return to a land they and their ancestors had never before visited. What could possibly go wrong?

BannedbytheGuardian | March 7, 2013 at 5:18 am

Anne – unless you are an Israeli – you have no skin in the game. Your opinion means shite.

The matter is still ongoing in Israel & is not forgotten . In fact it is closely being monitored due to the recent Palestinian deaths in custody which seemed to get a prompt high level response & definitely above a district court.

As an -Australian citizen his death is still subject to a clearance by a Coronial Enquiry. This is not at all a district thing but a state level specialized authority. Now that it is out the Australian Government has no influence on a state jurisdiction – so you can’t say they are keeping Schtum.

He is buried here & can be exhumed if the Coroner is not satisfied with the Israeli report. Some members of his family have spoken out as to the turmoil this death has caused within the Jewish community . They would like answers also.

Your personal attacks are pathetic. That is always it – put Israel under an everyday light & get acused of anti semitism.

Besides suck it up – my interest outweighs yours. Might just go along & put a flower on his grave. Plenty of people are doing just that.

No young man should die alone in turmoil unacknowledged . Whatever he did in Israel it was maybe not against our laws.

Heavens , Julian Assange has put himself on the ballot for Senator !

    Anne – unless you are an Israeli – you have no skin in the game. Your opinion means shite.

    And who made you the ultimate arbiter of whose opinion holds water and whose is “shite”? Wow. You’ve got such a chutzpah. I am Israeli. I have “skin” in this “game”. So my opinion means plenty. And it certainly means a lot more than your opinion since you are not Israeli. Therefore, using your very own criteria, your opinion means shite.

    The matter is still ongoing in Israel & is not forgotten . In fact it is closely being monitored due to the recent Palestinian deaths in custody which seemed to get a prompt high level response & definitely above a district court.

    Nonsense. It is not ongoing in Israel. The subject is closed besides the odd report from an Australian news source. The Palestinian death – in singular; stop trying to inflate numbers – in custody is not connected. Stop trying to tangle two different subjects together.

    As an -Australian citizen his death is still subject to a clearance by a Coronial Enquiry. This is not at all a district thing but a state level specialized authority. Now that it is out the Australian Government has no influence on a state jurisdiction – so you can’t say they are keeping Schtum.

    I haven’t seen any official announcements to the Press from the Australians.

    He is buried here & can be exhumed if the Coroner is not satisfied with the Israeli report. Some members of his family have spoken out as to the turmoil this death has caused within the Jewish community . They would like answers also.

    Everyone would like answers. I’m sure they can get their answers in private. For all you know they already received their answers. The family have kept conspicuously silent in public about Zygier’s death.

    Your personal attacks are pathetic. That is always it – put Israel under an everyday light & get accused of anti semitism.

    Please quote me where I accused you of antisemitism. You can’t because I didn’t. However your personal attacks on me are beyond pathetic. They smack of desperation. You smear Israel and then object to the fact that I called you out on it. You are the one trying to silence my voice my implying that I falsely accused you of antisemitism.

    Besides suck it up – my interest outweighs yours. Might just go along & put a flower on his grave. Plenty of people are doing just that.

    LOL! You sound like a playground brat. I really couldn’t give two hoots whether your interest outweighs mine. This is not a game of egos. You go and put a flower on his grave, though I think he deserves a lot more than a flower from the likes of you.

    No young man should die alone in turmoil unacknowledged . Whatever he did in Israel it was maybe not against our laws.

    He wasn’t unacknowledged. His parents and his lawyer knew all about him and what happened. And maybe it wasn’t against Australian laws – though no one knows what he did so no one can answer hat accurately. But he wasn’t in an Australian jail was he? He obviously transgressed some Israeli laws, else he wouldn’t have been in an Israeli jail.

BannedbytheGuardian | March 7, 2013 at 5:43 am

His family should have fought for him .Why get a submissive inept lawyer when you can call on the backing of a nation ? Deals are made all the time .

Could have traded some UN votes – Israel might have gotten more thang 8 on the Palestinian vote.

    His family should have fought for him? How do you know they didn’t? How do you know they weren’t so ashamed of what he (presumably) did that they decided to keep quiet?

    What gives you the right to pronounce from on high and smear the reputation of a good family?

    And if you think Avigdor Feldman is a submissive lawyer, well, all I can say is you have shown your pathetically abysmal ignorance of Israel and Israeli politics.

We are sorry we had the audacity to care about a fellow citizen dying alone in an Israeli cell anonymously. Especially as we wasted a good Masters place on him. Don’t suppose there is a refund?

N.B. Despite BBtG’s odd and somewhat grandiose affectation — the frequent and liberal use of the Royal “We” — suffice it to say that he/she speaks only for him or herself. BBtG’s thoughts and opinions represent a sample of exactly one, just as anyone else’s do. Please don’t think he or she represents the views of all Australians, any more than one single American opining on an Aussie blog represents the views of all Yanks. Cheers.

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