It’s time to speak out against the global persecution of Christians
Watching the ethnic cleansing of Christians in the Muslim world and repression elsewhere
I recall someone saying that you could judge societies based upon how they treat their Jews. I don’t recall who said it.
I think that’s still true in large part, but less of a global issue because most of the world — and certainly the Muslim world — has been depopulated of its Jews. In Europe, the maxim still holds, as the virulent demonization of Israel by the BDS movement alliance of Islamists and leftists is driving out the Jews who are left, and driving others into virtual hiding.
Globally, however, it is Christians who are under pressure and persecution. Hearings were held in Congress today on the issue:
Qanta Ahmed, writing in The Jerusalem Post, recently noted the dire situation of Christians in the Muslim world, Persecution of Christians in the Muslim world: We are what we tolerate:
During my first visit to Yad Vashem, Israel’s Holocaust Museum, a quotation caught my eye.
Attributed to German Jewish essayist Kurt Tucholsky, I scribbled it down: “A country is not only what it does, it is also what it tolerates.”
I found myself thinking not of collaborators during the Nazi era, but of Muslims during the Islamist era.
Christian persecution in the Muslim World goes unremarked upon in the Muslim world. Yet Christian existence in the Middle East, the very region where Christianity first arrived to world, is today imperiled to a degree formerly unseen in its history.
The erosion of Christians in the Middle East and North Africa region daily escalates. Rabid political Islamism, which both calls for the elimination of Christians from formerly pluralistic societies and seeds a climate ripe for sectarian violence, drives the exodus of Christians from the region.
While in the West the persecution of Christians is not as dramatic, mockery of Christianity has become one of the few acceptable forms of demonization in polite society.
There are so many horribles in the world, I don’t know where to place persecution of Christians. I do know that it’s time to start speaking out about it.
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Obama’s minions are not “nowhere to be found”, they ARE found … calling Christians racists, bigots … clinging to their religion.
FOUND … establishing the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt, which looked aside as historic Christian churches were burned and Christians murdered.
FOUND … trying to force Christians to fund “abortions” against their will with Hobby Lobby, or with nuns that did charity work.
Obama’s “God Damn America” church put Farrakhan on their magazine cover, and supported the communists/Sandinistas in Central America. Calling his black power church “Christian” is highly debatable.
my “nowhere to be found” theme is a response to the FB edition of LI. 🙂
The Muslim Brotherhood didn’t look aside as Christian churches were burned and Christians murdered. They were looking directly at those events because they were the ones doing it. Since Obama is in bed with the MB, he is responsible for the burning of churches and the killing of Christians.
OK … I wasn’t sure that was established … but they had control and certainly approved, afaik.
Speak out, Wm, but know as you do that the Christian Church needs persecution as crops do rain. We are not a Church for comfortable times; that is when our numbers shear off and strange ideas infect our Body.
The Christian Church is built for and on persecution. Our numbers do not diminish when we are slaughtered. Rather, they increase.
If Christians were converting to Islam out of fear of persecution, I would be very worried. However, some are fleeing, some stand fast even knowing that death is their fate. Many die, enduring to the end, holding fast to the promise that was made to us in and by Christ. Therefore, I would hazard that, right now, there are more Islamic converts to Christianity in that same region that seems to be depopulating of its Christians. They are hiding, fearful, but again, that is not the Christian way. Pretty soon, they will have to rise up and declare themselves because to hide and pretend to be other than who they are is to deny Christ.
Finally, following the lessons of history, I would say we are looking at the end of Islam in the MidEast and elsewhere.
Well said, Juba.
The best recent example of that is what happened to the Church in Communist China. . . .
Was it Marx that said religion is the opiate of the masses?
In any case, I don’t think Christianity is dependent on persecution, as crops need rain. That actually seems a rather perverse contention, that Christianity is only a refuse from evil. Or that comfortable people will not seek some higher power, until they are served up a dose of evil. “An ever present help in time of trouble” is only for those that have already believed in times of peace?
We need to conquer evil, not treat it as a good thing to help convert people to Christianity. But this is a problem in many ways … we need to fight evil now, not be content that they will get just recompense in some after world.
But speaking out about it is just a start. We may actually have to fight. I don’t speak much on the Jewish state because I don’t grasp so many intricacies, but they seem more willing to fight than so many “suffer for Jesus” Christians.
Juba should tell the Copts that they’re getting what they “need.” Give me a break. Yes, the Good God has brought blessings out of persecutions, but that doesn’t mean that it’s needed.
We have a duty to relieve others from suffering as best as we can. The history of the Church’s fight against Muhammadans has been forgotten, to the peril of all in their path. Western nations should have a policy for all who raise the sword of jihad: dispatch with extreme prejudice.
I will not tell the Copts that they are getting what they “need”. Instead, I would tell them to stand fast. What they are experiencing is what the Church must, what has been prophesied for Her. They are part of the Church.
Rhino, the Church is not “dependent” upon persecution. Rather, the Church THRIVES on it, the same way crops thrive on rain. The Church is dependent upon her Lord who told us we will be persecuted for His name’s sake. So, the persecution is here, and the Copts are placed in the hottest part of the battle, as are the Assyrian Christians, as are the Central African Christians, and so on.
I’m in accord with what is expressed here: http://grapson.wordpress.com/2013/12/25/merry-christmas/.
I’ve been thinking about this for years. I hate Islam with a passion, and that must be clear to you all. Still, I don’t know if I would run guns to the persecuted Church. Given that we have been importing Muslims like crazy, the persecution will likely also come to our shores, and it has already begun. Then what?
A promise: God will always leave a remnant. That and His other promises are worth holding on to.
Still, I don’t know if I would run guns to the persecuted Church.
Good grief! You double down on your strange religion of ‘Let’em suffer, tell them to hang in there like good persecuted Christians!’
Following your analogy: there can come a time when too much rain hurts the crops.
JerryB, you go and tell God that persecution is not needed. Please report back on what He says.
Persecution is part of the Christian way. In fact, it is part of the JudaeoChristian way. It happens because of whose we are and what we believe. I don’t presume to understand why He lets it happen; it is enough that He does. Where was God during the Holocaust? Where is God during the slaughter of Christians? He is HERE.
We are told that persecution will come, and when it comes it should not be for the bad we have done but for His name’s sake. We have promises made to us concerning that all through the Bible.
We slaughtered Muslims in the Crusades, a series of defensive wars. We slaughtered no Romans. That is our history.
Marx was wrong about religion and coercion. Religion is a philosophy of morality, which when based on the right principles, precludes the need for coercion. There is no need for Marxism or its derivatives in a moral society.
Religion is not the opiate of the masses. Morality is not an opiate, it is a personal responsibility, which is exactly the opposite of a psychotropic drug consumed to escape reality. The opiate of the masses is dissociation of risk, which circumvents the natural and social feedbacks which mitigate progressive corruption.
I agree religion should not be an opiate, but it seems too often Christians or others become content that their destiny is to suffer now, as anti-Christ like figures dominate them. Too many seem to believe this is foretold, that perhaps these are end times.
Facebook brought me back with many old friends from my more staunchly Christian distant past, and many seem resigned that there is nothing they can do, their hope is in heaven, in a future world. I think this marginalizes them, or “drugs” them.
The founders seemed to set the right tone in separating church and state, and we western nations need to get back to their “first principles”. Our western nations are pretty darn peaceful for the most part, and we as a nation shouldn’t accept some prophecy of doom.
Anyway, the tone of “suffering for Jesus” as predestined doesn’t fit with my view of where conservative platforms should go. Adversity should be conquered, not accepted. Freedom fighters, not martyrs. A fine line maybe. Prophecies that there shall always be a remnant might apply to Christians, I don’t know. But our free western world is based on concrete universal freedoms, not just Christian beliefs.
I’ve been reading about Boko Haram slaughtering Christians nearly every weekend. (The Gateway Pundit covers it quite a bit. http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/) Mainstream media is not the least bit interested when churches are burned and the people are shot as they flee the fire.
I try to tell my lefty friends about it and what do I get as a response? “Well, why are Christians living in Muslim countries, anyway?”
Gee. No need to make those Muslims be “inclusive,” is there? Suddenly, the left has no desire to see “inclusivity” or “diversity.” No desire at all.
And anyway, what were all the people in the Middle East before Islam was even invented? They were Christians and Zoroastrians (among others), and Islam DID NOT convert them by knocking on doors and humbly handing out pamphlets.
Islam is the invading force in the Middle East.
So are you guys also going to call out the persecution of homosexuals in Africa by christians who are lobbying for laws with draconian principles?
How about christians persecuting muslims? The 9/11 Mosque had nothing to do with 9/11 and was the proposed location was not within the perimeter of the WTC site. Duh!
Me thinks ye do protest to much.
While homosexuals should be prayed for, witnessed to, and left alone, let us not forget that the Biblical penalty for all sin is death, which is what Muslims mete out to them in the cruelest fashion.
Irrational, I must confess that I’m less than blinded by the dim light of your intellect. When you know nothing about Islam and Muslims, or if you are Muslim and pretend that Islam is other than how it has revealed itself to the world, you show yourself a bit of a fool for trying to make us appear fools.
Christians persecuting Muslims? The rejection of the 9/11 mosque is a mark of that persecution? The same mosque that is built as near as Muslims can get it to Ground Zero? The world is awash in the blood of persecuted Christians, that blood shed at the hands of Muslims and you have the nerve to cavil about honest objection to a mosque proximate to the site of Islamic aggression against the USA? Don’t you know that Muslims love to build mosques on or as near to the sites of their “victories”? People blab about Christian triumphalism, yet they support Islamic triumphalism. And you, you come here falsely portraying the objection to Islamic triumphalism as a mark of Christian persecution of Muslims. Not only a fool but a liar.
If Christians were persecuting Muslims, we would load a car with explosives and drive it into the mosque while it was full of the heathens, then we would have gunmen awaiting those survivors running from it, and secondary and tertiary car bombs to be set off when the rescuers came. But we are not you.
“While homosexuals should be prayed for, witnessed to, and left alone, let us not forget that the Biblical penalty for all sin is death, which is what Muslims mete out to them in the cruelest fashion.” YOU PROVE MY POINT. IF YOU CAN ACCEPT MURDER OF GAYS OR OTHER ‘SINNERS’ BASED ON YOUR RELIGION, DON’T COMPLAIN WHEN SOMEONE ELSE’S RELIGION ADVOCATES DEATH FOR YOU.
All religion is based on ‘faith, revelation and authority’. It is unassailable if you believe in it and BS to the rest of us. So feel free to decry the killing of christians while ignoring all the evil done in the name of christianity. Nobody is listening; other than your fellow fanatics (of all religion stripes). Many of you are irrational, murderous h8trs.
“I’m less than blinded by the dim light of your intellect.” I WON’T BOTHER TO QUOTE THE REST OF YOUR AD HOMINEM ATTACK. BUT I THANK YOU FOR SHOWING THE SHALLOWNESS OF YOU ARGUMENT.
LOL.
More “open-mindedness” from Rational. WITH ALL CAPS! SO YOU KNOW HE’S VERY UPSET!!!!!!!!!!!
An example of Rational’s open mind: “All religion is based on ‘faith, revelation and authority’. It is unassailable if you believe in it and BS to the rest of us.”
So remember all of your religious beliefs are BS. That’s his idea being open-minded.
“Many of you are irrational, murderous h8trs.” Just as a side note, you should put a bunch excalmation points after a statement like this. You know, to get our attention and prove the truth of your statement. Love the “8” in “h8trs” too. Very hip.
Many of us commenting on this site? Or was it the 42 million+ killed by Mao Zse Dong in his religious crusade… oh wait… how about those killed in Cambodia by the Khmer Rouge… Oh, wait no– rational atheists again. How about the 10 million+ killed by Stalin… Oops. More rational atheists.
“So feel free to decry the killing of christians while ignoring all the evil done in the name of christianity.”
You know evil stuff you’ve pointed out: objecting to the 9/11 mosque. That’s pure and simple EVIL!
LOL.
LOL so what part of your religious believes is not based on ‘faith, revelation and authority’?
Come on. I want to hear this.
You are a true gem.
You really want to get into a pissing contest about who killed more people?
You are angry that I claim religion is based on ‘faith, revelation and authority’
That is strange. I heard religious people refer to themselves as people of ‘faith’
The 10 Commandments and the Bible were ‘revealed’.
The Pope and various Mullahs, Pastors, etc are ‘authority’ that is to be obeyed depending on your particular superstition.
What is your problem? I gave you a accurate picture of religious belief. Maybe it doesn’t look so pretty when it is laid out. I can understand that. But it isn’t my problem.
What part of your religious beliefs is not based on ‘faith, revelation and authority’. Do you have scientific proof? What else do you have? It does bother you. But I’ll bet you can’t articulate why.
@ the mis-named Rational
LOL. Oh, I’m sorry. Are we talking about my religious views now? Funny, I don’t remember mentioning them at all. Perhaps you could quote from where I mentioned that? Right? But I’m sure you could tell me all about them regardless.
And is that what you took away your own quote. That’s odd. I would’ve thought it would be your authoritarian all your religious beliefs are BS part– you know since I mentioned that directly in regard to your quote. Sorry. I’ll be more selective in quoting you in the future.
“You are angry that I claim religion is based on ‘faith, revelation and authority’”
LOL. Don’t flatter yourself. I’m amused by you, not angry.
“Do you have scientific proof? What else do you have? It does bother you. But I’ll bet you can’t articulate why.”
Scientific proof? LOL. Are you trying to imitate Ricky Gervais or Bill Mahr? And do stop trying to guess my emotions. You make yourself look (more) foolish by doing so. Oh, and the one who seems to have problems articulating their ideas is you. EVEN WHEN YOU USE ALL CAPS! heh.
@ mis-named Rational again.
Darn it. Part of my reply didn’t go thru.
“You really want to get into a pissing contest about who killed more people?”
Well, you did bring up religious people being murderous etc. You did write: “Many of you are irrational, murderous h8trs.[again the cute “8”]” and “Hindus and even Buddhists kill in the name of their religion. A pox on all your houses.” Right?
Obviously you’re suggesting that your own viewpoint is not filled with irrational, murderous h8ters– even though you did wish death on all religions and their believers. But the problem for you is that the 20th century just seems all chock full of genocidal atheists– and almost always coming from Marxist/Leftist backgrounds. It seems that atheism doesn’t really mean that you’re don’t commit murder… or even genocide for that matter.
It’s very weird. I mean you yourself have exhibited such maturity, self-control, and decorum in your own comments so far…
Why would you assume I am muslim? I am not. I find all organized religion equally abhorrent. Hindus and even Buddhists kill in the name of their religion. A pox on all your houses.
Gee, who invented a bomb to slaughter millions of people at the push of a button? Scientists. When I was being taught to get under my school desk if I saw a mushroom cloud, was that the result of “organized religion”? Nope. Science.
Who now gives tyrants the tools they’ve always dreamed of for surveillance, tracking, categorizing and intimidating citizens? Scientists.
Who set up the system whereby I must relinquish a week of my pay if a camera spots the front bumper of my car protruding 18 inches into a crosswalk? Scientists.
Who kills 100,000 people a year with drugs that are tested by an organization run by people who used to work for the company that makes the drugs? Scientists.
Who promoted the idea of eugenics that claims there are “fit” and “unfit” people? Scientists.
Who tortured Frances Farmer and all the other psychiatric patients who were subjected to electrical shock, ice water “therapy,” gang rape by staff, and lobotomies? Scientists.
I feel much safer in a church pew than in the hands of science, thank you very much.
Hmm. I never thought you were Muslim.
I was under the impression that you were an overheated Leftist atheist. But you proved me wrong there– you know with the “many of you are murderers” schtick. Quite convincing.
But just to restate.
Mao killed 42 million+ in his Great Leap Forward– according to the Chinese govt.’s records. Mao was an atheist, btw.
Stalin 10 million+ and Lenin was a butcher. Oh, and of course Marx advocated the killing of the bourgeoisie in his writings.
There’s others, of course, but all that’s just bunk. You’ve convinced me that the REAL danger are religious people. You know, for the reasons that you gave– the 9/11 mosque thing. And the fact that you used all caps and then wished death on all religious peoples.
Rather silly. Just because I am not religious doesn’t automatically make me a supporter of Mao or Stalin.
BTW, when did 2 wrongs make a right? Religions are justified in killing because Stalin did? Good Luck with that argument.
BTW, I am not angry. Long ago I learned that people like you would always be with us. If I was arguing for 1 reason to doubt evolution, it would be that people like you reproduce.
@ the mis-named Rational
“Just because I am not religious doesn’t automatically make me a supporter of Mao or Stalin.”
No. But as I said before, they’re atheists and have said religious people are violent murderous h8ters and suggested atheists are not. Facts don’t seem to bear that out.
“Good Luck with that argument.”
LOL. Thanks. Because I didn’t make it. Or why don’t you site where I said that? Good luck with that.
“BTW, I am not angry. Long ago I learned that people like you would always be with us.”
LOL. You mean people who point out the illogicality or your ill-conceived, bigoted, misinformed and overheated arguments? Well, good for you.
Here’s some examples of you NOT being angry: EVERYTHING IN ALL CAPS, “Nobody is listening; other than your fellow fanatics (of all religion stripes). Many of you are irrational, murderous h8trs.” and “You are a perfect example of what is wrong with the discussion in this country. You have no ability to comprehend what is written. You live on fallacies. Then you react rather than think. You are defensive and hostile.” and “It was I who was immediately insulted for not accepting the collective ‘wisdom’ of this far right-wing ideological site.” and “So basically your terse response has once again only served to show your willful ignorance. Also, your pro-gun crazy is showing that you will justify gun ownership by any argument regardless of whether it is based on fact.” and “We, the growing majority, will screw with your right to choose to own a gun”
LOL. Now that’s definitely some cool, collected, mature language there. Totally.
“If I was arguing for 1 reason to doubt evolution, it would be that people like you reproduce.”
Oh, that’s cute too. Got nothing left, so just throw it out, right?
LOL. You lose.
Islamists have kidnapped Catholic priests for $250k ransom, in Syria they’ve placed bombs in confessionals of Catholic churches, slaughtered Catholics leaving Christmas Mass, an Orthodox nun has detailed how Syrian Islamists behead, a la Daniel Pearl, Christians and sell their blood for $100k, days ago a man selling wood was lynched in the CAR…this isn’t eve scratching the surface of Islamist violence against Christians. What will happen to Israel in a nuclear-ized, radicalized region? They’re playing for keeps and the world ignores at their peril. I can’t read Jihad Watch or Pamela Gellar too much for it is so awful, yes I must read because it is so awful. The denouement will be terrifying.
Sell their blood? Interesting. Sure that isn’t a unsubstantiated rumor? Catholics used to claim that Jews killed christian children because they needed their blood for Passover Matzoh. Hint: Blood in matzoh would make it Unkosher.
Muslims claim that that is what Jews do to Christians. They teach that in their schools in Judea and Samaria, whilst Islamic killers buy and wash their hands in vials of that same blood.
“wash their hands in vials of that same blood.” I sincerely doubt they do that. A central tenet of their religion is that they CLEAN their hands (and feet) before prayer.
Until you stop being hysterical and stop the rumor mongering, there is no hope of having a rational conversation.
“Until you stop being hysterical and stop the rumor mongering, there is no hope of having a rational conversation.”
LOL.
This coming from a guy who wrote: “Many of you are irrational, murderous h8trs.” and “I find all organized religion equally abhorrent. Hindus and even Buddhists kill in the name of their religion. A pox on all your houses.”
Rational conversation… ha ha… you’re killing me.
Ethnic cleansing and persecution are pansy words for cold blooded murder with malice aforethought, caused by racism, hatred, religious intolerance.
It is the second oldest sin.
Religious jealousy and intolerance was why Cain killed Abel.
It’s been a long time since wars were fought and attrocities were committed in the name of Christianity. Now its the nutty radical Islamics who are doing it. But it shows how terrorism works in that everybody is afraid to offend the new perpetrators and leave the christians to their fates.
Evangelists went into Europe in bare feet and burlap robes and were executed for their trouble.
Why is it no one ever utters the phrase “people killed in the name of paganism”?
Religious persecution should be condemned. Christians are the most persecuted religion today. However, other religious groups also suffer persecution, including Hindus, Buddhists, Muslims, and those who follow traditional religions. Indeed, many of the statements on this very thread falsely paint all Muslims as terrorists.
Violence against Muslims soars in Central African Republic
Regarding any persecution of good anywhere, anytime consider this:
Evil & Antilove
“There really are people and institutions made up of people, who respond with hatred in the presence of goodness and would destroy the good insofar as it is in their power to do so. They do this not with conscious malice but blindly, lacking awareness of their own evil — indeed, seeking to avoid any such awareness. As has been described of the devil in religious literature, they hate the light and instinctively will do anything to avoid it, including attempting to extinguish it. They will destroy the light in their own children and in all other beings subject to their power.
Evil people hate the light because it reveals themselves to themselves. They hate goodness because it reveals their badness; they hate love because it reveals their laziness. They will destroy the light, the goodness, the love in order to avoid the pain of such self-awareness. My second conclusion, then, is that evil is laziness carried to its ultimate, extraordinary extreme. As I have defined it, love is the antithesis of laziness. Ordinary laziness is a passive failure to love. Some ordinarily lazy people may not lift a finger to extend themselves unless they are compelled to do so. Their being is a manifestation of nonlove; still, they are not evil.
Truly evil people, on the other hand, actively rather than passively avoid extending themselves. They will take any action in their power to protect their own laziness, to preserve the integrity of their sick self. Rather than nurturing others, they will actually destroy others in this cause. If necessary, they will even kill to escape the pain of their own spiritual growth. As the integrity of their sick self is threatened by the spiritual health of those around them, they will seek by all manner of means to crush and demolish the spiritual health that may exist near them.
I define evil, then, as the exercise of political power — that is, the imposition of one’s will upon others by overt or covert coercion — in order to avoid extending one’s self for the purpose of nurturing spiritual growth. Ordinary laziness is nonlove; evil is antilove.
M. Scott Peck, Psychiatrist & author
The Road Less Travelled
IMO a religion like Christianity helps to remind the human race of what it needs to survive. It’s meant to calm and inspire hope in our personal realms as they reside within earshot of another’s personal realm. It encourages belief in oneself and courage when we feel weak, understanding and respect when we feel defeated.
Because we are on our own we this kind of support.
Those who don’t gain that internal strength become frightened
and naturally resort to anger and hate.
And don’t forget – the world of Hate can be very profitable. Nobody is beating up Christians without some kickback.