Biden Admin Says It’s Too Dangerous to Evacuate Americans From Sudan
France, Germany, Italy, Spain, and Poland have even helped evacuate citizens of other countries and are still making efforts to evacuate citizens as our State Department implies Americans who chose to go to Sudan aren’t worthy to help.
It’s Afghanistan all over again.
The world can evacuate its citizens from Sudan as it spirals out of control between a paramilitary group and the government.
The Biden administration? Nope (emphasis mine):
On April 22, 2023, the U.S. Embassy in Khartoum suspended its operations, and the Department of State ordered the departure of U.S. direct hire employees and eligible family members from Embassy Khartoum due to the continued threat of armed conflict in Sudan. The U.S. government cannot provide routine or emergency consular services to U.S. citizens in Sudan, due to the current security situation.
Armed conflict is ongoing throughout Sudan and includes heavy fighting between various political and security groups. The situation is violent, volatile, and extremely unpredictable, particularly in the capital city Khartoum. Electrical and communication disruptions, including internet and cell phone service, can occur at any time. Khartoum International Airport and Sudan’s border with Chad are currently closed.
There are about 16,000 Americans stuck in Sudan. Two Americans have died in the violence.
State Department Undersecretary for Management John Bass told the media last weekend the administration likely wouldn’t help evacuate.
But then Bass said that the “State Department has had a travel advisory in place for more than a decade cautioning Americans not to travel to Sudan.”
Excuse me? So it’s their fault? They’re not worthy to help?
To make matters worse, the other countries are even evacuating citizens of other nations!
France evacuated 491 people, including Niger, Ireland, and American citizens. The French even took “the German ambassador and several other foreign ambassadors.”
Germany took citizens from 20 countries.
Italy helped Italians, Swiss, and other Europeans leave Sudan.
Spain took citizens from Argentina, Colombia, Ireland, Italy, Mexico, Portugal, and Poland.
Poland helped Spain and France.
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Comments
We couldn’t look worse
Afghanistan
Now this
WTF
We could look worse and with the remaining time left of the current administration I’m sure they will have ample opportunities to show us how much worse it can be.
Shades of apartheid in Afghanistan, Ukraine, China, etc.
Isn’t this what we have an army for?
The supposed greatest army in the world?
They can’t go yet. They’re waiting for their electric vehicles to be charged.
LOL!
They have a long wait if it’s a cloudy day…
The mission Statement of the US Army is to deter, fight and win the Nation’s wars. Do we have units to grab a single person or small group and bring them home? Sure a helo launched from a ship or friendly neighbor for extraction is one thing. Finding, gathering, protecting and transporting 16K with no functional airports is asking a lot more than you may realize. FWIW the damage to the airports from the recent air strikes is likely the deciding factor.
The Marines have units that are specially trained in extracting Americans (embassy personnel or ordinary citizens) from just about anywhere in the world. They are part of Marine Expeditionary Units that are on large amphibious assault ships. They have their own helicopters and air support.
These units could go into Sudan and organize an evacuation. Would they get everyone? Maybe not, but they’d get the very large majority. They would work to do it peacefully; if that didn’t work they’d kill everyone who was a threat to them or to the American citizens.
The point is, yes, we have units and plans. We could certainly do this if our leadership had the will to do so.
No kidding. Are all 16K at the Embassy? Nope they are likely scattered around and Sudan isn’t exactly the size of Rhode Island.. A MEU, Marine Expeditionary Unit isn’t enough. It’s a heavily reinforced BN with organic Air assets but lacks the lift capacity to do it. As I recall something like 4 Super Stallion heavy lift Helo, a dozen Osprey, a couple of lighter utility Helo that could be used for transport. Not for nothing but do we have a MEU in the Red Sea? Last time I checked we didn’t and Sudan don’t border the Med.
There isn’t a good pre existing plan to grab 16K folks out of Sudan in any comprehensive manner. To suggest otherwise is not serious. Are there contingency plans for Embassy EVAC and plans to for moving X amount of civilians out in and near the Embassy? Sure but that’s hundreds maybe up to 1K, certainly not for 16K.
To go in cold with no airport means using Airborne forces to seize the airports. Ranger Bat. Followed by a bunch of Combat engineers to and their heavy equipment to repair the runways which are cratered and unusable. Plus a BDE to hold the airport plus another BDE to do the searching, locating, securing, transporting and consolidation of 16K to the airport.
That’s minimum. Then add in a bunch of light vehicles to use to transport the folks unless you want them walking. Then add CAP from at least a carrier air wing. Then AF transport aircraft. All in the middle of a civil war.
Probably will PO folks in the region which I ain’t too worked up about but is a consideration. Might destabilize the regimes we pressure to give us over flight rights but again so what.
Bottom line is it can be done and probably should be done but it isn’t simple and damn sure isn’t easy or without consequences and casualties, maybe lots of both.
My pardon to everyone for posting this twice.
To everyone here demanding that the US bring out 16,000 people, please, read the comments from CommoChief and take notes. He’s been there, done that. I also spent several years in this region of Africa as a diplomat and was for a time a member of one of our counter-terrorism task forces. I have written those State Dept Travel Warnings for this region, and they are written for damn good reasons. This region is chaos and dysfunction defined – and the Sudan is huge, with less than a 3rd world infrastructure everywhere out of Khartoum.
And now I’m going to say something that will not sound nice at all, but here goes: practically all of these 16,000 US citizens are also Sudanese with BARELY any allegiance to the United States of America. I’ve met and assisted many, many “Americans” just like them. Peel back their veneer, and for them America exists simply to take from, never to give back to. Have you never heard of Ilhan Omar (Somalia)?
Please give me a number: how many dead American soldiers are the price you consider acceptable to pull off this evacuation in the land of utter chaos and dysfunction? Because there will be, 100% guaranteed, dead US soldiers if we attempt to bring out 16,000 people. Seriously, give us the acceptable number of dead. Just say it out loud.
But Italy and Poland can manage to do it without the backing of the most powerful military on earth.
1. But almost certainly not 16K.
2. I ain’t saying don’t do it or we can’t do or we shouldn’t do it.
3. I am pointing out the difficulty of the undertaking v the rah rah ‘Merica, Team USA BS that some seem to be slinging around as if this was somehow very easy.
Sooo, if you can’t get all 16,000 out, don’t try
Let Poland do it!
Nope. You are making an assumption and in this case only you are revealed as the jackass.
Still waiting on your plan for EVAC. Where is it? Have you got one? Can you formulate one? Maybe you can’t. Maybe all you can do is yell from bleachers b/c of those facts. Prove me wrong by showing us your plan.
I have laid out how big an undertaking this is. I don’t oppose it. Hell I think we probably should do it despite the inevitable consequences. Been there and done it.
What I won’t do is sing sunshine and roses that it is as simple or risk free as you seem to think. To just say ‘I want it’ is what toddlers do; they pitch a fit and make demands without any understanding or appreciation of what they are asking for or the price to be paid. In this respect you are acting like a child.
The problem is that US gov isn’t even trying, when Italy, Spain, France, and others are doing it. As for me formulating a plan, that’s not my job. We have (or should) state and military people who are experts at this and who should have had a plan of some sort already in place ready to be put into action. Another example of the near total incompetence of US gov.
There are a lot of places in the United States that are more dangerous than Sudan.
Stolen elections have consequences.
The US has a much larger population as whole and a far larger population of 1st, 2nd or 3rd generation immigrants than other Nations. So the comparison is a little unfair. That doesn’t mean we shouldn’t do anything but I doubt any other Western Nation has 16K Citizens in Sudan. That’s a big lift.
Same point for State Dept travel warnings, they issue those for a valid reason; namely that it’s a dangerous and/or unstable place where the US has limited ability to get your ass out of there when things go south as they are expected to.
IMO it’s the same sort of proposition as some hiker ignoring warnings not to go to X remote place due to weather or other conditions which make it unlikely anyone could find you or get you out. If the beach puts out a no swimming warning and you ignore it don’t complain about the undertow. Receiving fair warning is an upgrade from most of the experiences in life which usually just sneak up behind us to club us in the head.
Dang, you know other countries have put out warning s NOT to come to America because of the violence
gonzo,
Grow up. Sudan is a dangerous place with a damn civil war raging which is why the the airports are unusable by the way. The runways were cratered in the fighting.
Please tell us your plan on how to get all 16K out. How many troops on the ground for security? What’s the central location you bring them to? How many teams go looking for folks? What size elements are these teams; Platoon, Company, Battalion? Are there secondary or tertiary sites to use, Sudan is a big flipping place after all and these folks ain’t in a single block of apartments.
Do we use sea for extraction or try and repair airports? Sea means ground convoys very exposed to attack as would the loading up on whatever craft on the beach. Do we use amphibious assault vehicles or chartered/stolen craft? Both? Do we have Naval assets near or in place?
Let me take the position that the Romans had. The penalty for harming/killing a Roman citizen carried huge consequences. Look at St. Paul when he stated he was a Roman citizen… things got quiet very soon in that village. The US is a paper tiger. I would put the downfall with Jimmy Carter. The Russian ambassador to Australia was asked what would the USSR do about the seizure of the US embassy. Simple… 24 hours to release the hostages… if nothing after 24 hours… no more Teheran. The Russians proved that in Beirut when one of their agents was murdered. They found out who ordered the attack and sent them their family member in pieces shoe box by shoe box.
“The penalty for harming/killing a Roman citizen carried huge consequences.”
How very cute.
Don’t be coy. Your saying that the US government should kill 100 Sudanese for every American killed. Or maybe 50. It’s a despicable practice typical of dictators and tyrants.
Line them up against a wall or maybe in front of a trench? Machine-gun them. Then get more. Machine-gun them. Then force the next group to be machine-gunned to dig the next trench.
How very familiar.
No, Tiki, he’s not saying that. No one here is advocating the slaughter of innocent people. That’s simply a straw man argument.
But the penalty to the Sudanese army, or to Sudanese rebels, who get in our way while we bring out our citizens should indeed be substantial. If the Sudanese understand that up front, they might get out of the way while we retrieve our people. That is, after all, all we want.
Fine by me. Just make sure everyone is on board with that and the consequences that will flow from it.
I’ve stacked the bodies pretty damn damn high in my time on the sharp end of the stick. My concern is that some folks tend to get very rah rah initially then turn squeamish when the reality of these sorts of policies are made clear.
I am not opposed to getting these folks out of Sudan but it will have a cost. Some immediate and some longer-term. I am very prepared to accept the ramifications of going in but I doubt that the bulk of the population is ready to accept them.
Grow up? We spend trillions on our armies for situations such as these
You sound like the police that stand by while peaceful right leaning posters are beaten to death by Antifa
Cool. Wish we could have this conversation in the many parts of the Sandbox or Africa among other unpleasant places people were were trying to kill me ……but you weren’t in any of those places alongside us. Instead you chose not to participate in a two decade+ long series of conflicts despite our Homeland being attacked.
You sound just like the neocons grifters who never met a war they didn’t like. They never get tired of sending other peoples Sons and Daughters into harms way but never seem to find the time to serve personally.
Please don’t wave the bloody shirt at me or question my Patriotism or love of Country. I have damn well earned at least that much especially so from people who themselves stood by and didn’t enlist to serve in uniform as a civilian contractor or even volunteer to help run the USO coffee stands at airports.
I’m fully grown thank you
Don’t ask us, ask France, Germany, Italy, Spain, and Poland. They seem to have a clue.
Well, don’t let us keep you. I’m sure you are almost late for your shift as a police officer at the Uvalde school district. Don’t forget your headphones so you have something to listen to as you wait outside the door for everyone to be killed. It’s to dangerous to go in there, don’t cha know.
My disabilities incurred in combat operations and subsequent medical retirement from the Army after 26+ years of service preclude my employment as a LEO.
Though why isn’t such a strapping firebrand such as yourself off fighting for Zelensky in Ukraine? Oh yeah, now I remember, it’s way easier to be an internet warrior running their yap v actually signing on to real combat where you might get your candy ass shot.
I’m replying to my own comment because for some reason I can’t reply to yours. Thanks for your service. However, I would like to let you know that I’m not fighting for Zelinski (I don’t care how it is spelled) because there is no reason to fight for or support, in any way, joe biden’s money laundering operation cosplaying as a country. I appreciate that you served our country, but respectfully, I hope that other veterans would fight for and protect Americans. You, apparently, not so much.
Good. I wish more people would heed the advice to not come here.
The USA encourages, supports and funds NGOs in Sudan to carry out work the US Government supports. And then when the shit hits the fan, they tell them to fuck off. A lot of people are now stuck there who worked to support the US agenda and aid the Sudanese.
I haven’t argued against working to get our Citizens out. I have pointed out the enormity of the challenge as well as pointing out that State has in fact been warning folks not to travel to Sudan for some time.
I have compared the failure to heed that warning with those who ignore ‘no swim warnings’ at a beach, get caught in undertow and then get pissy about response to save them from their own folly. Obviously that doesn’t apply to our govt employees who are there b/c that’s where their Nation sent them.
Some of y’all are reading into my posts things that are not there. Don’t confuse my laying out how different it is to evac personal at an Embassy v locating, securing, transporting 16K people scattered all over Sudan with hostility to making the attempt.
If the government asks you to swim out there, and watches you swim out there, and then the undertow takes you, and they throw up their hands and walk away? That’s what we are talking about in many of these cases, I’m sure. First you smear them as anti patriotic and then you are up and down this thread saying we should just leave them there is just wrong, I’m sorry.
Jerry Springer, RIP. Who knew that one day a presidential cabinet would look like a guest lineup on the Jerry Springer Show?
Watch it, your off topic, can get you in trouble
No kidding
Joe biden
LOL!
You just Gravely insulted Jerry Springer guest lineups
And he was actually a decent mayor, back in the day.
Here and abroad, Biden’s pattern is to leave people behind, then to blame others regarding his failures. Another example of a cruel and corrupt person that, unfortunately, has all of us at his peril.
It’s the Biden Doctrine?
“Other countries may do anything they want, in any hemisphere.”
Oh, look, Janie! A balloon!
It is all a matter of priorities, If there were 16,000 wanna-be Mexican foreign invaders of this country; you can be sure that they would find the resources to try to save them. American citizens they can/will ignore as a matter of priorities.
Subotai Bahadur
Likely excuse as the retarded pedophile is caught with his pants down again. This is Afghanistan 2.0.
Since Slow Joe’s regime took power, the entire world is a much more dangerous place.
Too dangerous for the Army? Air Force? Marines? Implying that the Sudanese could stop us should automatically get you impeached, jailed, your ice cream taken away, and access to children eliminated.
The Army said, “No way. Send the Marines.”
The Marines said, “Someone might get hurt. Send the Seals.”
The Seals said, “Too dangerous. Send the Ukrainians.”
Zelensky held out his hand and said, “Moolah.”
Six months later. Nothing. Back to Zelensky. He says, “More Moolah.”
Exactly, comical if not so sad
Sudanese Spring
Good one
Just when you think that the vile, callous, stupid, useless and utterly incompetent Dumb-o-crats can’t plumb new depths of callousness, stupidity, uselessness and incompetence, they manage to surprise you.
Biden is such a scardie pants. It’s not like he has the entire US military to back him up or anything. LOL
You can no longer say “pants” in the US Military.
We have seen this movie before
Is anyone else surprised that there are 16,000 US citizens in Sudan?
Dual citizenship
What a disgrace!!
To everyone here demanding that the US bring out 16,000 people, please, read the comments from CommoChief and take notes. He’s been there, done that. I also spent several years in this region of Africa as a diplomat and was for a time a member of one of our counter-terrorism task forces. I have written those State Dept Travel Warnings for this region, and they are written for damn good reasons. This region is chaos and dysfunction defined – and the Sudan is huge, with less than a 3rd world infrastructure everywhere out of Khartoum.
And now I’m going to say something that will not sound nice at all, but here goes: practically all of these 16,000 US citizens are also Sudanese with BARELY any allegiance to the United States of America. I’ve met and assisted many, many “Americans” just like them. Peel back their veneer, and for them America exists simply to take from, never to give back to. Have you never heard of Ilhan Omar (Somalia)?
Please give me a number: how many dead American soldiers are the price you consider acceptable to pull off this evacuation in the land of utter chaos and dysfunction? Because there will be, 100% guaranteed, dead US soldiers if we attempt to bring out 16,000 people. Seriously, give us the acceptable number of dead. Just say it out loud.
All fair and astute points, but, at the same time, you do acknowledge that the U.S.’s utter passivity and tardy response, here, following in the wake of the Afghanistan withdrawal debacle, cements the notion of a totally inept, clueless and useless U.S. State Department?
Well they contracted some buses and got 300 people on them for a 500 mile trip to the Red Sea to embark for further movement. Supposedly drones flying to monitor them.
Sudan is a big flipping place and a very dangerous one. Again I don’t argue against doing what we can to get folks out. I do believe in going into things very clear eyed and realistic v starry eyed and unrealistic.
I sure as heck wouldn’t be in Sudan as a civilian nor most other places outside the US and would not go to lots of places inside the US due to potential danger. It doesn’t make sense to me to willingly take unnecessary risks.
Venturing to known dangerous places where an on again, off again civil war has been going on seems like a situation to avoid or at least one where folks should take individual responsibility for their folly instead of demanding a bail out from Uncle Sugar.
Fair points, Chief.
That’s the sign of a strong, thriving nation. You’re people are at risk, but it’s “too dangerous” to get them out.
at least they were shamed into making a half hearted effort
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/us-evacuates-american-civilians-from-sudan/