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Impeachment Hearing: Did Vindman Leak Information to the Whistleblower?

Impeachment Hearing: Did Vindman Leak Information to the Whistleblower?

It’s a clown show.

https://twitter.com/bennyjohnson/status/1196824906442215425

The impeachment hearings in front of the House Intelligence Committee took a weirdish turn this afternoon:

Lt. Col. Alexander Vindman, an Army officer at the National Security Council, told Nunes that he spoke with two people outside the White House about Trump’s July 25 call with Ukrainian President Voldomyr Zelensky in the immediate wake of the interaction, including State Department official George Kent and one member of the “intelligence community.”

Nunes then pressed Vindman about which agency the intelligence community member hailed from.

Schiff jumped in to interrupt the exchange, apparently worried the exchange could name the whistleblower — though Vindman later insisted he doesn’t know who the whistleblower is.

Schiff stopped the clock and told the panel he wants “to make sure there’s no effort to out the whistleblower through the use of these proceedings.”

Nunes reminded Schiff it was the Republicans turn to question Vindman. Schiff said if Vindman “has a good faith belief that this may reveal the identity of the whistleblower, that is not the purpose that we are here for.” He wanted “to advise the witness accordingly.”

Nunes did not back down:

Nunes: Mr. Vindman, you testified at your deposition that you did not know the whistleblower.

Vindman: Ranking member, it’s Lieutenant Colonel Vindman, please.

Nunes: Lieutenant Colonel Vindman, you testified in the deposition that you did not know who the whistleblower was, or is.

Vindman: I do not know who the whistleblower is, that is correct.

Nunes: So how is it possible for you to name these people and then out the whistleblower?

Vindman: Per the advice of my counsel, I’ve been advised not to answer specific questions about members of the intelligence community.

Nunes: This is — are you aware that this is the Intelligence Committee that’s conducting an impeachment hearing?

Conservatives on Twitter believe the exchange proves Vindman leaked information to the whistleblower. The sidestepping of questions along with Schiff quickly jumping in does not bode well for the Democrats. It also dims their claims of not knowing the identity of the whistleblower.

I’d say Schiff’s deer in the headlights look is a dead giveaway, but the man looks like that all the time.

I refuse to flat out say yes, Vindman leaked the information. But the exchange raised red flags in my head.

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Comments

JackinSilverSpring | November 19, 2019 at 4:26 pm

It sounds like perjury to me as well.

I’m not really up on classified material, but it seems that when somebody listens in on a classified call, contributes to the classified notes… then goes and tells a half-dozen people who lack the security clearance and have absolutely no need to know the material, I seem to remember there was some sort of punishment for that kind of activity.

Also, failure to pass his concerns along to his direct superior would seem to shot-circuit his whistleblower argument. Isn’t that process for “I told the boss, but nothing happened, so I’m going around him”?

    Sanddog in reply to georgfelis. | November 19, 2019 at 11:26 pm

    Vindman mentioned need to know… well, if the WB had “need to know”, he would have been a part of the crew listening to the conversation.

“Vindman refused to go to Morrison, his boss. He instead leaked to his “coordination” partners and his CIA whistleblower friend. Only after that did he go to the NSC lawyer, knowing his seeds were sown.”

NPR’s Audie Cornish chose this moment to talk over Jordan. Funny how this happens time and again to republicans.

Vindman not only leaked to the so called whistle blower, he also talked to other people outside his chain of command, and he admitted to do so.
He also called himself the ultimate authority in Ukraine foreign policy, usurping the powers reserved to the President, and he admitted so.
He implied wrongdoing on the part of the President for not sticking to the talking points that he, Vindman, had prepared. He apparently believes that the President reports to him.
But that’s not all. On the one and only opportunity he had to speak to the President of Ukraine, what did he do? He conducted his own foreign policy, which, as he also admitted, was not part of the so called ‘talking points’ in an effort to undermine the President. He committed insubordination, I would say Sedition.
He should be at least fired, but preferably he should be stripped from rank and awards, then dishonorably discharged.

    thalesofmiletus in reply to Exiliado. | November 19, 2019 at 6:19 pm

    JORDAN: Why didn’t you go directly to your superior with your concerns?
    VINDMAN: It was a really busy week.

    This is a George Costanza level of excuse.

    oldgoat36 in reply to Exiliado. | November 19, 2019 at 7:34 pm

    This testimony should seal his fate in a Courts Martial. This light Colonel knows his chain of command, yet ignored it. He must be part of the Comey Higher Honor type of scoundrel.

It is obstruction of justice while claiming to be a search for the truth.

It appears Vindman decided he is qualified to determine who has a need to know (I’m guessing he does know the Security Clearance status of these people whom he talked to) with regard to the phone call and what was discussed by the Presidents.

He seems big on military tradition and discipline. He believes if a senior officer asks for a “favor” it is actually an orderm and apparently he believes the President of the Ukraine is subordinate to the President of the US. For he thought asking for a favor was an order to the subordinate President.

And yet he deliberately left his chain of command, failed to go to his immediate supervisor (a Trump appointee) while speaking to two others, one a person in the Intel community whom he won’t name and Schiff for Brains won’t allow him to name. He offers the excuse that “things were busy that week”. I’ll bet he wouldn’t try that one on any O6 (COL) or O7 (BG) he was directly subordinate to.

And he alleges that he offered advice to the new President of the Ukraine that he should beware of the Russians (talk about beating a dead horse, guess he thought the new President hadn’t noticed the Crimean peninsula was missing from Ukrainian territory) and that he should avoid being involved in US internal politics. Pretty heady stuff for a light Colonel would usually be a Battalion Commander or mid-level staff officer.

Colonel Travis | November 19, 2019 at 4:42 pm

Well all know what a joke all this is. And by “all this” I mean everything. And by “everything” I mean “everyone here knows what I mean by everything.”

All I care about is if the guilty are properly punished.

Does Schiff not understand how deep the hole for him was dug today?

    That’ll happen abut the same time that Scoldilocks from Sveden accepts that Climate Change is a lie

    oldgoat36 in reply to stevewhitemd. | November 19, 2019 at 7:22 pm

    Remember how easily Schiff was fooled by the radio scam call he got? While Schiff might have a level of intelligence, at least in the book smarts department, he is truly a moron if life smarts. I doubt he would be aware of how stupidly he is has placed himself, this thanks to Brennan who probably came up with part of this latest scheme to effect a coup.
    Schiff is a liar, and he is also stupid enough to think his lies are undetectable.
    With the anonymous book coming out from a “senior white house official”, with all the crap show we are seeing, I wouldn’t at this point be shocked to learn that this non-whistleblower whistleblower is the author.

Just one more reason the Dems can’t vote to impeach and send the case over to the Senate. They know the Senate won’t provide cover for these leakers.

    Hm. I wonder if that’s Nancy’s crooked ploy. Go through all of this crap, sculpt the stupidest articles of impeachment possible, then arrange it with the whip so every single article falls short by a half-dozen votes or so.

    The Senate would never get the chance to subpoena the rest of the witnesses, the Dems can cruise into the 2020 election with their “We need just a few more seats” whine, and they can still feel perfectly free to smear Trump with every word. From then on, the media won’t call him Donald Trump anymore, but ‘Trump, who narrowly escaped impeachment for bribery…’

      oldgoat36 in reply to georgfelis. | November 19, 2019 at 7:40 pm

      The Senate doesn’t need to have the articles of impeachment to do an open investigation and hold hearings. Given the nature of what is being attempted, the Senate should act regardless, as this is sedition.
      They can subpoena Schiff, Vindman, and the non-whistleblower whistleblower, whom they know but “don’t know”.
      After the Senate is through with Vindman, let military justice handle Vindman’s final career posting.

      CKYoung in reply to georgfelis. | November 19, 2019 at 9:13 pm

      That’s a possibility for the democrats but they are going to make the radicals go nuclear. And what’s to stop the Senate from dragging a whole slew of SpyGate plotters in front of them? This is a lose/lose/lose for the democrats, and a HUGE blow to the msm. They pulled the pin on this grenade without having a safe place to chuck it, now it’s going to go off in their hands.

When I was active duty, more than 40 years ago, chain of command was taken very seriously. Sounds to me like Mr. Vindman went rogue on a frolic of his own.

We can only wonder as to how many previous occasions Vindman has lacked discretion, with biased abandonment.

He has his 20, court martial him and get him gone.

    oldgoat36 in reply to NotKennedy. | November 19, 2019 at 7:47 pm

    I’ve heard some talk of him being highly political and going rogue is not new with him. Not sure how valid that is, but given what he has admitted to, I wouldn’t be surprised.

Chairman Schiff looks like somebody has grabbed him by the pussy. Goldman, perhaps? No surprise, though.

Representative Nunes’ turns Chairman to Chairwoman in an under-the-table transaction, Dr. Stewart hovering as an emergency tourniquet administrator.

Nunez should have asked: “Was one of them Eric Ciaramella?”

Schiff would have gavelled his brains out. So Republicans start standing a chanting “Ciaramella! Ciaramella! Ciaramella!” until heads explode and Schiff shuts down the hearing and walks out.

Great drama and live on television. Viewership would explode for the next hearing. There would be nothing Schiff could do. Pelosi would have to step in shut it down.

By now, everyone knows what a scam this is so for the Republicans to finally find their spine and confront corruption so dramatically could be just what the GOP needs to drain its own swamp. Even King Swamp Rat McConnell would have to sit up and take notice.

    healthguyfsu in reply to Pasadena Phil. | November 19, 2019 at 6:39 pm

    I think they aren’t outright asking it to prevent media spin optics of them trying to retaliate by outing him(or whatever lol).

    It would be funny though if a rep starts a line of questioning with a short blurb about something they come across that Ciaramella did (if he’s ever done anything meaningful in his government job) and they ask about it and say his name during that blurb.

    The cameras could just watch for Schiff’s reaction and see what he does. It would be tv gold (Question: Can those eyes actually get wider and make him look more insane than his resting crazy face?)

That dweeb is a Lt Colonel? I weep for what has become of our military.

    Massinsanity in reply to Massinsanity. | November 19, 2019 at 5:30 pm

    How perfect, in light of the other post on LI today, Vindman is a graduate of SUNY Binghampton.

    Characters who insist that they be addressed by their “title” are, by that insistence revealing themselves to really small minded who need the title for validation. You know the types, characters who have a PhD in bullshiitte-ology (anyone with a “studies” degree; wyman’s, gay, black, africana, latina, education, sociology, and so forth). “Doctor” Jill Biden is one of them. Hers is an Ed.M in some less-than-difficult topic.

      oldgoat36 in reply to pfg. | November 19, 2019 at 7:56 pm

      I agree with the title issues, and while military rank is generally earned, there are a lot of paperpushers who gain rank but you would never want them in command of anything.
      Ph.Ds can be a mixed bag, but I give them their due if I know they are a Ph.D. Titles never meant all that much to me, and I know plenty of Doctors and Ph.D. people who often go without mention of their honorific.
      I, for one, look forward to seeing Vindman going by the title of prisoner, or private – serving time for sedition.

      Massinsanity in reply to pfg. | November 19, 2019 at 10:07 pm

      This is so spot on. In the course of my career I have had the honor of working with some brilliant PhD level physicists and engineers, people with degrees from MIT, CalTech, Princeton etc., and to a man (and woman) non of them ever request to be called “Doctor.”

      Generally speaking the flimsier the major the more the PhD holder desires to be called Doctor. It also generally applies to people who work in academia at middling schools.

    Unfortunately, people like Vindman are all that’s left after Obama thinned the herd of anyone Field-Grade and above that wouldn’t support his SJW agenda.

Whats Pencil Neck so afraid of he’s got to stop any question along that line? WE all know the ropes going to get tight.

When does his art 32 begin?

For those of us in the military, we’ve ALL had to put up with jagoffs like Vindman.

He’s the kind of douchebag that when you salute and say ‘good morning sir’, he turns around and bitches you out for not using his rank.

He’s the moron that walks into a platoon space and DEMANDS that everybody stop what they’re doing and snap to attention until he deigns to allow them to continue their actual work.

He’s the prick that summons all his JO’s at 4:30 PM and gives them orders he knows is going to take them hours to execute, tells them he wants it done before he gets there tomorrow, then hops in his car and goes home.

He’s the asshole that answers the phone COLONEL Vindman, when he knows damn well he isn’t one.

He’s the piece of shit who has a wife that yells at the gate guards for not saluting her, and who acts like her husband’s rank makes her superior to the other wives.

He’s the dick that walks up to you off base in a bar and tells you the back of your shirt isn’t tucked in.

He is everything that is wrong in the military.

    Concise in reply to Olinser. | November 19, 2019 at 7:25 pm

    Not in the military but it sounds like you’re being overly generous to the guy. And you forgot to mention those glasses. Does one have to be a special kind of d*** to be issued glasses like that?

    venril in reply to Olinser. | November 21, 2019 at 11:20 am

    Make a point, then, of placing the emphasis on Lieutenant.

    As I recall, most folks would have addressed him as Colonel as a courtesy; I expect he’s addressed as Lootenant Colonel frequently.

The_Donald at Reddit has been shut down due to this clown show. It seems that the Admins at Reddit also think it is their business to shut down speculation about the identity of the leakers.

I certainly hope that this Lt. Colonel Vindman has peaked in his military career, and that his next stint is being the star of a Courts Martial.
While I hold military people in high regard generally, it needs to be recalled that we have had many traitors and duplicitous people in their ranks as well as honorable ones.
Benedict Arnold was a military man.
With Vindman being so caught up in “chain of command”, I wonder who it is that sits higher than the Commander in Chief, as Vindman has certainly not considered Trump to be in any way part of his “chain of command”.
This man certainly sounds as if he has admitted to leaking classified information. He also knows the “whistleblower” who isn’t a whistleblower – but a leaker and CIA operative as well as political activist, whistleblower, sorry, but no.
Schiff orchestrated this. He is in cahoots with Brennan, as this is the CIA effort to effect a coup. Involving the moron Schiff was their biggest mistake, but maybe the CIA deep state knew they would have a hard time convincing others the sham being pushed is legitimate.

    CKYoung in reply to oldgoat36. | November 19, 2019 at 9:37 pm

    I’m wondering if schiff promised this guy some kind of immunity. That isn’t going to work for the military. I see a Court Marshall in this guys future. If convicted on the charges I think they will bring, he’s going to be demoted to the lowest enlisted rank, forfeit all pay/benefits and spend a long, long time in Leavenworth. Maybe after the dust settles, Devin Nunes can visit him in prison and greet him with “Hello Private vindman.”

    Oh yeah… He stuck a fork in Full Bull Colonel and his career. He’s going to have quite a few UCMJ Article violations to account for (@ a minimum, 133 and 134) and his violation of the oath he swore. His Article 15 hearing would make for good television…

I’ve been saying this since Vindman testi-lied in Schiff’s star chamber. He had no route to make anonymous accusations against Trump but had been palling around with Chulpa and Eric C, who did have a way to do it once the IC IG made the retroactive change to allow hearsay as ‘whistleblower’ evidence.

Only an insecure individual corrects someone addressing them by the wrong title. Mr. instead of Lieutenant Colonel is not an insult for a civilian. Vindman wore civilian clothes on his job with the Trump administration, so he was using his uniform for effect.

In his deposition, Vindman said he was fearful that Trump was interfering with U. S. foreign policy, which is ignorant of the fact that the president makes foreign policy.

What we have here is an arrogant political operative disguised as a soldier.

While Vondeman may be protected by the US military command staff, he has admitted to numerous violations of the UCMJ. By wearing his dress blues to remind us that he is a serving military officer, he has an obligation to follow the orders of those above him in the chain of command. He does not have the authority to ignore direct orders, standing orders or official policies. He can question those orders, to some extent. But, he can not simply decide not to follow those orders. And, he certainly can not unilaterally decide to actively oppose those orders and policies. If this guy was some captain in an infantry unit somewhere, he would be sitting before a general court martial right this minute, not before a House committee.

So Vindman is the weaselly little pogue who ran and gossiped to the “whistle blower”. And, both he and Schiff have repeatedly lied to the committee and the American people.

We don’t know that Vindman isn’t the “whistleblower” gossip-monger himself. The stuff about Ciaramella all came from Democrats—we assume inadvertently, but these “oopsies” could have been plants to obscure Vindman’s trail.

    RITaxpayer in reply to tom_swift. | November 20, 2019 at 6:28 am

    “We don’t know that Vindman isn’t the “whistleblower” gossip-monger…”

    I’m still trying to figure out the difference between ‘whistle blower’ and ‘anonymous source’.

they need to investigate LT Col Vindman beyond the leaker/whistle blower

In light of this news…

https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/ukrainian-indictment-reveals-hunter-biden-group-made-165-million-mp

…when Trump signed this Executive Order do you think he already knew about the extensive corruption between the Ukraine government and the Democrats?

https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/executive-order-blocking-property-persons-involved-serious-human-rights-abuse-corruption/

.. and Oh, the FBI wants to interview the “Whistleblower”

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