As you know, I’m not for Trump for many reasons, including that making big government great again is only a mild improvement over the current situation, and potentially worse. Smaller government and more individual liberty is my benchmark, and I think that’s achievable in an election cycle with fundamentally flawed Democrat candidates.
But I also hope I have not denigrated Trump voters. There is a real and politically ignored hurting in America that lands a meaningful percentage of Republican voters (so far, 30-40%) comprising many cross-over Democrats into a so far unmovable voting block.
I’ve pointed to the immigration issue and the sense of loss of country. But it may be deeper than than, going to a level I / we can’t truly understand.
It’s summarized in an excellent article in US News, by attorney Michael A. Cooper, Jr. in North Wilkesboro, North Carolina, A Message from Trump’s America:
I live in Trump’s America, where working-class whites are dying from despair….
So if there are winners and losers in America, I know the losers. They lost jobs to China and Vietnam. And they’re dying younger, caught in an endless cycle of jail, drug charges and applying for disability to pay the child support bill.
They lost their influence, their dignity and their shot at the American Dream, and now they’re angry. They’re angry at Washington and Wall Street, at big corporations and big government. And they’re voting now for Donald Trump.
My Republican friends are for Trump. My state representative is for Trump. People who haven’t voted in years are for Trump. He’ll win the primary here on March 15 and he will carry this county in the general.
His supporters realize he’s a joke. They do not care. They know he’s authoritarian, nationalist, almost un-American, and they love him anyway, because he disrupts a broken political process and beats establishment candidates who’ve long ignored their interests.
When you’re earning $32,000 a year and haven’t had a decent vacation in over a decade, it doesn’t matter who Trump appoints to the U.N., or if he poisons America’s standing in the world, you just want to win again, whoever the victim, whatever the price.
The article focuses on poor whites, because that is where the author lives. But I think it applies beyond poor whites, to people of many races and ethnicities who have been left behind and who are invisible to the pundit and political class. And not only the poor, but the formerly upper middle class who are downwardly mobile.
Not all Trump voters fit into these categories, but enough do that it matters.
Democrats for decades have been able to offer the welfare state as the solution. Trump offers an alternative, even if that alternative may be more hype than reality. Much of the manufacturing that has left is never coming back, no matter what.
The column also goes on to predict doom for Trump in a general election because of Trump.
But that’s not the main point. The main point is that I / we don’t live in that world. And it’s about time we started paying attention and offering an alternative to Democrats, and to Trump.
If it’s not already too late.
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Comments
This is the result of our stellar public education.
What a pathetic example of the America voter.
Yes, part of the turnout at the polls is Operation Chaos used against us, but sadly there are far too many who think this Charlatan is the answer.
Bad enough that Rush, Hannity, and a few other so called conservatives are pimping for this ugly hatemonger, prey for the uninformed.
So you still don’t get it. We hear you loud and clear. The people that back Trump, that got screwed by the changes of the last few decades, who voted TEA party but saw that the GOPe wouldn’t listen. Those people are simply ignorant.
They couldn’t possibly have a legitimate list of grievances. They are simply ignorant and deluded.
You are why it is too late. The problem is that you cannot imagine a world beyond your own. You cannot see every day guys losing their jobs, families, dignity and lives because of the globalist policies our elites have enacted.
You blame the education system? For what? Sending jobs overseas? For bringing in endless floods of illegals? For flooding our neighborhoods until our ER waiting room looks like a Chiapas bus stop?
You make the author’s point better than he did.
And now – like the Tea Party people – Trump followers are being vilified as stupid, ignorant, racist thugs.
…and don’t forget us retired folks who actually saved for our retirement, only to see our nest egg essentially stolen by the government and Wall St. I planned for a 5% return on my savings and now I’m getting nothing.
Difficult to believe that you would write what you just did after what the Professor said. Obviously, reading isn’t your strong suit. You’ve just insulted and denigrated far more than what you perceive as low-information, uneducated voters.
We’re highly educated in this household, post-graduate, and beyond, and while we’re for Cruz, we understand Mr. Trump and will have no problem voting for him in the General Election.
I’ve watched my well-educated kids struggle to find a full-time job. Thanks to Obamacare, when one of my sons returned to this area (his wife finished pharmacy school – and she and her family didn’t just fall off the boat…)he could only find a 29/hr/wk job with one of the local municipalities. 2yrs. he did that job, all the while looking for full-time work. AND that job had previously only been filled by high school grads. Now that office has all college grads, and when he finally landed a full-time job, they had 90 applicants for his position! My other son’s health insurance tripled and until he got full time employment, btw, he is now a proud veterinarian, we had to help pay the premiums.
There are plenty of well-educated and WISE people out there who have just cause to believe that the real charlatans are in DC, in the Democrat party, and now that we’ve seen how the GOP-E enables all the Leftists policies, we believe they’re charlatans too.
Not only that, but the doom and gloom and “big government” predictions regarding what Trump can and will do — by people who have listened to the anti-Trump propaganda from all sides, and don’t actually know the guy — isn’t going to happen.
There is absolutely nothing that renders someone such as Ted Cruz or Marco Rubio more qualified than Donald Trump to be the chief executive of the U.S.
Good point, and deep in my heart I think the same re: why Cruz or Rubio over Trump? Can’t quite see it. Now Trump is the battering ram, and he gets things started, Cruz is the process person – good for the details required.
Too many people make the mistake of thinking Trump is not a smart man. They’re wrong.
Oh, and one other point, there are also people who condemn Trump on several issues, including the PP situation – yet I find that our Republicans in DC should be just as condemned – they’re the ones who keep funding PP, all the while excusing themselves. But there can be no excuse, only prevarications regarding so many of the hated Leftist/Democrat policies that the GOP keeps funding.
Yes. Re PP. Exactly. Why is it still funded. How hard should that have been. And myriad other funded things.
—
Meanwhile, Ted Cruz (who was my first choice, but he can’t win) continues the ridiculous claim that he’s going to “abolish the IRS”. So apparently the self-employed proprietor of a little business who grosses $100,000 with $80,000 in overhead to earn that gross is ostensibly going to “mail in a postcard” and pay the same amount of taxes as the guy who gets a $100,000 salary with no overhead. Right. Sure. No. -Gong-.
If you want Ted Cruz to pick the constitutional conservative judges, then that’s what he should be doing — advising the president on judicial appointments. He doesn’t need to be attending to all kinds of things outside of his areas of expertise and talents in order to do that.
“We’re highly educated in this household, post-graduate, and beyond, and while we’re for Cruz, we understand Mr. Trump and will have no problem voting for him in the General Election.”
Right on the nose! Me too. Exactly. Thank you!
LP, as a Constitutional conservative, I can sympathize with the plights you describe, but Trump is not the answer. America doesn’t need a new king to “reign” over his subjects; Americans are not subjects, we are free citizens, endowed by our Creator–not our government, and certainly never by Trump–our inalienable rights.
Forgetting that in an understandable moment of anger and dissatisfaction–an anger and dissatisfaction we all feel–leads to very poor choices. Trump is a very poor choice. He not only doesn’t understand America’s founding principles, but I can guarantee you, if anyone asked him what they are, he would babble inanely about being “great.” He has no clue–zero clue–what it is that has always made America great. He doesn’t even understand how we falter now; he wants to be “neutral” between Israel and “Palestine”? SERIOUSLY? I’m sorry, he’s just tugging on emotion to get ahead, and he has thought nothing about . . . anything.
Anyone, ANYONE, who says America can be “neutral” regarding Israel is an absolute idiot, an unAmerican scam artist who doesn’t get that America supports Israel. Always. As we should. I was already anti-Trump and have been since he toyed with the idea of running in 2011, but this, if nothing else, is a deal-breaker. I will never, ever vote for Trump. Never. I will write in someone else (Ted Cruz) before I vote for this unAmerican progressive shyster.
I bet you voted for Romney.
Romney, a supporter of abortion, supporter of Planned Parenthood, a supporter of amnesty, a supporter of tariffs on china, an employer of illegal aliens, and a man with bankruptcies.
Romney, the father of Romney care, the grandfather of Obamacare.
And much praise of the devil hisself, Donald Trump.
Hypocrite much?
Project much?
Who did you vote for? 0bama? I think nearly everyone here voted for McCainez and then Romney. Definition of insanity. I’m done explaining why Trump supporters are Trump supporters. We all know why. The Trump Hate cult also knows and refuses to admit it.
I was for Cruz, donated several times to his Senate campaign, looked forward to his candidacy and read all about all the GOPe’s attempts to ensure he would NEVER win. I still believe he will not; that they would rather have Hillary or the Bern than Cruz. But their derangement over Trump has killed the Cruz goodwill in a lot of us, and Cruz’s smarmy, low and snide attacks, his Beck association, his collusion with the Bushies, have done him in as far as I’m concerned. He cannot win the general and we are done voting for a loser. Trump looks like a winner to us.
Furthermore, find a constitutional conservative that can win the general in this toxic political climate. I say to you he or she does not exist. Dying on our hill of principles is still death. I’m not doing it again. Not ever. We are supposed to back down, when we’re winning? How about you losers back down?
Whoever has ears, let them hear…
If you don’t have principles, don’t vote.
If you ignore your principles to “win”, you’ve lost.
“If you ignore your principles to “win”, you’ve lost.”
But you voted for Romney, ignoring all those “principles” you claim to have.
I think your “principles” are momentary.
Project much indeed.
Hi, Fuzzy. You make good points, and what’s difficult is trying to figure out who and what is the right answer. No, I don’t believe we can be “neutral” on Israel, Palestine or the Middle-East, in that respect events out of our control will be the driving force, and has been for the last century. The next president will be forced to deal with the fallout from this president’s interference, and I believe, wrong attitude toward Israel. Forces outside the Oval Office will shape the presidency in the future.
The problem for many, including my household, is that the Republican Establishment has damaged the brand so much within the “base” that nothing they say now can or should be trusted. Virginia’s last governor’s race was proof positive that they only pay lip service to the platitudes they spout every election cycle. So, where do the people go to stop the madness by the DC Uniparty?
What’s happening in Europe is coming to America, and it’s the European Union which brought them to that state. In our case, it’s a political power structure which wants total globalization and are perfectly willing to sacrifice America’s sovereignty.
I don’t fear a Trump presidency, maybe that’s a better way to describe why I can be a defender and voter for him, if he is the nominee.
I agree the GOP brand is dead. The GOPe killed it.
For Peg_C. I’m with you on this, Peg.
“I was for Cruz, donated several times to his Senate campaign, looked forward to his candidacy and read all about all the GOPe’s attempts to ensure he would NEVER win. I still believe he will not; that they would rather have Hillary or the Bern than Cruz. But their derangement over Trump has killed the Cruz goodwill in a lot of us, and Cruz’s smarmy, low and snide attacks, his Beck association, his collusion with the Bushies, have done him in as far as I’m concerned. He cannot win the general and we are done voting for a loser. Trump looks like a winner to us.”
Yesterday, Cruz commented that Trump supporters were uninformed, and being “taken advantage of”… he sounded more like John McCain calling us “wacko birds” and “hobbits” than a person who sees the Evil represented by the DC Uniparty. It was unacceptable. The only “taken advantage of” that we’ve seen is by the Republican party, lying to the people over and over again.
while I understand and appreciate the anger driving Trump voters (shared by me, but i am for cruz), i fear they will be sorely disappointed with a president Trump who may put deal making above principle. for example regarding the border “meh, i tried, but if i cant build a wall no one can”.
i will support Trump in the general if he wins the nomination and i hope my concerns regarding his follow-through are wrong! for now though, i support Ted Cruz.
I agree with your concerns which is why I support Cruz in the primaries.
But these stinkers (not you) who brag about not supporting Trump if he is the nominee turn my stomach. … ready to hand the Presidency and SCOTUS over to left wing Democrats. They are ready to proudly stab America in the back.
Trump is a battering ram and that is what his voters have wanted. Someone who will stick it to everyone who has been sticking it to the public for decades. We don’t matter to those in power. The thing is, will anyone matter to Trump either?
Why don’t we hear anyone asking whether Marco Rubio actually gives a crap about anyone other than himself.
And what has Ted Cruz ever done for others? Waiting to hear the heart-warming stories…
Still waiting… Where are the down-thumbers’ examples proving that either Rubio or Ctuz has done something for someone else.
Here’s another fairly eloquent post on Trump voters. Consider giving it a read if you are still in high dudgeon over the thought of a Trump presidency.
Go Ted! But if Teh Don is nom’ed, I’ll vote for him. Over Hillary? Snort, now that’s a no brainer.
http://www.professorbainbridge.com/professorbainbridgecom/2016/02/donald-trump-is-the-beta-test-of-a-cure-for-the-revolt-of-the-elites.html
It doesn’t matter whether Trump’s supporters matter to Trump. If they manage to get him elected, they will finally matter to the Republican Party establishment, or the Republican Party will be dead. They win either way. And if he turns out to be a good president, that will be a bonus.
Exactly. Trump is our murder weapon. The victim is the GOPe, first. Until they are defeated, there is simply no chance of defeating the leftist party.
Exactly!
I support Cruz. I will vote for him in my State’s primary.
While I do believe Trump is a big government guy at heart, I don’t think Trump is quite as much of a charlatan as, for example, Lee Jan seems to think. He has made some things (the wall, muslim immigration) his signature issues, he knows how to get things done, and I don’t think his ego will permit him to be President without attempting to follow through on those things. So, in some important ways, I think he would change the status quo for the better.
Voting in the general is all about one thing: which of the two candidates with a chance to win is preferable. Trump, in my view, would be far preferable to either Hillary or Bernie. So, if Trump is the nominee, I will be voting for him (especially if he makes Cruz or someone similarly conservative his VP, which he ought to do to help pacify/ lock down the conservatives. That would make a real conservative the presumptive next presidential candidate once Trump is done, a not insignificant thing). And I think it would be foolish for anyone on the right not to do likewise.
Well said
Excellent, and I feel the same way.
Rush had a caller today who said 1) he was a “true conservative” 2) he would vote for Hillary if Trump was the nominee. Anyone who can say they would actually pull the lever for Hillary vs just staying home if they don’t want Trump is either not telling the truth, or they don’t know as much as they think they do.
I won’t vote for a person who belongs in prison, and should have been there years ago. The Clintons have done far more harm to this country than almost any other person I can think of, nothing justifies voting for her and seeing her in office. If that happens, then I truly despair for my country.
Is this what the Weimar Republic experienced? Is that why they chose a young disruptive firebrand to take on the things that the country didn’t like? The country hailed this new leader that kicked those hated issues to the curb. The called him charismatic … I wonder.
The thought that keeps running through my mind is that those that forget the past are doomed to repeat it. 🙁
You’ve just invalidated any further arguments you could actually make by Godwinning yourself. Good job.
Actually, Shane didn’t say anything about National Socialism or, if you wish–Nazis. He’s actually pointing out the FACT that the German voters in the Weimar Republic (you know, that form of government we used to have until Democrats got serious about developing the One State mode under their guidance—as developed by Wilson and FDR) did throw off the ‘chains’ of poor governance by electing a firebrand with New Ideas for the republic, who used that influence then to bypass the low-polling legislative branch (those do-nothing politicians that stand in the way of his progress, which Democrats and progressives love to denigrate).
And just like that, dictatorial powers were given over to one man who then used mass media and the security powers at hand to get rid of those who didn’t fit in…which can easily happen here because there are too many people who ignore the past, refuse to see parallels to their own time, and blindly fall for sweet words that mimic their frustrations. For an example, look at how Bush/Obama used the TSA/IRS to corral ‘poor-thinking’ citizens and the crony capitalists at CBSNBCABCFSN tell the small thinkers what to think.
OMG thank you princepsCO. I am glad someone understood 🙂
I see, because in the internet age nothing can be compared to that time in history not because there are comparisons to be made but because so many have made false comparisons.
So you the ultimate arbitrator of all that is logical will now denounce the heretic because the heretic has used the forbidden time and culture for comparison. Which makes my statement about the past more and more relevant.
Will you be the one that turns in his neighbor to the Stazi because you believe that your neighbor is a heretic? I think yes, which is why Trump frightens me i.e. because of people like you.
Godwin called Shane. You can stop commenting now.
Your problem is it is a stupid comparison. Neither the supporters of trump, nor trump, are anything like the people of the period you describe.
It is the last refuge of losers that have nowhere else to turn, godwin be damned.
I probably would have used an Obama comparison and left Germany out of it.
There’s probably a law for that too.
Yikes, where were you when Reagan set the electorate on fire? Were you calling him Hitler? Did you call Guilliani a Nazi, like so many NY liberals as he rescued their city from the NY mafia?
Write-in a ballot for Boehner for president, you’ll feel more comfortable. Then live in 4 years of hell under Hillary Clinton. You’ll find out what fascism is REALLY all about.
Just stop with the Hitler crap. You beclown yourself.
“They’re angry at Washington and Wall Street, at big corporations and big government. And they’re voting now for Donald Trump.”
Why does their ‘anger’ matter more than my anger?
The idea that Trump supporters have a monopoly on anger steals from and vandalizes the hard work of grassroots groups everywhere who have been putting their anger to work for much longer by getting principled Constitutionalists into office for the last eight years.
I reject the premise that they are angry.
If they are genuinely angry, then they would be as outraged as I am over the story of Vera Coking. Or outraged that $100k was given to the Clinton Foundation and the likes of Harry Reid the same time Democrats were plotting to sign Obamacare into law.
What I get instead is a shrug or an improvised excuse the way Hillary supporters do with their candidate’s record.
That makes me angry.
Because these voters have been IGNORED by people just like you for decades. Because your principled constitutionalists gave us obamacare, a removal of the debt ceiling entirely, put our families into so much debt that there’s no way to repay it all, sent jobs overseas, or imported non-citizens to take our jobs and keep our wages low. Because those constitutionalists have led to a decrease in the moral fabric of this country and have given us gay marriage, and the removal and re-writing of our history. Because those constitutionalists you’re babbling about talk a great game, and do NOTHING for the people that voted them into office.
“Because these voters have been IGNORED by people just like you”
1. What part about Trump’s use of eminent domain against private citzens are you IGNORING?
“Because your principled constitutionalists gave us obamacare,…
2. Then why are you ignoring the fact that Trump gave to Harry Reid and Clinton knowing their push for Single Payer? This makes ZERO sense. Who’s doing the ignoring here?!
“those constitutionalists you’re babbling about talk a great game, and do NOTHING for the people that voted them into office.”
Do you even know the facts about who is and who isn’t for Single Payer? Who’s really babbling here?
Know Their Record
I hope every Trump opponent keeps talking and writing just like this. The contempt drips from every word. With every sentence you make it clearer why Trump is inevitable now.
You also make it clear that your wing of the party is either ineffectual or outright flipped. Good job. Most of Trump’s voters don’t want a ‘constitutionalist’ or anything like that unless it brings results.
They want their jobs back. They want their homes back. They want their hospitals, schools, and neighborhoods back. If your folks wanted to do that they could have.
It never happened. We tried it your way and got screwed.
OMG this is it in nutshell:
And let me finish the quote for clarity … NO MATTER WHAT THE COST.
This is flat out authoritarianism. This person wants a dictator.
Nothing you said was in response to or refutes the points I laid out.
Just that I am “dripping with contempt”.
But here’s the most glaring admission from you yet…
“Most of Trump’s voters don’t want a ‘constitutionalist’ or anything like that unless it brings results.”
You didn’t answer even one of my actual points Aucturian. How have your constitutionalists actually prevented the flood of illegals crossing the border? How have they stopped companies like Disney from hiring H1B visa holders to do the jobs that were ALREADY held by American workers, and then firing those same workers?
How have they stopped the march of the Marxist left through academia, and therefore the rest of the culture?
And, Auc, to answer your last point. Why the *hell* would I vote for someone if they aren’t going to get results. Voting for someone that’s not getting results is *dumb*. Are you dumb?
Do you live in a cloud or just have your head there? I don’t need to refute anything you say.
You are perfectly making my point. Your side has called half of their party losers, ignorant, uneducated, and when that doesn’t work, nazis, racists, and rednecks.
Everything you wrote is irrelevant unless we can stop the arterial hemorrhaging at the border and the jobs getting offshored. Sure it makes the elites and the donor class happy but it’s grinding the rest of America into the dirt.
Getting results is not a glaring admission. It’s a fact. The glaring admission would be if you admitted that your kind has been shafting Average Joe. That your efforts have meant nothing unless it’s advanced the globalist agenda, open borders horse hockey.
Oh and Shane you finish your sentences and I’ll finish mine thank you. Have some common courtesy. I didn’t write that nor did I intend it. If I did I would have wrote it.
You’re surprised that the average American simply wants results? What the hell do you think they want? A ‘principled conservative’ that will sell them out before his seat’s warm? A true constitutionalist that will get nothing done for them? Four more years of the same regardless of the party?
As long as it’s working for you everything must be fine. Please keep writing more. Contempt? You’ve moved into outright hate.
Of course because truth and logic are for people that are in the way of you tearing down the elites.
And which side is that? Once again if you don’t need to refute me why set up the straw man.
I am shocked at how basic macro economics is lost on people. Your statement is the same statement made by Democrats when they are pandering to the working class. It is union to the core and anti-free market. This is what I have suspected about Trump supporters. Just a hint the market is not a fixed pie.
Would you give up free speech to get results? What about freedom of religion? Gun rights? Right not to self incrimination? What thing do you deem so important that we must give up our rights for? That you even think that we have to give up (sacrifice) something just lets me know that you have a 5 year plan.
No, I am surprised that people like you would sacrifice their freedom for security errr results.
I hate ANYONE that would take my freedom away. Sorry I guess that means I hate you.
I know what team you are on because you just waved your big virtue signalling flag.
Quit making assumptions. You know nothing about what Trump supporters want or need.
I am not discussing this with you because you cannot reason someone out of something they were never reasoned into.
You throw out wild accusations, stupid conclusions, and then tell me you hate me. Good for you. That is exactly how to influence people. Keep it up.
No one said anything about giving up anything. We will not give up our first amendment, second, third (no you cannot billet a soldier in my home), or any other right. You take the leap right off a cliff when you suggest that anyone wants those results. No one said ‘at any price’. No one said, please install Donald the First because we want a king. That is all part of your fevered imagination or simply slander.
You set up a ridiculous strawman because you are both contemptuous and hateful (or you say you are). Just admit it. You hate Americans who are less well off than you. You think you know better how to run their lives than they do. You cannot imagine that they have their own skills and dreams and plans for their own lives and might know what’s better for themselves than you do.
You think you can throw boogeymen out and one of them will work? Trump the dictator, Trump is Hitler reborn.
For goodness sakes even if anyone wanted to run like a dictator there are limits the American people would never let him go beyond.
This isn’t Europe of the Thirties. We’re not going to get Generalissimo Trump.
Results?
I just pointed you to Cruz’s record of casework in Texas upholding everything from 2nd amendment to 10th amendment rights. How he fought Boehner and introduced his set of Bills to counter Obama’s executive action.
Talk about Results. What has Trump done besides funding $100k to the Clinton foundations and the likes of Harry Reid knowing full well that they had an agenda to carry out the very things you listed?
Aren’t you contradicting yourself with this kind of logic:
I want results…therefore…I’ll pass on the person who has the results to show for and elect someone who not only has nothing but worked against the results I wanted.
Who said throw out security for results? I sure as hell didn’t say that. No one but you did (another strawman).
Who said give up any rights for those results? No one. If you can’t discuss your merits at least stick to the facts.
“For goodness sakes even if anyone wanted to run like a dictator there are limits the American people would never let him go beyond.”
You just did. When you said earlier
“Most Trump voters don’t want a ‘constitutionalist’ or anything like that unless it brings results!”
“How he fought Boehner and introduced his set of Bills to counter Obama’s executive action.”
That has really worked out well.
The problem with your argument, and you know it, is that millions of us who want to vote for Trump are exactly what you claim to be. What we see is at this point in time, with this GOP, IT WILL NEVER WORK. The GOPe did everything in its power to ensure Cruz could not get the needed delegates. They didn’t plan for Trump. Have you forgotten Little Jebbie already? He would probably, as awful as he is, be scooping up delegates all over right now but for Trump.
You people seriously don’t get it. WE don’t want to lose a 3rd presidential election in a row but we also refuse to go along with anything the GOP establishment. We are threading the needle and so far it’s working. We KNOW Trump isn’t conservative. No conservative was ever going to win! Why don’t you get this??
Edit: “anything the GOP establishment wants to FOIST on us.”
“No conservative was ever going to win!”
Comments like this are why McCain and Romney were foisted off on us the last 2 election cycles. People talk about not wanting the same old same old than stab the candidate that is different in the back saying they aren’t electable or they can’t win and jump on a squish’s bandwagon because, “they can win”. I have one question that I want an honest answer to. Which conservative candidate that has won the nomination has lost the general election?
“Which conservative candidate that has won the nomination has lost the general election?”
An impossible to answer question of course. The republicans do not nominate conservatives and actively work to defeat them, always preferring the other parties candidate in that case.
It wasn’t the GOPe that got Reagan the nomination or the general election. They actively worked against him.
“It wasn’t the GOPe that got Reagan the nomination or the general election. They actively worked against him.”
That was my point. When a conservative received the nomination despite the GOPe he won the general. Why do you believe Trump with his huge negatives is a better candidate than Cruz? Do you have any information to support this theory? The polls I have seen look like we are throwing the presidency back to the Dems if Trump is nominated.
” Why do you believe Trump with his huge negatives is a better candidate than Cruz? Do you have any information to support this theory? The polls I have seen look like we are throwing the presidency back to the Dems if Trump is nominated.”
The polls of a national election mean nothing at this point. One reason why: The pollster asks a cruz supporter who they would support in a trump/hill match. Some cruz supports say hill, even though they will not vote for shrillary.
Until the parties have their selections the polls mean nothing.
The electorate has changed since Reagan was elected, and Reagan got some help from events of the day. However, I do think a good conservative can win an election. I have nothing but a gut feeling that Cruz cannot do it. There are negatives about Cruz not in play just yet. Shrillary will be playing those every day. I do not believe Cruz can win the battleground states, trump can. It is that simple.
Trump may not be your kind of conservative but he is not what he is being painted as by many of the anti-trump contingent. You know, the same people that happily voted for Romney, and claim he was a conservative, and yet he held worse views on many of the very subjects trump is hit on.
Trump will not take hillarys shit. Cruz will. Trump will have no problem bringing Juanita Broaderick up on stage to tell her story. The GOPe/Cruz will never do it.
But, I didn’t switch from Cruz to Trump because of my belief about who is the most electable. I went Trump because he doesn’t give a flip about the GOPe, and until the donor class is defeated, we will never defeat the left. Trump is simply my murder weapon of choice. Cruz will never be that.
“But, I didn’t switch from Cruz to Trump because of my belief about who is the most electable. I went Trump because he doesn’t give a flip about the GOPe, and until the donor class is defeated, we will never defeat the left. Trump is simply my murder weapon of choice. Cruz will never be that.”
If Trump wins the nomination I do believe you are correct. The GOP will cease to exist. However I don’t believe it will defeat the donor class. They will be able to buy influence in the new party just as they did before (money talks). I prefer using the method the Tea Party started to put people in positions with character. The only candidate that was Tea Party backed that has stabbed us in the back that I can think of is Rubio. The rest have been solid conservatives that have started to move the needle. Trump is a stick of dynamite in the works. If he is allowed to go off how long will it be before we have a chance to build a new party? The left will have a generation to indoctrinate kids and we will be waiting for them to run out of our money.
About Romney I didn’t like him, but I did vote for him. My only reasoning for that was Obama had to at least pretend to be moderate during his first term. I knew if he was re-elected the gloves would come off and we would pay for it. Unfortunately I feel I was right. Oh and by the way I would have been working against Romney this election for the same reason.
As far as taking Hillary’s shit during the run up to the general I think you are wrong. With the correct running mate, Carly Fiorina, I believe Hillary could be negated. Of course if Hillary is in jail or loses the nomination a different course would need to be charted.
My biggest concern with Trump is his negatives like Trump U and however much other stuff the media has on him. One point to think about, how far would Trump be if the MSM wasn’t running point for him? Think about how much coverage Trump gets compared to the other candidates. Trump has been able to get the most bang for his bucks because he hasn’t had to buy much air time. That will change in the general. Instead of reporting either a pro Trump message or neutral Trump message it will be anti Trump everything while the Democrat receives the pro messaging. Can Trump deal with that? Cruz has already proven that he can.
I think you mean “Don’t ‘denigrate’ them.” Denegrate sounds like some terrible racial operation.
thanks, somehow that slipped by our layers and layers of spell checkers.
I actually know somebody who fits the Trump supporter description almost to a tee, the only difference is that he’s in California now. He briefly considered Trump, but soured quickly, mainly because he takes responsibility for his choices and understands that there are free market solutions.
I think it positively reflects on conservatism in California.
Nice try Mr. Jacobson, but
You are four !@#$%^& months too late!
I complained, a lot of other people complained, you told us a lot of people complained. You were happy with the situation.
Now you expect us to hold hands and sing koombayah?
I look at here. Subtract the flame wars and you are lucky to get thirty posts. I go to TCTH, I see threads with 1500 posts, some nastiness but mostly civil. On debate nights and primary nights, I see those threads get extended to four or five threads.
A word of advice Mr. Jacobson. You reap what you sow.
Then don’t come here anymore.
Hon, you just want to burn it down. That’s okay, I understand that sentiment but at some point, you’re going to need a plan to rebuild what you’ve destroyed. Be very careful what you wish for because the cure might be a thousand times worse than the disease.
No Mr. Jacobson burned down this site when he let certain people go apeshit on this site. I just want to bulldoze the remains.
Shooo, you’re stinking the place up.
Hah, you’ve already emailed me threatening to leave. Why didn’t you leave then? I’ll save you the trouble, and don’t let the door hit your bulldozer on the way out.
HandyGandy?
Synonym for idiot.
If you’re genuinely interested in grasping why some voters see something more attractive in one con-man vs. the other con-man, this sort of condescension isn’t going to help you much.
I don’t happen to know too many of the people whose beliefs and attitudes are cited here; most of my acquaintances, professional and personal, are top-of-their-class types. And far more of them see positive possibilities with Trump than they do with Cruz. Is that because they’re wacky, or is it because they have some imagination?
I like what you said, Tom, and agree. While I’ve supported Ted Cruz from his early days just getting to the Senate, and voted for him in our primary, I have a sense that Trump is actually, perhaps, is the right choice despite how I like Cruz. Ideally, of course, would love to see a Trump-Cruz ticket…I guess that places me in the wacky imagination/fantasy group. 🙂
Agree 100%. I was a Cruz person for 4 years. Can’t even express how disappointed I am in the antics of him and his campaign since Iowa, from Beck to the Bushies and everything in between. I’ve lost all respect for him and hubby, who always loved him, is irate over the lies and smarm and snark. Cruz doesn’t wear any of that well at all. Terribly judgment.
I do appreciate the gesture. I don’t think it will do any good. Just reading the comments makes that clear.
If these issues had been addressed honestly at any point in the last few decades Trump could have been avoided. The GOPe have by ignoring half of the party made Trump inevitable. If they continue their ways they will make what comes next unstoppable. Listen to the people now or we will see what a real nationalist looks like. And it’s not warm and fuzzy like Trump.
You’re absolutely right. The blame lays with the GOP establishment and no one else. This is why a lot of us actually do want to see the GOP destroyed and another party rise in its place. Hard to imagine that happening, but seriously wounding this party would be a great thing.
Thank you for your perspective professor.
For too long, many natural republicans have not been served well by the Republican Party. Their homes are falling apart, their jobs are gone or replaced by illegal Mexicans, and their communities are ravaged by drugs. Their elected representatives are selling them out.
Every 4 years the Republican Party barges in with a bogus pitch based on social issues. The party never does anything about these Social issues either. Social issues like abortion are great for sellout politicians, because they don’t have to do anything but dump the issue on the courts. The Republicans never win, just surrender, on the issues anyways. The only issue the party is any good on anymore is guns and that’s only because the NRA periodically expels its moderates.
Movement conservatives, including National Review, call these people losers.
But the Democrats, with their embrace of “white privlege,” don’t really help either. Bernie Sanders just said in a debate that poor white people cant be poor.
At the same time, I’ve never understood how the party could continue to run on essentially Romney’s platform (this time without Romneycare), given that Romney’s observation of the 47% is true, also given that Republican voters aged 35-50 are killing themselves in large numbers, & Republicans continue to lose states forever because future democrats continue to flood in across the border.
When I lived in Ithaca, I saw an upstate New York that was slowly rusting away.
When I lived in North Carolina, which votes on Tuesday I saw the Lumber flooring and furniture industry, which was world class in quality, fall apart. The Cheap Chinese junk was metaphorically killing them. Incidentally, the cheap Chinese junk was also literally killing the Americans who bought it. That wood flooring, sold by Lumber liquidators among others, turns out to have been full of all sorts of toxic chemicals.
Our political establishment is literally destroying American industry, work ethic, and know-how in exchange for cheap & toxic Chinese junk.
And the huge national debt and trade debts caused by this policy could grow so huge that one day only violence will solve their problem.
Its about time that elected representatives actually represented their voters.
Will that happen? Karl Rove, McConnell, Sasse, and Ryan’s trip to meet with Globalist Silicon Valley billionaires last week suggests otherwise.
I wonder what kind of mentality would down-vote your comment. It’s brilliant!
A vast generalization: “They lost their influence, their dignity and their shot at the American Dream, and now they’re angry.” Underlying this assumption is another assumption: that these people have no control of their lives whatsoever. It assumes that government is the problem and that government can be the answer.
I haven’t lost my influence, my dignity and the American Dream is a fallacy.
Anger should be directed into healthy action in your own life. It should not be directed as projection against the ambiguous “The Establishment” or used to promote a Super Spud. Wake up America this election is about you and the true object of your affections.
And, I don’t believe that the “just want to win again” thinking is the problem.
Instead, we want our winning to mean something. And we don’t want what we have won to be taken away to support losing.
Yes please tell that to a choke setter with hands like catcher’s mitts that he can get a job flipping burgers for a third of the wage. Except he cannot because those jobs go to illegals.
Tell it to the log truck driver with a twisted spine from years of tossing the chain across the logs that he can be a cube jockey. Tell him he can work in a call center at a half of his wage. Especially when he has none of the skills and no one will hire him.
Tell it to the hammer operator who’s put his whole life into his company who’s carrying the last twenty years in a cardboard box back to his car because his company is going to China or Mexico.
Because your life is representative of all Americans.
Why can’t they be pissed at the last two decades of betrayal and vote for who they want and try to find their place in the shrinking American dream.
The more you denigrate the people backing Trump the more people embrace him.
I am talking to them. I have worked as manual laborer for many years: machine operator, truck driver, welder, electrician, store clerk and many more.
I learned early on to better myself, to go to night school and learn new things so I wouldn’t become dependent on one industry or type of work. When manufacturing jobs dried up because of a slow economy I worked on becoming an engineer over many hours of study. I am currently a senior electrical designer in the power industry.
I taught myself AutoCAD and Microstation CAD systems. I taught myself programming for the devices used on equipment I helped design.
I traveled through out the U.S. and to many places in the world (including Saudi Arabia and S. Korea) to commission mfg. systems designed by the companies I worked with. Taking on these assignments made me more valuable to employers
I went through plenty of hard times to find work BUT each experience made choose to better myself. During those times
I took computer programming classes, physics, economics, accounting, business, theology…
Along the way I received a RE license and other professional licenses. It was during the times that I was out of work that I studied to obtain those licenses. I did not sit in front of my TV cursing the “system.”
I did not sit at home crying that “The Establishment” is so mean to me. BhWAAAAAA
And so I will be voting for Ted Cruz in the IL primary. No one else shares my values.
Trump does not share my blue collar values. Trump and Hillary are both big government monarchial solutions to manmade problems, problems people do not want to face.
Ted Cruz alone shares what I value and I will not vote for another.
“They lost their influence, their dignity and their shot at the American Dream, and now they’re angry. They’re angry at Washington and Wall Street, at big corporations and big government. And they’re voting now for Donald Trump.”
Obama’s campaign slogan was “Hope and Change”. Trump’s campaign could be called “Change of Hope” where the Change is to another One we Hope will restore things that we have ourselves given away and not with our vote.
Labeling the loss of “influence” and “dignity” and opportunity as Trump’s America (and corporately his ‘victimized’ supporters) befits the political hokum that posits Hopium in a new Personality as necessary to invoke external change, as juxtaposed against the “sad little lives” meme.
If you have discharged your “influence” and “dignity” and opportunity, don’t count on government to give that back to you. Government cannot give you what you have abused, forsaken or traded off.
i.e., SCOTUS cannot give homosexual marriage dignity just by saying “thus saith the court.”
What I related above about my blue collar life all came about by me being flexible, teachable and willing – all attributes of desired character. Good character produces hope. A candidate cannot produce hope. A candidate can only produce slogans. Good character acknowledges one’s own dignity and influence in the world and looks for opportunity to do good, to produce good.
My value, my dignity does not come from an external source on this earth. It comes from God. A candidate cannot give you and me dignity. And, I have influence with God because he made it so.
I don’t much like talking about my personal life, but I felt it necessary to share what I have learned and have done. The lack of wisdom in this age is astounding.
Beyond what I wrote above, I have raised four kids.
I am a Conservative Christian with God-given value.
To increase my understanding about life, in the sixties I began to listen to Milton Friedman about economics. Later I read books by another economist, Thomas Sowell, and then many others. I did not sit at home with my spouse decrying what life had given at me. My dignity was intact. I did not discharge my dignity to the care of another as folks are wont to do today.
Empirical evidence does matter:
I give you Milton Freidman &
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sUv_pySyoY0
Thomas Sowell
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNrHW1E8hRI
You have done admirably except in one instance. You still insist your life is representative of all Americans. You think because you did it anybody can.
You cannot take the left half of the bell curve and expect the same results as the right. That is nonsense.
You just said you have an electrical engineering degree. How many choke setters, chip truck drivers, and hammer operators have any chance of that? Five percent? Ten being generous. It is rarer than hen’s teeth.
You live in your bubble and think the world is alright because your life is. You have grit and determination. That is one ingredient. If you don’t have the chops for the math it doesn’t matter how much grit and determination you have.
So instead of denigrating the entire left half of our nation’s bell curve maybe you can understand why they cannot, not will not but cannot go where you have gone.
They will no more wind up an electrical engineer than you can dunk a basketball.
Everyone tends to think their life and world is representative of the world as a whole. That is a universal truth. Just like Bill Gates thinks every student should go to college. He’s intelligent but blind and arrogant.
All the Professor was asking is that you listen to Trump voters. That you take what they are saying seriously. If you aren’t capable of that sit back and think about why.
I have heard what Trump supporters are saying. They are angry about what they feel they cannot control.
I don’t believe you heard what I have been saying. You instead parsed out some points to use for a blue collar pity party. I won’t go there.
I do not want to enable self-pity. I want everyone to find their buried human dignity. And it won’t be found in Trump.
The Left, as does Trump in his own charlatan way, will tell you in effect that you are incapable of pulling yourself up. They will then tell you that they are the only authority, the only superior, who can lead you (their sheep) to better pastures. You and others have insinuated the meme often by acting helpless w/o a Trump presidency
I offered my life as but one example. There are many, many others across a broad spectrum of society. But you have to look outside the blue collar pity party to see this.
One fine example:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Janice_Rogers_Brown
It is better, and loving, for me to say these hard things now and for you to adjust your thinking, then have you fall into deep despair later because Trump has failed you. And, he will.
I completely understand why people are pissed off. Try owning a small business in a heavily regulated field beset with massive cronyism at the state level. For the last 10 years, it feels like I’m getting punched back two steps for every step forward and my option is what? Close my business because the government (federal and state) has decided to micromanage every breath I take? I SHOULD be able to work for myself and my customers without the government crawling up my hindquarters. Anyone in this country should be able to start a business without a massive bureaucracy breathing down their necks telling them the ability to work for yourself is a “privilege”. It’s not a privilege, it’s a freaking right.
I myself much prefer Cruz. However, conservatives have to rally around one person after the convention. All this bickering about never voting for Trump only ensures that Hillary wins.
If Trump gets the nomination, then Hillary has already won. I don’t believe it is about bickering, I believe it is about how Independents see Trump. That has nothing to do with the Republican party.
Wrong. E.g. Report: 46,000 Pa. Democrats Become Republicans Due To Trump
http://pittsburgh.cbslocal.com/2016/03/10/report-46000-pa-democrats-become-republicans-due-to-trump/#.VuG8BUug1Qs.twitter
LOL will they vote? And if they do will 46k be enough to swing the race. Straws if you keeping grabbing at them then maybe you can get one.
They went to the trouble of registering.
So let’s pretend that after they did it’s as likely as not that they won’t bother to vote?
Today Cruz guaranteed that every “low information” Trump voter will not vote for him. How is he going to win without thtat 40%?
You will absolutely be proven wrong.
How is this different from the Lefties whining for government to do something about their problems?
Because the government in direct collusion with the elites have caused these problems?
Because the people elected have done nothing they promised and now are in bed with who they said were our enemy?
Because regular Americans are shafted every chance the government/crony capitalists get?
Hell just enforce the laws we have. Give us our country back. Give us back our jobs. Just doing that in the last few decades would have ensured there was no Trump. Well now you’ve got him. If it’s not him it will be something you really don’t want next time.
Just like the eco activists the people that are asking to get things done will find very quickly that their causes will be co-opted by the forces of cronyism. Every collusion with the elites is driven by some well meaning piece of legislation that was enacted when something needed to be done.
Regulatory capture is real and just because you think it is a good cause now, how do you know what it will look like a few years in the future. Everyone thinks that there idea is necessary and good and that the law that comes from their idea will bring good things. This is how we got here and I don’t think more of the same will bring anything different.
You either did not read or did not comprehend. Enforce the laws we have now. Not every administrative code. Yes I know the difference. If you think I support agencies making their own laws and endless administrative codes you have no idea what I am about. I’ve seen what that garbage is about.
Would it be so bad to see wages go up, housing become affordable, unemployment go down?
Where do you think the administrative code comes from?
The problem on immigration is that everyone wants to limit it, but no one wants to enforce those limitations. I can say with certainty that Trump will do nothing to remove the millions of illegals, nor will he provide any solution for illegal immigration. Because the problem is not that simple if it were it wouldn’t be a problem.
None of the candidates as of so far have come up with a comprehensive immigration plan. People are going to come here no matter what, and if you think you can stop them then you think that the drug war is an unmitigated success.
What needs to be done is to provide immigrants with an easy path to citizenship with clearly defined rules. But this will never happen because people believe that immigrants destroy their standard of living and politicians demagogue this issue. So both sides talk about limits, but are unwilling to step into the endless abyss of funding and failure, in what will become the war on immigration.
Lack of understanding of macro economics is the reason you say this.
You’ve just completely disqualified yourself. Either the illegal invaders go or we don’t have country. No citizenship ever.
So more people willing to work for pennies on the dollar raises wages? More residents lowers housing costs?
Please explain how these oh so useful folks raise my standard of living.
You need to tell me more about macro economics. That will convince me.
LOL you won’t be “convinced” because it doesn’t follow your narrative about how things work. Why would you work to try to destroy what you believe is true. You won’t. It is just like a climate change model the bias is baked in and the system spits out exactly what the modeler expects. The truth sux that way, it can’t be negotiated with or shamed out of existence. So you are going to continue on in your happy bliss and nothing will change your mind.
Please tell me again about how blind I am. You keep making my point (and the Professor’s) over and over.
You need to pull the beam out of your eye before you can even see the splinter in mine.
Ss396 and Shane, yes!
Government solutions to government-made problems is one yuuge problem.
That is what entrenched established government is – a growing pyramid scheme con job that promises great benefits if you will only sign up and pay into it. That is why I am voting for Ted Cruz – to keep the government from holding me and the economic engine back.
There is nothing anti-Establishment about Trump. He is in vogue, though. He’s just another TV infomercial guy in a sharkskin suit talking smack. Money is no object to a man who sees bankruptcy as another business option and not as a moral bankruptcy. He has himself to blame for these failures and anyone who votes for him can blame themselves for failure.
Vote for the man who wants to disassemble government and return power to the people. Trump will consolidate government power and use it against you.
Did I just read that Cruz has hired the Bushes’ financial team?
Sounds principled to me.
Tell us why you think that.
Well Mr. Jacobson looks like your koombayah moment lasted a couple of hours.
Until Kimy got here next post in.
All Rise, President Hitlery is entering the Oval Office.
Feel free to sing along.
Hail to the Cheat we have chosen for the nation,
Hail to the Cheat! We salute her, one and all.
Hail to the Cheat, as we pledge cooperation
In proud fulfillment of a scammer, of us all.
Yours is the aim to make your bank account grander,
This you will do, that’s our strong, firm belief.
Hail to the one we selected as commander,
Hail to the President! Hail to the Cheat!
Every single American who doesn’t have a couple, few homes in other countries fits the Trump voter categories. Whether they understand that or not. This country is on the way to becoming third-world — economy, military, border security, infrastructure, educational system, and related. Everything else is secondary or at best, merely tangential to that.
Complaining that a Trump isn’t a Cruz would have been like the Founding Fathers arguing over the Federalist Papers before the Revolutionary War.
It occurred to me that not only are they ignoring the fact that many Trump supporters are actually “well-educated” and still want to make the choice for him, they’re also slamming the “less-informed” or poorly educated for supporting Trump…Some of the smartest and wisest people I’ve known in my life have been people who only had a high school degree (or less) but they had common sense, and a strong work ethic, and a moral compass – and they’re perfectly capable of choosing their candidate.
Cruz is almost certainly compromised at this point.
Not just his SuperPac giving money to Carly’s SuperPac, but the fact that he attended this Jeb Bush meeting as well as his doublespeak on immigration as detailed by William Saletan at Slate, really mean his supporters don’t have much to stand on when they criticize Trump or Trump voters.
Getting in bed with psycho Beck, then inviting the Bushies and making it an all-out orgy. Now slamming Trump voters as idiots, basically.
In no sane world is any of the above a winning strategy. And I was a Cruz person.
Anyway, I concluded that the US entered the “Post Constitutional” phase sometimes between the start of the first Bush Jr Presidency and the Second Obama one. Now one can argue just when (and some argue all the way as far back as the 14th or 17th Amendments or even Roosevelt’s ND but I disgree because whatever the merits OPENLY spitting on the Constitution did not become a habit at any of those times), but I think it’s quite funny the people comparing Trump to Hitler and imagining that times are not desperate esp considering this list by Conner Friedsdorf:
A precedent that allows the president to kill citizens in secret without prior judicial or legislative review
The power to detain prisoners indefinitely without charges or trial
Ongoing warrantless surveillance on millions of Americans accused of no wrongdoing, converted into a permanent database so that data of innocents spied upon in 2007 can be accessed in 2027
Using ethnic profiling to choose the targets of secret spying, as the NYPD did with John Brennan’s blessing
Normalizing situations in which the law itself is secret — and whatever mischief is hiding in those secret interpretations
The permissibility of droning to death people whose identities are not even known to those doing the killing
The ability to collect DNA swabs of people who have been arrested even if they haven’t been convicted of anything
A torture program that could be restarted with an executive order
http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2016/03/quick-limit-the-power-that-trump-or-clinton-would-inherit/472743/
Now here’s a question for all our little anti-Trumps: given the Republican party has both houses of congress and could count on the support of libertarians and people worried about civil liberties, why hasn’t any of this been repealed, investigated or, at least,somehow blocked?
You want us to be worried about what Trump MAY do when such things are ALREADY Happening? And I know quite a few of you hate Snowden, even though what he revealed was far worse an assault (or potential assault if someone misuses that information…c’mon..what do you THINK keeps some of our Senators and Reps in line) on the Constitution (because the NSA has no real checks and balances whatsoever)than Snowden’s arguable ‘traitorness’. Have the Republicans…have the Dems..have EITHER of the Uniparty tried to put real checks and balances (say for instance, PROTECTING certain types of whistleblowers, maybe having an actual bipartisan or rotating Congressional rep overseeing it, maybe getting of the stored info after 5 or ten years) on this abomination?
So please stop pretending you are for the Constitution when you’ve refused to hold your elected reps responsible for protecting it.
That’s not even mentioning the war on Due Process against students on College campuses and any poor service member (largely men of course) who gets accused of sexual assault
or impropriety these days.
http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=2740061
How’s the Republican party doing at protecting college students or the military they claim to love so much from radical feminists and stupid pedestalizing traditionalists?
Not so good I’m afraid.
Some come on, make your case for the GOP or Cruz if you can.
So, are you a Constitutionalist who hopes Trump will do a Constitution whack-a-mole job on all your outstanding ‘issues’?
Well, let’s see. I believe his point is that the other jackasses running have actually PROVEN that they won’t do anything, while we aren’t sure what Trump would do.
In this case, we know that Rubio and Cruz are liars, and there’s a “small” chance that Trump might do something about problems that the others have ALREADY ignored/covered up/lied about.
But, voting for the proven liars, that’s a good idea, right?
So, I believe your point is, no one can be trusted to do what you and others think is right by you and others? So, damn them all, except for certain liars?. Liars are everywhere and Trump the best liar?
Since you and some unnamed others read the thoughts and minds and intentions of others, prove to us with a sworn and notarized affidavit that says Cruz and Rubio are liars. Post the pdf here.
And make sure to let us know who you think is worthy of trust.
Ok, what got Mr Roboto Rubio elected to the senate? Was it his opposition to amnesty?
What did he DO when he got into office? Does the Gang of Eight ring any bells?
As for Cruz, at *best* he’s been completely ineffectual. At worst, almost everything he’s done has been kabuki theater. Either skipping votes on things he should be against, or voting for them (TPP comes to mind). On top of *that* Cruz is all for increasing H1B visas by 500%. 500%!!!
Kiss your fancy electical engineering job goodbye.
I won’t need to kiss my job goodbye. There isn’t competition from the likes of you.
And if I wanted to, I could work doing finances, or day trading or whatever meets my fancy.
The perverse speculation involved in this presidential race is like the perverse speculation involved in the climate change apocalypse hoax – totally unwarranted.
Trump is the only one making an issue of the exchange rate which is why we are poor. If something is done about the exchange rate, we (the poor) will all be richer. Cruz seems clueless on the exchange rate.
You are poor because of the exchange rate. Explain how?
The exchange rate has the same effect as a tariff. Many countries have tariffs on us and exchange rate advantage (the chronic exchange deficit is impossible without expanding the M2 money supply). These measures ship the manufacturing to other countries. The economic vitality of country is tied to what it can produce. When all the manufacturing is in another country, the people who would have factory work are getting poorer. The bosses get richer for three reasons. In the first case, they get an exchange rate advantage. In the second case, they don’t have to pay income taxes until the money is brought into the country. In the third case, their primary competition is from new startups who would normally have more money because of the manufacturing stimulus, and the foreign manufacturing is a barrier to entry. Look at the fall in entrepreneurial activity over the 30 years, and you will notice that it tracks the fall of wealth in the middle class. Entrepreneurial activity adds 90% of the jobs.
The rich guys are not stupid (as a group). They know that if they rob their competition, they will not have the resources to compete against them. By manufacturing in another country, they raise the barrier entry for their competition and lower their tax bill by about 90% on average.
The rich getting richer and the middle class losing 80% of their wealth in the last 20 years is exactly tied to the exchange rate (not that it is the only economic weapon). When Trump says he is going to make the country great by working the exchange rate, he made every CEO ego very concerned.
I’ll try to unpack some of this…
“The exchange rate has the same effect as a tariff. “ Maybe.
—A tariff affects the quantity of goods imported and is a stated amount. Exchange rates go up and down daily. As known, higher exchange rates makes exports more expensive and reduces the competitiveness of exporting firms. Lower exchange rate will make exports cheaper and exporting firms will benefit.
“Many countries have tariffs on us …” It depends on the country and the trade agreement and your business plan.
–“Some countries have very high duties and taxes; some have relatively low duties and taxes. If your product is primarily made in the U.S. of U.S. originating components it may qualify for duty-free entry into countries with which the U.S. has a free trade agreement (FTA). We currently have FTAs with more than 20 countries. Targeting FTA countries is a good market entry strategy because buyers pay less tariff for goods made in the U.S. compared with similar goods from countries without FTAs.”
http://export.gov/logistics/eg_main_018130.asp
“…and exchange rate advantage” (what advantage? Central bank backing?)
“These measures ship the manufacturing to other countries.” What measures and who is doing what?
“The economic vitality of country is tied to what it can produce. “ OK. I agree with this.
And let it be known that economic growth is the only thing that resolves income differences across the economy. But when economic growth is stalled by onerous government regulation and high taxation wages drop off.
“The rich getting richer and the middle class losing 80% of their wealth in the last 20 years is exactly tied to the exchange rate.” No. It is tied to economic growth which is tangentially tied to the exchange rate. There are many factors involved and many point back to Washington.
Economic growth is tied to fiscal and monetary policies. Fiscal policies can foster “hands off” growth or stagnation (taxation, regulation). FED policy seeks to maintain a stable fiat currency while using metrics that hardly anyone else can understand and use for forward guidance. Both sets of polices create vast amounts of uncertainty in the market. Uncertainty kills off entrepreneurial activity. Who wants to take inordinate risks?
CEOs are not the fault. They are not the bad guys. They are not holding on to you portion of the pie. The government has been down-shifting the economy without using the clutch.
Government regulation is a problem, but the exchange rate makes the most difference the fastest. For example, China was economic backwater unto 1992. They received a favorable exchange rate, and everyone in the world wanted to manufacture in China because the exchange rate made it the cheapest. They went from nothing to 40,000 factories constructed per month in only 3 months according to trade publications.
In Taiwan, the group that sets the exchange rate, Bank of International Settlements (BIS), gave an industry talk at the trade show. They told everyone at the talk (thousands of manufacturers) that they needed to figure on manufacturing in China by 1992 (in about 18 months), because the BIS was going to give the exchange rate to China. The exchange rate is not set by the economy (which is backwards logic, anyway), and Reagan proved that with his, “We’re going to move that”, remark.
As POTUS, Trump won’t have control over the exchange rate, but you have to give him props for making it a campaign issue. I never heard of anyone else do that.
Please keep in mind, that all this comes from a “mad” and “low info” Trump supporter. It isn’t just me, every other manufacturer knows the same thing. If the exchange rate can be made slightly more fair, the wealth of the middle class will balloon.
Some exchange rates can also be pegged to another currency to stabilize an emerging country’s currency.
Most exchange rates, though, are determined in the foreign exchange market by the market forces of supply and demand. The currency trading is continuous. These are called floating exchange rates.
How much demand there is in relation to supply of a currency will determine that currency’s value in relation to another currency.
Currencies can become over-valued or under-valued, leading to excessive trade deficits or surpluses, depending on what a government does to its currency.
And there are those who assert that ‘purchasing power parity’ and not the balance of trade that determines currency exchange rates.
I have heard it said that trade in goods and services accounts for less than 10% of total international capital flows, with investment accounting for the remaining 90+%
President Reagan, the BIS (if truthful), and thousands of manufacturers would disagree that the market sets the exchange rate. The exchange rate is set by the BIS. It is a private foreign bank, and they determine which country will manufacture the most. Trump, if he wants to as POTUS, could take steps to counteract the BIS. That is the fastest way to put the most money in the bank accounts of the middle class. You can take it to the bank (pun intended).
“The BIS offers a wide range of financial services specifically designed to assist central banks and other official monetary institutions in the management of their foreign exchange reserves.”
“The BIS effective exchange rate (EER) indices cover 61 economies, including individual euro area countries and, separately, the euro area as an entity. The most recent weights are based on trade in the 2011-13 period, with 2010 as the indices’ base year.”
“The BIS extends short-term credits to central banks, usually on a collateralised basis.”
From a cursory reading of what BIS is about, they appear to offer banking services to the international community. The EER indices appear to weighted averages indicating a country’s effective exchange rate based on uniform metric (maybe CPI) applied across the board. BIS may offer loans with interest against assets.
http://www.bis.org/about/index.htm
http://www.bis.org/banking/index.htm
Thnak you.
I am going home now to spend some M2.
I am not poor, I have a MS and 2 undergraduate degrees. See, Republicans have underestimated (some of us )Trump supporters , and that may be their downfall. I have never been denigrated, nor have I felt denigrated here at LI. Some posts are more passionate than others, hey, it’s all good. Supporting any single political figure is an act of perspective, an act of faith, as well as a gamble. My fundamental political position is that your opinion is valid for you, and as such should be respected. Ok, I was annoyed by the train wreck video, but I am over that. Blog on Professor.
As the emotional catharsis continues…
Something rarely mentioned by Trump supporters: Trump’s lack of perspicuity with regard to foreign policy is on par with Obama’s.
Both, I believe, would rather be golfing and tweeting than having deep thoughts. Both would rather stick it to their perceived ‘enemies.’
“The main point is that I / we don’t live in that world. And it’s about time we started paying attention and offering an alternative to Democrats, and to Trump.
If it’s not already too late.”
It is already too late. See the writings of Angelo M. Codevilla.
The sad irony is all the name-calling, both of Trump and of his supporters, by Trump-phobes and all the frightened haters, does nothing but further solidify Trump’s lead and guarantees his vicotry.
as a Trump Supporter… the only thing that would make me support Ted Cruz is if he repealed 0bamacare.
….and when I say repeal, I mean now… before 0bama is kicked out of office.
There is nothing the majority of Americans would like more than for 0bama to experience an immense amount of pain and suffering …that the dems wrought on citizens. Before he is gone for good.
and destroying his legacy will do that.
….Ted Cruz doesn’t seem to care enough to do that tho…. and the GOP doesn’t seem to have the balls to actually try that.
that would give him the momentum to get the nomination…. Like I said tho… he would have to physically repeal 0bamacare with a 60 proof veto breaker and ram it down 0bama’s throat. don’t think he has the balls/skill to do it tho. and even if he did…. I think Ted Cruz has a much higher chance of losing against hillary than Trump does.
Why? well, cuz Cruz seems a lil too much like romney.
Romney took a very winnable election, and didn’t go after obama on things like obamacare… and that is partially why he lost.
kasich I think might be looking to get the VP spot…. I think he knows Trump will win. (unless a repeal of 0bamacare happens…. which I doubt it will at this point)
“as a Trump Supporter… the only thing that would make me support Ted Cruz is if he repealed 0bamacare.
….and when I say repeal, I mean now… before 0bama is kicked out of office.”
So what you are saying is that if Ted Cruz suddenly walked and water and got a 100 angels to come down and take control of a bunch of democrats in congress so that a veto proof majority, IN BOTH HOUSES OF CONGRESS, was attained and Obamacare was repealed you would vote for him. WOW way to be objective with that one. The Democrats OWN Obamacare and will not admit it is a loser unless they lose this election. I don’t hate on Trump but he has way to much negative baggage for me to support. If he wins the nomination maybe, but I still doubt it. Wouldn’t matter in my state anyway, only Omaha is purple the rest is red.
I’m sorry, but Jacobson’s plea for us to listen to Trump supporters is rather pointless – and it smacks of the kind of apologist propaganda we relentlessly hear regarding the left’s own crazies (BLM, activist students, etc.).
Conservatives have relentlessly said good intentions (and righteous anger) does not justify bone-headed policy. It applies to EVERYONE, including those on the right who are headed over the cliff.
Frankly, Trump has changed me. I used to care about the alienated and unemployed white working class, I used to care that they are disproportionally dieing in middle age, I used to care about the disrespect shown the simple working folk I lived among in eastern Oklahoma, or Missouri, or that could be found a dozen other regions. I used to care about America’s historic population that built this country.
But no longer. Like all the carping victims, they have spent decades being an enabler…more than happy to vote for any Democrat or Republican who promised another “free” goodie or new legal regulation or right that would undermine business or wall street.
You can listen to these folks all you like. You can pity them, you can shed tears with them, you can share your anger with them. SO WHAT? The one thing you can’t do is reason with them.
And like raging drunk, they are hell bent on trashing and destroying the house they live in just to spite “GOPe daddy” – even if they wake up shocked that they now don’t have a pot to piss in.
How “smart” is that?
Trump smart.
Well… *l* if that is impossible like you say, and Ted Cruz does nothing then he is going to lose to Trump.
so let me rephrase that
The American Voter is irked at the GOP’s inaction on 0bamacare. …so if you want to blame someone, blame the GOP establishment for Trump’s rise.
it didn’t have to be like this… but the GOP essentially have become enablers of the democrats. …and americans are a lil fed up of the political elite (like Ted Cruz, Rubio, Jeb, Hillary) screwing them over.
….and will screw the politicians over, by putting Trump in office. Who I know for a fact, can’t beholden to any special interest groups/or a Super PAC.
until Ted Cruz proves he is actually a conservative… and not beholden to a special interest group/ most people won’t take him at his word.
and nothing quite proves that than a full repeal of 0bamacare. btw… before you say it’s impossible…
the GOP had the perfect opportunity to do such by attaching a repeal of it to the funding of planned parenthood.
….the dems love planned parenthood… so they’d be forced to either go along with it, or planned parenthood gets it’s funding cut.
had that bill made it through congress, and the senate….
and to 0bama’s desk… he would then be forced to choose between planned parenthood or 0bamacare.
….in either scenario, he loses. and the GOP gains.
had they done that… you likely would see Ted Cruz be A WHOLE LOT more favorable in the voters eyes. Especially if he lead it/and accomplished it.
but it makes sense that Ted wouldn’t because he’s beholden to someone like Goldman Sachs, and Citi. …wanna know something very telling about those two backers?
….they like 0bamacare.
so maybe it’s dawned on some of you Ted Cruz supporters that he isn’t quite as conservative as he pretends to be.
After what he did to Ben Carson in Iowa… saying he was dropping out to gain votes… that doesn’t sound like a moral or ethical conservative to me. …he tried it with Rubio too. with that… he has lost a lot more favor from Americans than you might think and it’s not surprising that ben carson endorsed Trump.
so if Ted Cruz really wants the presidency you better get him to accomplish repealing 0bamacare in the next several weeks (should of done it day one when the GOP won the senate… they have the largest majority in both congress/senate since the civil war… so they only need like 5-6 dems to break 0bama’s veto.)
….but if you ask me… the GOP is the one that squandered their chance to do such with that planned parenthood bill… so I pretty sure Trump will win and he’ll beat hillary easy.