My overall sense of what happened at Mar-a-Lago is that this is a provocation.
If New York Times reporting is right — and they never err on the side of being soft on Trump — then this raid was over documents the National Archives thinks Trump should not have, or perhaps classified documents in his possession. That is not something the FBI raids major political candidates over — See, In Re Hillary Rodham Clinton.
This is a provocation. They are trying to get a reaction that allows a further crackdown. See, In Re J6.
It’s also a provocation to get Trump to declare his candidacy for President before the midterms. Democrats would love to turn 2022 into a referendum on Trump rather than the deliberate destruction of the national borders and inflation.
Would the FBI and DOJ do such a thing? Aren’t they “above” politics? The then FBI Director James Comey admitted to trying to set up the new President Trump by alerting him to the Steele Dossier, and then leaked the story of the briefing to CNN, which gave license to report on the false allegations in the dossier. So yes, the FBI and DOJ would do such a thing, and have done such a thing to Trump.
All the more reason to keep your heads about you.
Don’t take the bait. Being stupid isn’t tough, it’s just stupid.
I flipped back and forth between CNN and MSNBC. At least when I watched, they were not engaging in the expected celebrations. There was a palpable dread that this could backfire against the Democrats. Bigly.
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Yea, quite possible.
In any event, they are frightened of something, something big.
Trump.
100 Thumbs Up!
They know if Trump comes back, especially with a large Congressional majority, so will “Schedule F”. All those Deep State SES and GS15-16s in the DOJ and the Intelligence community are going to be reclassified as political appointees and fired. This is about self-preservation.
Also, they are terrified and executing the political equivalent of a scorched earth policy in advance of their anticipated crushing defeat at the polls in Nov.
That is, assuming the Regime permits elections and allows us to vote. Who knows what new national emergency and imminent threat to our ‘precious democracy’ Dark Brandon and his flying monkeys may declare between now and then.
They believe they can use the archive statute to keep Trump from running again.
Yes, Marc Elias tweeted that as the strategy.
https://twitter.com/marceelias/status/1556794749377454080?s=21&t=QUi2I0WBmY3xtC-sTOeIDQ
As I said down below, the republican party is part of this. They have been opposing Trump, and through him, us, all along. They feds will concoct a felony charge against Trump. It will be bogus of course. The R party will then exclude Trump from the R nomination because he has been indicted for a disqualifying charge.
Will they get away with it? Probably. They don’t care what you think. They are as crooked as the democrats.
And they are doing nothing about this just like they did nothing about Russia/russia/russia/impeachment 1/impeachment 2/jan 6.
People are locked up in DC, no bail, no trial, and the republican party has done what?
They are part of the sham trial in the house.
They pulled the stunt of claiming a *present* President could break Executive Privilege for a *previous* President, which is going to backfire something terrible (for them) in about two years. Now they’re establishing a former President can be subject to an FBI raid with his belongings confiscated on what I suspect will be tissue-thin ‘probable cause’
Let us know when they publish the warrant and it is properly fisked. They must be well and truely desperate to pull this kind of stunt without any consideration for the long-term consequences.
Note: they have only established that a current Democrat president can revoke the executive privilege of a prior Republican president. The minute a Republican president tries it, it will be over ruled by the courts and bureaucracy.
That is not to say it is a good precident, merely that the courts seem to only be steely-eyed straight shooters when it suits them, and not when it does not.
Either that, or they are overly confident that they have the clout to do what they want to whomever they want – aND they have begun making examples to prove it. In other words, they believe they have their fixes in place and won’t ever lose any election they want to win.
If they were able to fix elections with high confidence there would be no need to send Trump to jail. No, this is because they do not have such confidence. They probably thought they would win 2020 by a much higher margin than they actually did in the key states. They probably thought GA, AZ, PA, and WI would be collectively won by millions of votes, not by less than 100,000. And they know that if Trump comes back, so does “Schedule F”. The prospect of Schedule F returning has them spooked out of their skins. The Democrats are inserting a provision into this year’s appropriations to prevent it from ever coming back, but that can be undone by a future Congress. That is why they must send Trump to jail, and they have to do well enough in the Senate contests that DeSantis won’t be able to get 60 Senate votes in 2025. And that is why the GOP Senators must do everything they can this year to prevent that provision from being put in the annual appropriations.
There’s no evidence GOP senators aren’t fully on board and complicit.
Actually there is,
This would be literally the kiss of death to any GOP politician.
If any, only a select few could be involved.
You are out of your mind.
There is no pushback by the R party. None. Zero. Nada. Zip.
They are worse than the D [arty because they confuse loyalists like you.
Barry! Bro! You just agreed with WTPuck! Look closely – he used a double negative. ‘There’s no way they’re not complicit in this’ 😉 😉
Mr E, due to the vagaries of this web sight, my comment was actually directed at taurus the judge.
I got the WTPuck sentence just fine.
Preventing Trump from running will, they hope, lower the effort needed to steal the election. They fear that the effort necessary to steal a presidential election that includes Trump would be too massive to conceal.
The effort necessary to steal the 2020 presidential election was too massive to conceal, but it happened nonetheless.
Replying to jpwcpa:
It should be obvious that they cheated in 2020 hoping that it would not be uncovered. The fact that it was (even without any real consequences for them) gives them pause from doing something similar, now that they know they can’t conceal it, and keeps them from doing something even more egregious, with no guarantee that they will be able to avoid the consequences.
If they thought they could cheat again, and get away with it without consequences, that’s what they’d do. They’re sure they can cheat and win. They proved that. But having been caught at it in 2020, even without consequences, has made them gun-shy.
georgfelis: They pulled the stunt of claiming a *present* President could break Executive Privilege for a *previous* President
By “they” you mean the courts, which has found that an ex-president’s privilege claims are much weaker than the current president’s. There is only one president at a time.
FYI The President’s ability to classify/declassify is NOT rooted in EP and as such EP cannot be “revoked” or any other Brandon game nor is it a part of this action (assuming the media accounts are accurate)
A President CANNOT “revoke” or otherwise undo the job rights of the position.
Professor,
Excellent analysis and very good advice. Cooler heads must prevail for the moment. The midterm angle is so obviously true it escapes many people. Personally, I think the DoJ got over their skies. Unless there is some for real classified stuff found v some technical violation this will backfire because it will be seen as a blatantly political act by one regime v the prior regime. Strange how all the armed up, kitted out FBI raids on politically prominent figures seem to go in one direction. Peaceful transfer of power won’t last unless the rules are equally applied.
It doesn’t matter if there’s any classified information. If Trump claims he declassified it, the material is no longer classified. It could be nothing more than a verbal statement, claiming these documents are no longer classified.
He had already made the command that anything Russia gate hoax related was declassified as well.
Then again we are assuming the Democrat Feds will play by the rules when we already know they make the rules!
He also made sure there is nothing incriminating in those documents. He also made copies, both hard copies and digital. The hard copies are most likely stored at multiple places. Digital – multiple places in different clouds and flash drives.
Sanddog: It could be nothing more than a verbal statement, claiming these documents are no longer classified.
But Trump can’t declassify information retroactively when he is no longer president. Did he declassify the materials *at the time*? Even if it was verbal, there would still be a record.
If Trump did declassify the material, it would be available to the public via a FOIA request. Depending on the content, that could be a significant problem for U.S. security.
How do the Feds prove that Trump hadn’t verbally declassified the documents? Burden is likely on the prosecution to prove that he didn’t, beyond a reasonable doubt.
Bruce Hayden: How do the Feds prove that Trump hadn’t verbally declassified the documents?
There has to be a record. Otherwise, no information could be deemed classified.
Bruce Hayden: Burden is likely on the prosecution to prove that he didn’t, beyond a reasonable doubt.
So, any prosecution for selling classified information to the enemy would require testimony from Trump, as would every FOIA request? Even after he is dead and gone? There has to be a record of a presidential order. Trump muttering it to himself while in the toilet (or, after he has left office, “remembering” that he did so when convenient) does not constitute a presidential order.
As a practical matter would you prefer to have some evidence of declassification such as a memorandum listing any documents and the date of declassification, all signed and printed on WH stationery to present when inevitably questioned?
That’s up to whoever is in office. Congress can’t set a standard for presidential declassification. It can be done by EO but a president isn’t bound by an executive order signed by their predecessor. This is one of those absolute power situations.
You are arguing that DJT should tell the CT in essence:
Nah cuz, I declassified that shit verbally and in secret yo. Damn homie, I didn’t even tell the wifey, so y’all can pound sand and stop asking wack ass questions about it, Look man I was El Presidente and those square ass rules for low level suckers don’t mean jack to me’.
That seems to be your argument.
There was no ‘peaceful transition of power’ in 2017. Banana Republic Obama made sure of it. And we all saw everything.
Now the IRS has 87,000 more agents. Are they there to maintain our Social Credit Scores?
When the current political regime uses the power of the state to go after the prior political regime and not coincidentally the acknowledged front runner in the upcoming contest to return the prior regime to political office….. that’s a new, very disturbing and very dangerous escalation that we should all recognize for what it is; a blatant use of discretionary power to inflict punishment on political opposition.
Tit for tat becomes almost required once this process begins. The only other way to create disincentives for this behavior is to hound out of office, revoke pensions and seek jail time for everyone lowest to highest who’s fingerprints are on this event.
Since that scenario is unlikely to bear fruit the only real option to impose disincentives sufficient to have a deterrent effect is a political tit for tat. The current regime understands this fact and chose to proceed. Which makes this act all the more dangerous.
I assume that this raid may be a final act before an indictment that was already prepared is issued. It is probably a capstone on whatever case they are building over the records act. And it could also cross-fertilize the state level investigations in NY and GA by providing a pretext for prosecutors in those states to get material out of Mar o Lago that they couldn’t obtain themselves. You must assume that all the state and federal prosecutors going after Trump are working together, and the J6 committee will get copies of everything seized yesterday.
Ok sure who around here doesn’t understand that?
When the J6 committee promised more to come, were they aware this raid was coming?
Ummm, I guess there is no low where a Dem Marxis won’t go..
This is not a provocation. It’s a serious attack and it’s a signal that the left OWNS the federal machinery and will use it to carry out anything the left wants.
They are not trying to provoke us. They are trying to attack and terrorize us.
I think it’s both.
They hope keyboard warriors will up their rhetoric so that they can point to sites X, Y and Z as filled with extremist and violent threats v govt in general or specific persons.
Then they leverage that reaction as proof of the existence of extremists in the USA and that justifies a further provocative act on the part of govt. Until some ahole starts taking pot shots at the mailman or some other such idiocy. Then the actual violence by one loudmouth becomes the justification to round up the other loudmouth keyboard warriors on sites X, Y and Z. Then people resist that which ups the ante again.
Bottom line today’s events are partly an information operation being used to shape the battlefield. How extreme the comments tonight determine the next action in this farce.
This is very true. We are under constant scrutiny regarding reader comments and are fighting very hard to keep our comment section (without having to do FB or Disqus or just shut it down completely as other conservative sites have done). One crazy can topple the whole apple cart.
Moot point because leftist provocateurs can easily do that regardless.
Being afraid is our biggest weakness. Calling for “cooler heads” in a situation that screams for outrage is how we lose. We SHOULD be outraged over this. This just may be the big mistake that takes down the Deep State. I am not seeing much celebration outside of Hollywood and communists around the world so we have them worried and probably afraid.
I’ll bet the Democrats and NeverTrumpers are already worried that have just lost the “big middle”. Let’s scare the crap out of them RIGHT NOW! I’m not calling for a violent uprising but for people to voice their outrage. If not now, WHEN? We are being trampled like sheep. Let’s stop BEING sheep!
Think about the current tension between right and left as a rocky marriage. One partner baits and taunts the other into acting based on emotions with a camera set up to record the drama.
Then they use the evidence against that partner to secure better terms in the divorce or if they were very good at this manipulation their partner lashed out and commits a crime and they seek to have them jailed.
Don’t allow yourself to be manipulated via emotional provocation.
While I concur with “stop being sheep”, the “cooler heads”, to me, equates to thinking and planning. It’s time to – metaphorically or not – zero our sights, count our ammo, and plan. There’s a reason “half-cocked” is a metaphor for acting without deliberation. Let the outrage give you resolve instead of mere anger, for we will need resolve in the near future – a fire that burns steady and long, and doesn’t flare up and then die away.
Also remember that the smart partisan evangelizes the people into his way of thinking. So, get out there and evangelize the electorate into morality and Americanism.
What they will do now is send in hordes of “Ray Epps’s” into comment sections to make provocative comments. Seen it before. It’s how the Left got The Federalist to abandon commenting.
We see this type of thing all the time and for the most part are able to nip it in the bud, i.e. before they provide the fodder the left needs to shut us and/or our comment section down.
Explain how the “left” is going to shut down LI or the comment section?
Are you unprepared?
Do you need help to prepare?
Hoping the alligator eats you last rarely works …
That may no longer be possible.
After seeing Flynn’s article, I realized the date itself is an internationally recognized hate symbol, so likely even discussing this event can be construed as a hate crime.
Don’t know if they did it intentionally, but even if they did not, if I can see it, the left can make the connection too.
That said, “On 8/8 they went full 88” does have a zing to it.
If OUR party takes the House and we allow a lamebrain like Kevin McCarthy to become Boehner II, we deseve all the hell that’ll come our way when the GOP loses the House and the presidency in 2024.
Listen to what this milquetoast said about the raid on Trump’s home:
“I’ve seen enough. (He has? You mean, there was more he tolerated?)
Mr. Milquetoast continues: “The Department of Justice has reached an intolerable state of weaponized politicization.”
INTOLERABLE? Does this guy mean that there has been TOLERABLE weaponized politicization of the Department of Justice??
Be forewarned: McCarthy is not a wartime consiglierie. He’s not even a peacetime consigliere. He’s just another Boehner, without the alcohol.
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/gop-slams-weaponization-doj-after-trumps-mar-a-lago-raided-fbi-dems-call-accountability
Ronna “Romney” McDaniel, the swamp milquetoast leading the GOP:
“This raid is outrageous.” Really? Wore, it even interrupted cocktails?
We have corrupt idiots running our govenment, but to have corrupt idiots run our own poltical party????
Lauren Boebert had the only intelligent reaction:
“If you’re a Republican with any kind of voice, and not speaking up for President Trump tonight don’t expect any of us to speak up for you when your time comes.
You may not realize it yet, but they’re coming for all of us.”
87,000 heavily armed IRS agents are coming for the rest of us.
DAMN, I wish Lauren Boebert was my Representative..
Subotai Bahadur
The Republican majority in both chambers do not have the power. It doesn’t matter who the speaker and majority leader are. They just cannot do much with Biden. It will be a gridlock.
Matt Gaetz’s suggestion of increased investigations, hearings, committees, and learning to work around the deep state may be only viable choices…until we all decide something far worse.
We could have used some gridlock to stop this last bill. No new Democrat laws is more than half a loaf.
If the house and senate flip in November, perhaps instead of preparing bills to out and embarrass Biden, they ought to prepare bills for the ‘America first / MAGA’ president who will be elected in 2024. Biden won’t sign them of course, but they’re prepared and ready for 1/20/2025. Prepare to hit the ground running. I’d hate to think they would waste 2025-2026 undoing everything O’Biden* – treat him like the walking deadman / ghost that he is. Be absolute in lame-ducking the old fraud.
Yeah, the Gestapo (FBI) is out in force now and they’re trolling for a response.
They are hoping we will all be “GOOD GERMANS”.
I could be in error here since I am not a lawyer, but if what I have heard is true the FBI could have tainted their search from the beginning. If they took boxes and did not catalog what was in the boxes wouldn’t they have a chain of custody issue.
The FBI or some other three letter agency could plant evidence and say that the evidence was in the boxes. at the time of seizure.
As someone who has executed search warrants the answer to your questions is YES.
All that can be testified is yes that is the box I took, but only if it is listed on the inventory list of what was took.
As another who has, yes there is an issue.
Here is another potential one- in cases where there are “highly technical” decisions as to what “is” and “is not” specified under a warrant, it is routine for an ADA or other SME to be present to make required judgement calls.
I have not heard that this happened during the raid.
As others have commented- we need to see the actual warrant and the specific wording to know for sure.
There was a comment repeated last night about how the FBI just grabbed the boxes without proper handling. Those boxes…do they contain copies of the documents? And Trump storing the originals elsewhere that the FBI has no idea where they are?
Regardless, Trump most likely made sure whatever he has remain organized and in proper place.
That is, as long as the judge allows him his due process in a fair trial. And that is a problem for Trump but WDC will get the reaction exactly the opposite of what it was hoping for.
FYI a “copy” of anything classified has no distinction or difference from the original ( except an additional charge)
Also, ( people get confused by this who have never held a security clearance)
The President is the ultimate declassifying authority so just the fact he “says” ( by word or deed) it actually “is” it in terms of declassification.
In the world of the legal beagle- yes they want a memo, distro and wet signature but those are procedural niceties, they are not mandatory requirements under color of any law.
No more than the immunity Congress has when they speak on sensitive or copyrighted material in the execution of their office.
Here is how you will know. People will argue against what I just said and all of that but not a single one will ever produce an enforceable law that shows anything different.
Tha’ts all that matters.
Taurus,
In your hypothetical the jury as finder of fact gets to decide if a mere assertion by DJT that he had declassified the docs verbally with no evidence to support that claim is enough not to convict. Not a risk I would take.
The unitary executive can verbally waive all sorts of things but convincing a Judge and/or Jury that the assertion is true is another matter entirely. Seems like a bad bet to me.
It’s not a question, IMO, about whether he could declassify, instead it’s a question of being able to prove he did so. Absent even the most basic paper trail that’s a tough sell.
Chief,
That’s a “matter of fact” issue not a “matter of law” judgement requiring a decision so a jury opinion would be irrelevant and not a part of the decision. No convincing will be necessary or required.
That’s not a “hypothetical”.
Granted, I am in full agreement in documentation and a register. ( part of my project management portfolio) so no argument from me that its a great and necessary thing to do and I would certainly do it and recommend it.
That’s not the legal question or requirement though- that’s the point to be made.
There is no case possible based on the “prayer” that somehow somewhere Trump violated some unknown law or put a comma in place of a period.
They are running a bluff.
Taurus,
To be very clear the jury is the finder of fact at trial. They view the assertions and evidence presented along with the instructions from the Judge regarding points of law. Then they decide guilt or innocence.
After the drama with Flynn and Page and the FISA CT you are confident that DJT merely needs to assert that he as POTUS, declared these docs to be unclassified and nothing else and he walks?
That doesn’t seem like a situation I want to be part of in order to test your hypothesis. I would much rather have a memorandum for record I could produce to support my assertion.
If you are correct then why doesn’t he simply go on TV tonight and say exactly that? If that’s all it takes to make all this go away then why hasn’t he simply do what you propose? Could it be that a Judge and a prosecutor might not be convinced and would insist on a trial after putting it through a rubber stamp grand jury?
Your post assumes that the DoJ and FBI operate within the bounds of the law. They don’t.
buck61
Likely the boxes they “lost” when sweeping Pedo Island.
They might not get the reaction that they seek.
Seems a lot of people on the right, even those not fans of Trump, are pissed off about this raid.
This may have unified everyone because everyone finally understands that whoever comes after Trump when he finally gets off the stage will get the same treatment. (At least I hope)
And here we are calling for “cooler heads”. NO! We need people to be outraged! Our majority has just expanded YUGELY. This isn’t a ruse to take down blog sites like LI. They will do that anyway if we don’t fight back. Either we are in the fight or we aren’t. Voicing our outrage over the right things at the right time matters. The time is NOW! SHOUT IT OUT!
No Phil,
They are COUNTING ON (hoping and praying ) the “Murica” types having some form of uprising ( physical or verbal)- that’s what they need for J6 and Trump and now to VINDICATE their actions.
We MUST NOT let that happen or give that to them.
As it stands now, there is a real possibility that the left just handed us 22,24 and beyond on a silver plate but we will NOT capitalize on that UNLESS those “cooler heads” assess and give a series of measured responses calculated to deliver results.
I’m not calling for an uprising! I am protesting this lame call for us to be meek so as to not “provoke” further repression. We have leaders risking it ALL for us. Who are they leading? We need to be shouting out our outrage. They just made a big mistake and it is up to us to make it stick by rubbing it into their faces until something happens. We need to force the issue. The water is already boiling and the advice we get is to keep cool? It’s time to jump out of the pot and put THEM in it!
Professor Jacobson is exactly right here, this is a provocation intended to illicit the exact sort of response you are demanding of us all. You do you, but the rest of us are not going to take the bait.
Phil,
Lets play poker
“Looking” meek is not BEING meek.
From the tactical side- Often “forcing the issue” is what the enemy wants (probing)
They judge what you have ( and don’t have) and your resolve etc. by these reactions.
They WANT a reaction ( and that’s different but can include a “response”)- that’s why we CANNOT give them one ( good or bad). We do not want to telegraph our strengths, weaknesses or intent.
Since Chief took my line about revenge, let me employ yet another Klingon proverb: NEVER interrupt your enemy when he is f#cK!ng up and they really did this time.
“the “Murica” types”
What type is that? Deplorables?
Mono-brows, mostly.
Revenge is a dish best served cold.
As a person who was bullied throughout Jr. High and High School – I was given a lot of advice on how to ‘Not Be Bullied’.
It was all Crap.
While I understand your view, Professor, I have to ask the question:
“Where is the Line?”
We already crossed the Rubicon.
I spent too much time in the sun today. My first thought was “What does Jeep have to do with this?”
Then, “Oh, THAT Rubicon”
I’m going to go take a nap.
That river was crossed a long time ago (at least as far back as when Comey advised the Hillary not be prosecuted over her mishandling and storage of actual classified material), and there was no meaningful reaction. This merely emboldened them. What is being proposed here? That we allow the stakes to be elevated again? To not react then, too? It is the Left that is risking a kinetic reaction. If they’re not stopped, they’re likely to get one. Is that what they want? Are they sure they can defeat it?
Be careful what you ask for.
There is no line. Things been muddied so much no one even knows the definition of ordinary words any more.
The national archives isn’t the final arbiter of the classification of any documents. Trump could have declassified every document in his possession on the way out the door to Biden’s inauguration. All Trump has to do is claim he declassified them and the NA needs to respect the constitutional authority of Trump’s presidency. They must remain declassified and available to the people. Any other outcome is illegal and unconstitutional.
I know the FBI and national archives are tossing out “classified material” as a way to suggest illegal activity and it will work with people who don’t understand what’s going on. They may hate Trump so much they refuse to acknowledge he had the same constitutional authority as every other president in our history. The law doesn’t matter to people with Trump derangement syndrome.
“The law doesn’t matter to people with Trump derangement syndrome.”
Truth.
Truth verily.
Understand, there is no “rule of law”:
Trump has been subjected to the russia/russia/russia investigation that was bogus. Republicans did nothing to put a stop to it.
Trump was impeached, not once but twice. Republicans did nothing to put a stop to it.
The sham Jan 6 trials are still ongoing. Republicans did nothing to put a stop to it.
The corrupt leftist regimes of biden’s handlers are a problem. They are lawless. Where are the republicans? McCarthy issued a “strongly worded” statement. Meaningless.
The problem is the Republican party. Watch. They will do nothing as they are part and parcel to the theft of this country.
What do you think the GOP could do? Issue more pointless words of support?
I think the reality is there is actually fuck all these ball-less nut sacks could do even if they wanted to so something.
When in a position of power come mid terms…that’s when I will become interested in what these spineless intellectual pygmies will do because that’s when they cam actually support Trump with more than empty meaningless words.
We have been complacent since the 1900’s, matey. There is little the Republican Party can do at this point and the next two years. Best they can do is gridlock and continuing resolutions. Our public schools no longer teach us the founding history and law.
Remember the New England Primer book? That book was used in the public schools back in the old days. We need to bring back the Bible studies into our schools. We need to bring back gun classes, mechanics shops, home economics, et al.
Oh, sure. Just like when they have had control of the house and senate in the past they always came through.
The senate was in session the entire Trump was in office to prevent Trump from conducting a recess appointment. That was a senate controlled by republicans.
You all need your heads examined if you do not understand who the problem is.
You are correct. The law has failed. This is now a Banana Republic. it is going to get much worse from here and there is no ‘legal’ remedy. They are dug in like the Japs on Iwo. The Soviet Union had a constitution too with grand sounding rights. It is now inoperable and without meaning it appears.
By the way, 7 of 10 republicans that voted for impeachment are now gone. Next week Wyoming will get rid of perhaps the worst of the bunch, Witch Cheney.
This is the grass roots at work, not the republican party. The republicans clearly tried to steal the primary in Arizona, but they failed as Ms Lake swept every county in the state. This has them frightened even more than before.
Democrats will have their goon squads ready to go, camouflaged as conservatives, to give them cause and reason to start targeting conservatives.
Secondly, I’d love to know who at the FBI signed off on this raid. In a sane world that persons employment will have ended by the end of today. However I expect that person will be promoted to lead the J6 clown show instead!
It had to be Wray
Sorry Professor but we have to “take the bait”.
At some point, we have to fight back because the hour is fast approaching where it will be too late to fight back.
You know very well that the ruling Communists will look for ANYTHING as a provocation and this “we’re better than that” attitude is only speeding up the day they put us in boxcars, gulags and mass graves.
You need context.
Yes we must “fight back” but not the way the enemy wants us to
We must fight back in every way made necessary by our opponents. Elections stolen? Go to the courts. Courts corrupt? Well, you know where that goes. They aren’t leaving us much choice.
The “line in the sand” approach comes with a threat. Personally, these things steel/galvanize me – strengthen my resolve to resist, to campaign against the totalitarians, to vote against them come November. To challenge them in print – at public meetings – to call them out and embarrass them at every opportunity. In so doing, it isn’t my hope so much to change them, as to convince others to join the resistance.
Lately, I’ve been hearing about a personality type I’d never heard of. The sigma type. I’d heard of alphas and betas, but not sigma, which as I loosely understand is an introverted alpha. Someone with quiet resolve and determination, etc. I don’t know whether that describes me, but I am the quiet introverted type and many have mistaken that over the years for being weak and easily led/manipulated. Some have made that mistake to their detriment. They don’t expect any pushback, so when it comes it’s devastating to them – often a complete blindside. It’s that level of unknown opposition that is driving the leftists mad right now – doing whatever they can to stack the deck in their favor because their fear of losing in November is palpable. I’m all for letting them think they have the upper hand until we get the chance to fight back, legally and overwhelmingly – primarily at the ballot box – but at the local and state level as well – through restrained involvement. Pray for your enemies – bless those who curse you – and then on November 8th kick them in the balls so hard their eyes light up like a pinball machine.
BTW – The real reaction should come from two men – one in Austin and one in Tallahassee – that this is no longer a legitimate administration and any executive orders coming from it are illegitimate and to be ignored.
And that’s exactly why DeSantis needs to stay in Florida. I keep saying the real war is at the state level, as in the Red states–TRULY red–and the dictatorship now posing as the federal government, along with their blue state mini-me dictatorships. We don’t need to lose him to the quagmire of DC, we need more like him at the state level. And those states are where WE need to concentrate.
This, exactly. Another four years of DeSantis in Florida will show what a conservative governor can do, and will result in more like him being elected in other states. Already people speak of Florida with envy, and I see “I wish my governor was like DeSantis.” If he runs for president then he’s just another candidate to be torn apart by the establishment. He needs to stay. Let Trump be the lightning rod; win or lose in 2024, the real fight is at the state level. We can take the country out from under these statist goons while they conduct their show trials and FBI raids.
Let Trump come back in to be the wreaking ball we need on the Federal government. Once he has those four years, the next guy can tie up loose ends.
DeSantis has already come out and voiced his outrage.
Mildly
Whoopee. Get back to me when the state of Florida raids every FBI office and shuts them down for illegal activity.
There’s no way this ends any way but ugly.
It’s getting to the point to me it’s DJT or the Marxists, nothing else will do.
We are going to need a scorched earth scrape down back to the original Constitution, everything after like FBI needs to be eliminated.
Whether provocation or not, this raid amounts to a crossing of the Rubicon for the FBI. It proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that the deep state has no respect for historical norms, the rule of law or the US Constitution.
I also believe it’s directed against DeSantis. They’re trying to get him to do something like using the state guard to protect Trump’s residence, which will then allow the feds to call it an insurrection and go after DeSantis.
Davidm:
To show that he’s got what it takes, that is EXACTLY what DeSantis must do.
No. This is a clear federal matter (as much as I despise it), and for DeSantis to intervene would open HIM up to legal action. That’s what they want. As the headline says, this is a provocation. They want the right (whether our elected leaders or common peons like us) to react badly.
DeSantis has already shown he has what it takes, and part of that is knowing what he should do… and what he shouldn’t.
Whatever happened to the 10th amendment? Whatever happened to the contract signed by the state and the US Federal government? Whatever happened to the list of enumerated rights limited to our US Federal government?
Whatever happened to the state and national sovereignty?
Nothing happened to them. There is nothing in the constitution that prevents this raid. The state doesn’t get a say in the matter; that was the case during the Washington administration just as it is today.
Since the warrant has not been published, we can suspect that it’s BS and invalid, but we can’t be sure. And even if it is invalid, that still wouldn’t give the state any jurisdiction over it. Any challenge would have to be in federal court. So there’s nothing DeSantis can do except condemn it.
Horsepucky. The state of Florida can begin an immediate investigation into suspected criminal activity at every FBI office in the state using the same baloney used to raid Trumps home. Raid the office, then close it for suspected terrorist activity for starters.
After all, without question, the FBI are domestic terrorists.
No Barry, they cannot
Taurus, yes they can. Who will stop them? You?
They can play by the same rules that the feds are playing by, twist them. Any facility in Florida can be closed due to an investigation for anything that happens on Florida soil. Look it up. It’s in the Florida code, as it is in most every state.
The FBI are a lawless group of clowns terrorizing a Florida resident. That’s good for a starter.
“It’s time for us in the Florida Legislature to call an emergency legislative session & amend our laws regarding federal agencies
Sever all ties with DOJ immediately
Any FBI agent conducting law enforcement functions outside the purview of our State should be arrested upon sight”
https://twitter.com/AnthonySabatini/status/1556805568207196160?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1556805568207196160%7Ctwgr%5Ea08dd55a3ab5ad26c3b1490d0e096fa80be13d50%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Ftheconservativetreehouse.com%2Fblog%2F2022%2F08%2F08%2Fas-a-citizen-of-florida-ron-desantis-calls-fbi-mar-a-lago-raid-another-escalation%2F
“We must fire the federal government”
“As governor, I will fight these Tyrants with every fiber of my being”
https://twitter.com/KariLake/status/1556808739281203200
Where is DeSantis?
Barry, you’re officially nuts. No, DeSantis can’t do that. If he did he’d be in open rebellion against the USA. Also, him and what army? No LEO would obey his illegal orders. Any that did would immediately be arrested along with him. And nobody would come to their rescue.
DeSantis’s entire power is from the law. The moment he rejects the law he has no power at all. And that is what you are proposing he should do. Fortunately he’s not nuts, so he will not do anything like that.
The FBI is not subject to state law, and no state has any authority over it.
The FBI has been operating above the law, sans any law, corruptly since it’s inception. They have murdered people, they have falsely accused people, they have planted false evidence, and they have withheld exculpatory evidence. They have framed people, like General Flynn. Comey openly admits what they did, They laugh at you and the mock you.
Sorry milhouse, you’re the nut. You do not deserve freedom or liberty.
“If he did he’d be in open rebellion against the USA.”
The FBI and the DOJ along with the party (both) aparatus have already concocted a coup and stolen an election. They spent four + years conducting a sham investigation against Trump.
I’m not the least bit surprised you stand up for them and against taking action to stop the corrupt.
DeSantis has obligations under his state’s constitution to protect the rights of Florida citizens. If the FBI is doing anything illegal, DeSantis would be both within his authority and compelled to act in Trump’s defense.
Absolutely and this is true in every state as far as I know.
Everything the FBI does with respect to Trump has been illegal. I’d guess that nearly everything the FBI does is illegal Trump or not. The FBI needs to be shuttered, and any governor of any state where the FBI is conducting illegal operations should shut them down.
The only thing “nuts” about that is the cowardice of those which reject freedom and liberty.
Remember Paul Revere.
Remember the Alamo!!
Give me Liberty or give me death!
The new Great Awakening!!
Don’t take the bait is correct. Instead figure out who you may want to support (if you haven’t already) in the midterms and if you can start asking them some pointed questions. Questions such as: would they support and vote in favor of rolling back the powers and authority of certain federal agencies? If evidence comes to light of criminal abuse of their authority would you support and apply pressure to have those responsible for this abuse brought up on charges as well as having the trial take place outside of D.C.? Because let’s face it, we are not getting an unbiased jury pool in that city for matters such as this!
Point is we need to make it clear to candidates who are running that we are taking a keen interest in what they will do to help put a stop to this once they are in office.
If Trump is indicted, he will be tried in WDC.
That was my reaction. Usually you provoke a rebellion in order to suppress it.
Why are you and the other “cooler heads” squishes jumping to conclusions? If you aren’t outraged by this, we don’t need you. Being outraged doesn’t mean we are advocating dropping a nuke. We are advocating directing our outrage usefully! If you have been following this through the day today, this has backfired big for the commies and the outrage is a very big reason why.
The guy who is keeping a cool head is Trump who is not biting on the suggestion from so many “conservatives” that this wouldn’t have happened had he declared his candidacy earlier and should do so now. Everyone is an expert telling Trump what to do.
We have leaders and most of them are voicing outrage but keeping cooler heads.
That is why I am not a Republican. No balls and no brains.
Sometimes they get out of hand.
What this should mean, as a first step, is that we cease any form of cooperation with the FBI. No benefit of the doubt. Jury nullification, non-compliance, non-assistance of any kind.
Democrats may have just done the modern version of firing on Fort Sumter.
And the flag is still there…
As I said before, this is a smoke screen for something else going on in the background.
I am wondering how much of the boxes they grabbed is really for Letitia James in NY or the prosecutor in GA. State level prosecutors can’t raid a residence in another state. The Feds can.
Miranda Devine just reporting that the docs taken from Trump’s house were boxed up by the GSA and mailed to Trump by them. And that the FBI has had access to these docs for MONTHS.
https://twitter.com/pvtjokerus/status/1556803160005496833?t=8WUz8maUAGkdBakNK3n3cQ&s=19
Tinfoil hat time – what if this is 4d chess by some Trump re-election aide? They go to the feebs, without the knowledge of Trump, and start feeding them bullshit about secret documents in a MAL safe. The feebs, willing to believe the most outlandish and salacious accusations, take this at face value, and start planning “the greatest feeb raid ever”. Like Geraldo and the vault, they show up and it’s empty.
So, with just a little bit of initiative, this re-election aide 4chans the FBI, brings billions of dollars of earned advertising for Trump, and emotionally enrages (or re-enrages) the more than half of the country who are already peeved by the already obvious political persecution. Trump wins the primary and general in 2024 in a walk.
Too paranoid?
nuts
Nope, you are wrong (respectfully). This is not about forcing Trumps’ hand to announce for 2024.
This is about inculcation, a step by step process in which the arrest and conviction of Donald Trump will not come as a shock. The FBI raid was the first step, that gets all the shock and outrage out of our systems. The indictment and trial will then be not unexpected.
The indictment has probably already been prepared. They didn’t need anything out of Mar o Lago to indict Trump. This is a capstone and an aid to parallel cases.
Some things to consider about the “provocation” argument:
1) In general, the left isn’t that good at thinking ahead. They tend to be much more emotionally reactive than smart.
2) The left is, in fact, driven by hate. They hate President Trump and want to get him by hook or by crook. (Crook being their SOP).
3) Nearly everything the democrat party ever does is about money. Merrick Garland and the idiot Wray are no exceptions. So who’s paying for this? Who bribed whom to ‘take Trump out’?
4) It is not a coincidence that this happened right after the inflation and IRS expansion act. What are they hiding in that act that they fear President Trump would expose?
Have to disagree. The left not only thinks strategically, they’ve been engaged in a “long march” against the Constitution for well over a century. Don’t confuse the leadership with the cannon fodder.
The Left has several components with different time horizons. The Deep State (SES bureaucrats in DOJ + Intelligence) is very strategic. They think very far ahead. So do the Academics. The Media, which runs all the public Democrat political narratives, only thinks of now. Democrat politicians only think as far as the next election.
The Left rank and file has been taught by their handlers (the Democrat party) to hate Trump. The handlers only play-act at hating Trump. They don’t hate Trump, but he’s a monkey wrench in their plans, and that makes him intolerable. What are the Dems to do? Admit why they’re opposed to Trump (and think that will fire up their base), or just gin up hate against him? They’ve already started in on DeSantis as the next target of hate. It’s a synthetic, hate-on-demand. It’s not real. (Although it’s real enough for those drinking the party’s Kool Aid.)
Why don’t they raid Obama’s house and seize his birth certificate?
Trumps ad released after the raid
Hmm
https://nypost.com/2022/08/09/trump-releases-campaign-style-video-after-fbi-raid/
And, the LA Times has a new take on “research.”
https://thelibertydaily.com/the-la-times-is-literally-testing-out-fake-news-to-see-how-they-can-gaslight-people-into-hating-donald-trump/
The LA Times also controls the San Diego Union-Tribune.
I think that this raid which had to have been authorized by the White House and the highest level of DOJ was an attempt to distract the American People from Biden’s colossal failures on all foreign and domestic issues and the imposition of the woke agenda by administrative fiat. Trump should retain Dershowitz and Turley, move to quash the subpoenas and for the DOJ to produce the complete paper and electronic trail that led to the decision to launch the raid
Watch out for a vastly expanded IRS -they will be looking for people who buy books authored by conservatives and who donate to conservative causes and websites
I’m thinking with 87,000 new employees, Americans should be guaranteed their refunds within a week of filing.
Poor thinking. What you will get are demands for more payments.
WTPuck left off the /s.
The most benign explanation is that it’s a show raid, which works like a show trial. It keeps the base happy.
No, it means one indictment is already ready. Others may be in the pipeline.
The republican party is complicit in this. They will use charges (not conviction) to claim Trump cannot run as the R nominee.
Just wait.
“This is a provocation. They are trying to get a reaction that allows a further crackdown.”
This is 100% correct. Don’t take the bait.
I’ll wager that you go to Judge Bruce Reinhardt’s home and protest, you will get arrested
I bet you wouldn’t. Does Florida even have a law against residential picketing? No matter, even if it does it wouldn’t be enforced in such a case. Certainly there is no federal law against it, so long as it’s not done with the intent of influencing a decision, which of course it wouldn’t be.
Oh right, because the leftist’s always follow the law. What a fool you are.
Picketing is the least of the worry. They are going to arrest President Trump. Garland might as well be Yamamoto. Wrey like Tojo. The law is broke and woke.
At least Yamamoto understood the consequences of the orders he was given, and executed them reluctantly. Garland, I believe, is only too glad to execute his orders.
So the same judge that signed off on the warrant had direct involvement in a Trump v Clinton and Clinton campaign lawsuit beginning April 6, 2022 until June 22, 2022 serving as the magistrate judge
https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/63184300/29/trump-v-clinton/
Crackdown is here, not coming, regardless of our reaction.
Mark your calendars and my words: CW2 started today.
Trump = Pearl Harbour
Republics last for about 200 years. Ours died yesterday.
No, it’s been a zombie since the ratification of the 17th Amendment.
+10
Per Millhouse, “[Ron] DeSantis’s entire power is from the *law*. The moment he rejects the *law* he has no power at all.”
This may be true.
But why then does it not seem to be the case that the moment Merrick Garland rejects the *law*, Garland has no power at all? That the moment Christopher Wray rejects the *law*, Wray has no power at all? That the moment President-with-an-asterisk Joseph R. Biden Jr. rejects the *law*, the asterisked Chief Executive and his scriptwriters have no power at all?
Will Millhouse next be telling us that such worthies are not now rejecting the *law*, or that they have not rejected it on multiple prior occasions?
Honestly, if the Democrats didn’t own the Elections, they woud never have pulled this stunt.
But they DO own the elections.
They are meaningless now.
And the Democrats, they know it.