Image 01 Image 03

PayPal Updates User Policy to Include Possible $2,500 Fine For Speech It Doesn’t Like

PayPal Updates User Policy to Include Possible $2,500 Fine For Speech It Doesn’t Like

“PayPal’s clause about taking users’ funds for a violation of its rules has long been established. But […] effective on November 3rd, 2022, PayPal will add restrictions to its acceptable use policy that go beyond illegal activities and fraud and into the realm of policing speech.” – via Reclaim the Net.

It’s no big secret that Big Tech’s tentacles have a vast reach, with platforms like Facebook and Twitter admitting in so many words after the fact to deliberately suppressing news content prior to the 2020 presidential election that portrayed then-Democratic nominee for president Joe Biden and his international wheelin’ and dealin’ son Hunter in a less than flattering light being one of the more notable examples.

But as has already been made clear by online payment systems like PayPal and Venmo, even more silencing of alternative points of view is needed in the form of financial strangulation if necessary, which can occur via shutting down accounts entirely or, in PayPal’s case, will soon also potentially include $2,500 fines for WrongThink, according to a recently updated acceptable use policy set to take effect in November.

As reported by Reclaim the Net:

PayPal’s clause about taking users’ funds for a violation of its rules has long been established. But, as published on September 26th and to be effective on November 3rd, 2022, PayPal will add restrictions to its acceptable use policy that go beyond illegal activities and fraud and into the realm of policing speech.

The updated policy prohibits users from using PayPal for activities that:

“Involve the sending, posting, or publication of any messages, content, or materials that, in PayPal’s sole discretion, (a) are harmful, obscene, harassing, or objectionable … (e) depict, promote, or incite hatred or discrimination of protected groups or of individuals or groups based on protected characteristics (e.g. race, religion, gender or gender identity, sexual orientation, etc.) … (g) are fraudulent, promote misinformation … or (i) are otherwise unfit for publication.”

Big Tech platforms are increasingly finding ways to punish people’s speech under the guise of banning 🛡 “misinformation,” and making themselves as the arbiters of truth in deciding what is and isn’t true.

Yep, and in PayPal’s case, they specifically state that they can fine users $2,500 for alleged “misinformation” and supposed hate speech.

“Violation of this Acceptable Use Policy constitutes a violation of the PayPal User Agreement and may
subject you to damages, including liquidated damages of $2,500.00 U.S. dollars per violation, which may be debited directly from your PayPal account(s),” the new policy reads.

As also noted, PayPal has been under fire in the U.K. in recent weeks for what critics called viewpoint-based discrimination against users:

Two weeks ago, PayPal shuttered the account of the Free Speech Union, a London-based organization founded by social commentator Toby Young to advocate for free expression. PayPal also closed Young’s personal account and that of his news and opinion website, The Daily Sceptic.

On Tuesday, PayPal reinstated the accounts, but only after sustained public criticism of the company’s apparently viewpoint-discriminatory actions.


In typically murky fashion, PayPal initially gave Young no reason for the bans other than to say that the accounts violated the company’s vague acceptable use policy. However, a PayPal spokesperson told the press, “Achieving the balance between protecting the ideals of tolerance, diversity and respect for people of all backgrounds and upholding the values of free expression and open dialogue can be difficult, but we do our best to achieve it.” Other reports indicate PayPal’s decision to close the accounts had to do with alleged COVID-19 misinformation.

Gosh, this all sounds nauseatingly familiar, doesn’t it?

What’s especially horrid about how PayPal operates beyond being able to yank $2,500 from your account because you posted something they disagree with is that there typically is no advance warning and no appeals process. It just happens and you have very little recourse, as GetPayment explained:

PayPal creates their own Acceptable Use Policy, which effectively allows them to play by their own rules. Their payment processing services are unregulated compared to full-service merchant services providers. That means merchants have no legal recourse to resolve these issues or get their funds reimbursed.

To make matters worse, there is no defined appeals process. They can ban you without warning, potentially without allowing you to cash out your account balance for six months. Plus, they can fine you multiple times to deplete your balance—and there’s not much you can do to stop them.

As to how to fight back against such Orwellian tactics? Getting even louder is, of course, a big reason why Big Tech operations like PayPal put such policies in place, to begin with.

While there are some viable alternatives to PayPal, their partnerships with financial institutions can mean the service providers and users possibly being subjected to woke ESG standards and summarily canceled as a result, which Republican governors like Florida’s Ron DeSantis are trying to stop.

Still, they are worth exploring for anyone concerned with PayPal’s increasing overreach and control over what its users say on their websites.

— Stacey Matthews has also written under the pseudonym “Sister Toldjah” and can be reached via Twitter. —


Donations tax deductible
to the full extent allowed by law.


Paypal has a fiduciary duty to its customer (you) and can’t seize your money without due process. You’re paying a percentage for service.

    Paul in reply to rhhardin. | October 6, 2022 at 9:14 am

    Good luck taking them to court. In the meantime they’ll have your $. I’m headed off to cancel my PayPal account now.

      angrywebmaster in reply to Paul. | October 6, 2022 at 6:10 pm

      I would suggest filling criminal charges against the CEO. I’ll let the legals eagles respond on the viability of this suggestion,

        taurus the judge in reply to angrywebmaster. | October 7, 2022 at 8:58 am

        What charge?

          Violation of First amendment rights? Illegal seizure of private property?

          Durak Kazyol in reply to taurus the judge. | October 7, 2022 at 9:19 am

          Theft. Why not?

          taurus the judge in reply to taurus the judge. | October 7, 2022 at 9:56 am

          @Durak & Rebar

          I read that policy in the link.

          The way I read it in terms of contract law that in order to use their services you must “agree” to that policy as a T&C of using their service.

          It does NOT list anything about any disagreement/arbitration or how those “damages” are assessed or calculated but I’m sure that’s somewhere.

          And since the user is “free to walk away” from PayPal…

          I don’t see any basis for any primary charge – criminal or civil (might could dispute an amount but not the ability to levy penalty)

      Darn it, I can’t figure out how to paste a screenshot of my account cancellation email here. I sure hope the fine print doesn’t include a clause saying it’s entitled to $2,500.00 for cancelling the service. Anyway, I’ll make a joke instead: ELON MUSK MUST BUY PAYPAL.

    mailman in reply to rhhardin. | October 6, 2022 at 9:20 am

    That is meaningless because once they have your money its then up to you to get it back. So, good luck with that.

    A commenter from the EU posted about PayPal collections being stolen in the EU …

    If anyone is interested, in the EU, this is their [PayPal] playbook:

    – Ignore all communications unless it’s a C&D from lawyers

    – Deflect responsibility to PayPal Luxembourg.

    – They have, or have had literally 90% of LU lawyers retained, meaning
    your case will not / cannot be accepted by the majority of LU law-firms
    due to conflict of interest

    – Deflect onto the CSSF (Luxembourg Monetary Watchdog)

    – Respond to the CSSF that the complaining company is not based in
    Luxembourg, which results in the CSSF concluding that they are not the
    competent structure to rule.

    – Case closed, your funds have been stolen, and PayPal has artfully dodged the relevant regulatory bodies.

    Milhouse in reply to rhhardin. | October 6, 2022 at 10:32 am

    It would be nice if that were true, but their Terms of Service are a contract and once you have been given adequate notice of the amendment you’re bound by it.

    Also, you only pay a percentage on commercial receipts. If you don’t sell anything with payment on Paypal you don’t pay anything. Not that that makes a difference.

      Linda P. in reply to Milhouse. | October 8, 2022 at 1:40 pm

      A contract can be found unenforceable by virtue of it being unconscionable. Certainly the amount PayPal expects to charge for the unacceptable information is unconscionably high, but also the list of provisions triggering the penalty is unconscionably vague.

    JHogan in reply to rhhardin. | October 6, 2022 at 11:29 am

    Are you really that naïve? They can do whatever their use agreement says they can do. And they can update that anytime they like.

    For example, Citibank has a clause in their user agreement that states they can freeze and even seize your funds for no reason at all. That is, they do not have to give you a reason. If anyone has an account with Citibank they should close it ASAP.

    The best thing to do is avoid PayPal as much as possible and spread your liquid assets across as many financial institutions as you can manage, avoiding any that use ESG and/or DEI in their literature.

    My use of Paypal has plummeted in the last year. I use it for nothing but ebay purchases.

    I’m hoping an alternative becomes available sooner rather than later. There are some reports Musk would like to add payment processing functionality to Twitter.

      A Punk Named Yunk in reply to JHogan. | October 7, 2022 at 10:03 am

      > My use of Paypal has plummeted in the last year. I use it for nothing
      > but ebay purchases.

      I’ve never used either. But when does ebay start using the same theft policy as paypal?

    JohnSmith100 in reply to rhhardin. | October 6, 2022 at 6:54 pm

    I was running 2 nonprofits which accepted donations via PayPal, they froze on account, and a few weeks later the second account. At that point I removed PayPal as an option from both web sites.

    I cut off communication, they were demanding a lot of intrusive information, info which they were not entitled to have.

    A few months later they unlocked the accounts, I promptly emptied them, and have not used PayPal to receive money since then. I do have a personal PayPal account which is used to buy stuff on Ebay, I only do so when I cannot find a decent price elsewhere.

    I have noticed that Ebay prices are inflated, it appears that there is an organized effort to push prices up on Ebay. Historically I would prices spread out for the same item, sometimes 2,3 or even a 4 fold range from high to low. I am seeing tightly clustered prices now.

      Tionico in reply to JohnSmith100. | October 7, 2022 at 2:10 pm

      You do not NEED a PayPal accountto buy on eBay. Set up to use your own credit/debit card. I never use PayPal to buy on eBay. The transaction shows up on my CC statement as a purchase from eBay, not PayPal.

      As to using them as a funds collector.. after they burned me badly years ago on an eBay purchase THEY messed up (drew funds from the wrong account, where there were none, instead of the one I designated which is where the funds WERE) I changed my tactics for using PayPal.

      I have one bank account that does NOTHING but PayPal transfers inbound. The account tags as legit, but as soon as anything drops in there I move it to a separate account, and PayPal cannot ciimb over that wall. Worst case I’ll lose that transaction if I don’t snag it quicky enough. SInce there never is any money in there but a few cents/bucks, they cannot snag anything from me at will.
      Now they charge a fee for EVERY transaction I rarely use them Zelle works well. Wish we could use that for eBay purchases/sales. But eBay seem quite zealous of using PayPal exclusively. No surprise.. they startd out as somewhere between siamese twins and a single entity.

      I believe pricing in eBay is so narrow simly because there are hundreds of new junk vendors selling exactly the same goods from exactly the same factory in CHina. I have suspected that many of the “different” vendors are actually the same one, different account and business name, but same droids behind it.

      Unique items not purchased by the steamship canload from offshore maintain signficant price differentials. I save searches and get notices when new listings show up. I know what I am willing to pay, and just wait. For the most part it eventually comes up. Otherwise I can do without, or pay the piper his toll. But NOT using PayPal.

E Howard Hunt | October 6, 2022 at 9:27 am

Every conservative mouthpiece should harp on this relentlessly. This is one fight we can decidedly win. When people find out about this, the company will be brought down on its knees and revoke the policy.

Even cursory wiki look at PP CEO tells it all – which is true of many articles on LI.

“However, a PayPal spokesperson told the press, “Achieving the balance between protecting the ideals of tolerance, diversity and respect for people of all backgrounds and upholding the values of free expression and open dialogue can be difficult, but we do our best to achieve it.”

Realize, of course, “tolerance, diversity, and respect for people of all backgrounds and upholding the values of FREE EXPRESSION ….” only applies to people who agree with PayPal’s constantly shifting ideals.

This is a private company doing a test drive of what adoption of digital currency would look like. Replace PayPal with the govt and imagine Scary Poppins (Nina Jankowicz) as the bureaucrat empowered to decide whether your bank account should be depleted based on what she finds objectionable.

That’s a real possibility.

    Mauiobserver in reply to CommoChief. | October 6, 2022 at 2:55 pm

    That is exactly the point with digital currency. The Liberal World Order and the OBiden Regime hope to enforce their ideology by confiscating assets of those who display reactionary behavior or commit speech and thought crimes. It is also the goal of ESG to mandate a policy of reward your friends and punish your enemies as expressed by Obama which turned out to be the policy of his administration.

Translation: If we feel like it, we can take all your money out of your account, and their ain’t nothing you can do about it.

I just closed my account (which I hadn’t used for a long time).

I have not used the scummy outfit since someone I had never heard of tapped my account with bogus charges out of the blue, and I had a hell of a time canceling the charges. This new fraud is just another reason to douche them from your life.

    Roguewave1 in reply to Roguewave1. | October 6, 2022 at 10:22 am

    Oh, and btw, that PP account the fraudsters tapped was one I thought I had closed years before, so do not be so sure that when you “close your account” that Pay Pal does not retain their access to your bank account to do as they will.

The list in your article is good, but what alternatives do we have for non-merchants who use the service?

    henrybowman in reply to The Livewire. | October 6, 2022 at 6:49 pm

    You’ll have to check with them.
    I maintained a few subscription payment arrangements via PayPal, mostly for annual software renewals, but one for a monthly donation to a nonprofit. At the time I set it up, they could only do PayPal. When I rechecked, I found they had added Patreon, so I just opened a monthly donation arrangement through Patreon instead. By now, you’re probably not the first donor they’ve had inform them “I’m ditching PayPal,” so they may well have already added another payment arrangement you can use.

      A Punk Named Yunk in reply to henrybowman. | October 7, 2022 at 10:07 am

      Patreon has been notoriously closing accounts of people & companies that have a wrong-think complaint lodged against them. Patreon is no solution to this.

I decoupled PayPal from my bank account because some transactions that were supposed to go on my credit card got debited from my bank instead.

I’ve never left money in my PayPal account, and never will. It’s a convenience, but one I’m prepared to reconsider.

    Paul in reply to McGehee. | October 6, 2022 at 10:39 am

    This is a key point… PayPal basically provides a layer of ‘ecommerce convenience’ but ultimately they process charges against the underlying accounts that you configure in your PayPal account.

    If you link to your credit cards, then you’re still afforded a great deal of consumer protection that is built into the US credit card system (the ability to dispute any charges within 30 days, etc).

    But if you let them link to your bank account via the ACH system, far fewer protections apply.

    That being said, and knowing what a corporate bully they are, I bet you’d have a hard time even disputing a credit card charge made by PayPal if they pointed back to their TOS.

    Most definitely un-link any bank accounts (checking or savings).

    But to be safe, cancel PayPal completely.

      I had a few recurring payments going to PayPal — I’ve changed them over to directly charging a credit card instead, and removed all payment options from my PayPal account.

      I’ll probably end up closing the account altogether.

      henrybowman in reply to Paul. | October 6, 2022 at 10:05 pm

      “If you link to your credit cards, then you’re still afforded a great deal of consumer protection that is built into the US credit card system (the ability to dispute any charges within 30 days, etc).”

      Only you don’t. The CC issuer sees that the payment went to PayPal, and immediately throws up its hands and says, “you have to have PayPal work it first.” And PayPal will dawdle sufficiently so that by the time they mishandle it and you go back to the CC issuer, your grace period has expired.

Close The Fed | October 6, 2022 at 10:37 am

I’m going to close my account and switch to Gab Pay.

We’ll see how it goes.

    Close The Fed in reply to Close The Fed. | October 6, 2022 at 10:38 am

    Which of course is an outgrowth of Andrew Torba’s social media site.

    Andrew Torba is in his 30s, married with two kids, Catholic I believe, and lives in Pennsylvania, far from Silicon Valley.

    He’s been there, done that, has the t-shirt, and said it wasn’t for him.

Antifundamentalist | October 6, 2022 at 10:44 am

While I have only used paypal a small number of times over the years, this is reason enought for me to refuse to do business with any entity that doesn’t give me an option for another method of payment.

Red state legislatures need to step into the breach and make this practice illegal immediately -and include fines sufficient to reimburse the state not only for their cost to intervene, but high enough to fund a whole judical department to do nothing but pursue these busibody companies.

The Gentle Grizzly | October 6, 2022 at 11:08 am

I’m old. Behind the times. What is PayPal good for? What can it do a credit card can’t?

I’m being serious here.

    Most people can’t receive credit card payments (except through PayPal or a similar service).

    A few things that come to mind:

    They’re integrated with a ton of e-commerce sites, and purchasing by clicking the ‘pay with paypal’ button means you don’t have to key in all your billing and shipping information… it flows into the e-commerce site automatically via their integration with paypal.

    If you set up your recurring charges with paypal (let’s say you have 10 of them) then you only have to update your credit card information in one place instead of ten whenever your card renews or is replaced for some reason.

    You can use it to exchange funds with other individuals (there are a lot of other options for this these days, but back in ‘the day’ when paypal started, this was their huge feature.

      The Gentle Grizzly in reply to Paul. | October 6, 2022 at 12:24 pm

      CapOne is badgering me to link my card to PayPal. Thank you.

      henrybowman in reply to Paul. | October 6, 2022 at 7:05 pm

      “If you set up your recurring charges with paypal (let’s say you have 10 of them) then you only have to update your credit card information in one place instead of ten whenever your card renews or is replaced for some reason.”

      Curiously enough, this is less than true. I went through this recently. PayPal allows you to associate multiple cards and/or bank accounts with your PayPal account. Every automatic payment is actually linked to one of these. If your credit card is cancelled and replaced with another, and you reflect this at PayPal, your automatic payments don’t automatically migrate over to it. They’re stuck on the old card. When the old card fails to pay, they either fail completely or fail over to your bank account, which is almost certainly not what you expected.

        That would be new behavior, but I don’t doubt it for a second. PayPal is constantly jostling with the banks and credit card companies as they compete for customers and transaction volume. Moving money through the ACH system (via savings and checking accounts) is a heckuva lot less expensive than credit card transactions. The more they can wean people off their credit cards, the more money they can make (all while exposing the consumer, unknowingly, to a lot more risk.)

        This is a feature of the “new” authentication mechanisms. It used to be that vendors would store the entire credit card information – cc, exp, cvv, billing address, etc. I know of several large companies that went to great lengths to separate all this data so a breach wouldn’t be catastrophic, though a real breach this was rarely the case. They have switched to a “token” system – you authenticate the credit card info initially, the issuer returns a token, and the vendor can reuse the token depending on what you are buying. So, when you change a credit card number, the token is tied to the number, so you must redo all the tokens. Stealing the tokens doesn’t get you anything because there are other mechanisms in place to validate that the transaction is coming from the right places.

    JohnSmith100 in reply to The Gentle Grizzly. | October 7, 2022 at 10:52 am

    I only use PayPal for Ebay and I always use a charge card, I never fund via direct withdrawals to the from a bank. I never receive money via PayPal. Also, I think that their contract is one of “contract of adhesion”, and that it, and many others should be attaced on that basis. The same is true for software, where all they guarntee is that they will take your money.

    BierceAmbrose in reply to The Gentle Grizzly. | October 8, 2022 at 2:09 am

    PayPal works with some international website purchases that won’t process vanilla US credit or debit cards. It changes over time, but PayPal has been an easier “international” processor sometimes.

    I bought some modeling software from a project in Brazil, which in odd synchronicity I used in a show and tell earlier today.

Sounds like criminal theft to me. Maybe even conspiracy to commit grand theft.

If you walk into a supermarket and the manager grabs your wallet and removes money and puts in his pocket, that would be called robbery. But if he says that your MAGA hat is against supermarket policy (as written in small letters on a small sign inside the door) and that the store reserves the right to fine you, does that mean it’s no longer robbery?

Of course not.

smalltownoklahoman | October 6, 2022 at 12:08 pm

I cancelled my Paypal a few days ago when I first caught wind of this. Thankfully I didn’t have it attached to any bank accounts. It’s a scummy nasty move they are trying to pull and as the article mentions it ain’t the first time they’ve pulled some sh*t. Here, a video from a little over a month ago talking about their shady practices and how they screw over artists and those who trade in digital goods:

I closed my PayPal account long ago for behavior far less egregious than this. I get along just fine without it. What possible reason can there be to accept policies like this from a non-essential service like PayPal?

    The Gentle Grizzly in reply to SukieTawdry. | October 6, 2022 at 12:26 pm

    PayPal seems to be one of those answers to questions. I’m not asking.

      henrybowman in reply to The Gentle Grizzly. | October 6, 2022 at 6:56 pm

      PayPal basically provides independent tradesmen or businesses too small to afford the monthly base fee for a normal merchant account, the ability to accept credit card payments. We used to use it to collect deposits for our VRBO property. For an average of one transaction a month, a merchant account is not economical.

      The other “advantage” used to be to keep your CC information out of the hands of merchants you had no reason to trust… but the protections afforded against fraud by your CC are actually quicker and superior to those PayPal offers.

        BierceAmbrose in reply to henrybowman. | October 8, 2022 at 2:15 am

        Yeah, merchant accounts on the low end are brutal.

        It looks like QuickBooks business is getting into parts of that segment. They have a bundle for contractors / service providers, and my landlord uses it for half a dozen rentals.

        Some smaller retailers take “cash only”, made easier by the now-ubiquitous ATMs. BUT, Civil Asset Forfeiture is a thing, and under The Wars On All The Things, any handful of cash is presumptively associated with a crime. That just gets more ironic as clearing systems, banks and services cut out from time to time.

The only remedy for this outrage from Paypal is an act of Congress. That is why it is vital that we win on Nov 8, and take a good Senate majority to overcome the filibuster.

Saw this when the notification from Paypal about TOS changes came out a week ago. Other than sending money to my kid and as a pay source for eBay, I don’t use it and closed my account already. Unamerican bastards.

    henrybowman in reply to MrE. | October 6, 2022 at 7:08 pm

    What’s annoying is that one suggestion would have been for you to use Venmo instead, but PayPal now owns Venmo.

    I’m going to have to look into this GAB payments thing (thanks for the link).

      henrybowman in reply to henrybowman. | October 6, 2022 at 8:08 pm

      I use Zelle a lot more than Venmo for this stuff, but you’re just trading one demon for another. Zelle is owned by a consortium of banks that include BOA, Chase, and WF, all woke offenders.

No way this is legal

People still use paypal? What are you thinking, I stopped several years ago when they came out as a far left pro abortion, BLM and anti-2cd Amendment outfit. The same for the banks. I use a couple of credit unions and have for a number of years.
Just Say No

    JohnSmith100 in reply to diver64. | October 7, 2022 at 11:03 am

    I dumpted banks for credit unions years ago, but you still need to be careful, some CU’s have outragious fees, carefully review their fee structure before joining.

When I opened this article, I had four PayPal accounts.
Now I have none.

This is the objectionable clause:

“involve the sending, posting, or publication of any messages, content, or materials that, in PayPal’s sole discretion, (a) are harmful, obscene, harassing, or objectionable, (b) depict or appear to depict nudity, sexual or other intimate activities, (c) depict or promote illegal drug use, (d) depict or promote violence, criminal activity, cruelty, or self-harm (e) depict, promote, or incite hatred or discrimination of protected groups or of individuals or groups based on protected characteristics (e.g. race, religion, gender or gender identity, sexual orientation, etc.) (f) present a risk to user safety or wellbeing, (g) are fraudulent, promote misinformation, or are unlawful, (h) infringe the privacy, intellectual property rights, or other proprietary rights of any party, or (i) are otherwise unfit for publication.”

I find the boldface parts most objectionable; “PayPal’s sole discretion,” and “etc.” This is precisely where we find ourselves with FakeBook, Twatter, and other leftist filtered sites. Both invite abuse, since the specifics are not spelled out, and the can make/change things arbitrarily and unilaterally.

Not a formula that is welcoming to conservatives nowadays.

Planning on terminating my PayPal account. It has been a convenience that I cannot tolerate in light of these unacceptable conditions. BTW, I was unaware of the $2500 fine policy (no one really reads all the fine print), so thanks for pointing that out. Perhaps if enough users follow, PayPal will either change its policy or go bankrupt — the latter would be a good lesson to all woke businesses. Keep it up and you will become irrelevant.

PioneerLawyer | October 7, 2022 at 9:09 am

Correct me if I’m wrong, but, don’t liquidated damages have to be somewhat rationally connected to actual losses to be enforceable? They can add this langugage to the contract all they want, but, I think a class action could make this me unenforceable.

I closed my PP account about a year ago when I heard about their fascist policies. I just use my credit card online now, safer and they seem to respond to any issue I have.

DUMP PAYPAL … we don’t need them!
Open a second checking account dedicated to nothing but online purchases where you only keep a minimum – $5-$10 – balance. When you want to make an online purchase transfer funds for the purchase price plus shipping.

One of the better online payment platforms I found was AlignPay, which was designed from the get-go to be anti-woke. I’m definitely going to use it for whenever I need to request money, and if someone asks me for money, my first response is “Do you have an AlignPay account?”

I hope it will keep growing in popularity.

Screw PayPal. I dumped them years ago.

I was going to withdrawal all the money in my account – but you cannot get the money unless you have a checking or savings account listed, or a debit card. They will not mail a check if you don’t have checking or savings listed. So this is getting me pissed off.

    BierceAmbrose in reply to intermod. | October 8, 2022 at 2:26 am

    “Prepaid” debit cards in the US, the kind you get at a convenience store and “load” with cash vs. “deposit” in a bank, typically clear as or are associated with a checking account (with no checks.)

    As cards they clear on the standard networks: visa, mastercard for payments, Cirrus and NYCe here in the fields surrounding Gotham.

    I’ve never had PayPal associated with a “real” bank account for pull-through n data leak risks. Indeed, I maintain a prepaid card for all online transactions for the same reasons. With the LL preferring rent electronically as well, I end up loading that card more than I’d like.

    Back in the day when I traveled all the time for work, I picked up this habit. Various folks are quite clever about picking up your account and related. Some even declare the right to change their terms, or suck additional money if you offend them. An isolated card account with limited funds caps the risk. If you must, carry access to your “real” account sealed up, to be grabbed only in emergencies.

    When you have to treat your vendors and partners like thieves and scammers looking to bleed you, probably time to look for different vendors and partners.

    We have come to this.

Can someone clue me in. How does this work? Do people use paypal to convey ideas and opinions?

    BierceAmbrose in reply to DesertBunny. | October 8, 2022 at 2:45 am

    In the term as quoted above, guilt by association.

    You sent a payment to someone unacceptable. Used PayPal to secure hosting for your wrongthink blog. Perhaps you “permitted” some unacceptable commenting in “your” platform, paid for using their processing.

    Recall what happened with Parler and Amazon Web Services among other service providers. The claim was that *users* of the platform said stuff beyond the pale. So, Amazon summarily nuked Parler’s hosting, something it could do under it’s service terms. Amazon web services terms of service suck in more ways than just this.) The timing of this related to Parler’s growth and US political cycles inspired some to think there were motives beyond mere distaste.

    Recall also “Operation Chokepoint” undertaken under the Obama Presidency, orchestrated by his AG, self-proclaimed “wing man.” Letters and other communications from administration thugs law enforcement to mainly financial services suggesting that working with some *legal* businesses wouldn’t be so great, and wouldn’t you know, people get their accounts canceled. “Banks” have lists of types of businesses they consider sketchy: may not serve or may impose different terms n conditions on them.

    The FBI having a “would be a shame if you got caught spewing misinformation” meeting with Facebook is just a variation of this tactic. What they can’t enforce directly they go after other ways. Then, they brag about doing in on the D-L, to audiences that want that thing done, and how doesn’t matter. Kinda like we found out that The Dowager Empress’s “basket of deplorables” wasn’t a one-off gaffe, but a recurring riff in her donor speech to true believers.

Pay Pal can suck it. I won’t use them for anything, ever.

my wife is in charge of this stuff at my credit union.
let them try,

Sounds like conspiracy to commit theft. If they actually do it, sounds like theft. Maybe felony grand theft. If they did that to me, I would report them to law enforcement. There are also strong consumer protection laws which include attorney fee provisions and punitive damages. Florida might not be such a friendly forum for corporate criminality.

PayPal is not even useful for protecting you from scams anymore. Last time a seller screwed me PayPal did not help at all. I had to go to my credit card company to get it straightened out.

The best I can tell, PayPal provides no service at all now that your credit card company does not already provide, and it adds a huge amount of risk with this new policy.

Theft is not legal just because a contract is in effect. Getting the justice system in this country to act is nearly impossible of course.

I’m cancelling pp right now.

PP has rescinded this new policy, stating it was a mistake.

It means one hell of a lot of people said CANCEL.
I will not go back.