Special Prosecutor Press Conference
Developing Story via Fox News: Zimmerman is in custody and, according to AP sources, will be charged with 2nd-degree murder.
More details and official charges to follow during scheduled 6pm press conference with Special Prosecutor Angela Corey.
Some notable quotes from Special Prosecutor Corey at the press conference:
“We do not prosecute by public pressure or by petition. We prosecute based on the facts of any given case, as well as the laws of the state of Florida.
“We did not come to this decision lightly.”
“When we charge a person with a crime, we are equally comitted to justice on their behalf, as we are on our victims behalf.”
“We will continue to seek the truth… There is a reason cases are tried in the court of law, and not in the court of the public, and not by the media.”
“Today.. [we charged] George Zimmerman with murder in the second degree.”
“George Zimmerman turned himself in.”
UPDATES — WAJ — thanks to Bryan for coverng the press conference for me. I’m in the car (not the one driving!) and the Verizon Wireless connection is good, but not great for live streams while traveling. But, I did get to listen to almost all of the press conference on radio.
We learned nothing new about the facts of the case. What irked me was to hear the prosecutor thank the Martin family attorneys — that seems a little close for my liking in a prosecutor, and in fact the Martin family attorneys have acted irresponsibly in the media as I have addressed before.
I saw on Twitter that the Martin family held a press conference with Al Sharpton by their side, but I didn’t get to see it. Although Zimmerman now is charged, and the case is in the courts, I expect the Martin family attorneys, Sharpton, and others continue to work the case in the media from a racial angle and to inflame passions in the community as a means of tainting the jury pool.
For the prosecutor to embrace the Martin family attorneys with thanks at the press conference, and for AG Eric Holder verbally to praise Sharpton today, tells me that a case which should be about facts of who did what to whom is going to turn into an even bigger racial narrative for a variety of purposes which have nothing to do with the guilt or innocence of the accused.
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I did not know you charge someone in florida with a capital crime without a grand jury …. shocking
He’scharged with second-degree murder, not capital murder, which is a separate offense.
I am not entirely sure what the exact statute says in FL, but 2nd degree? Seems to me there is plenty to create reasonable doubt for that charge…
Could the special prosecutor be trying to throw this but only aiming for the max possible charge, knowing they can’t prove it?
And isn’t that unethical?
CNN reports Zimmerman has a new attorney – Mark O’Meara
Mark M. O’Mara has been practicing Criminal and Family Law in Central Florida for 28 years, and is presently Board Certified as a Criminal Trial Specialist and a Marital and Family Law Specialist. Mark is a former felony prosecutor and Division Chief and has handled all types of criminal cases, including traffic, property crimes, DUI, drug cases and Death Penalty cases. He has extensive trial experience in both state and federal criminal defense.
Sean Hannity said he would probably be called to testify in this case because he has personally talked to Zimmerman.
A 2nd degree murder charge could carry a sentence of life in prison.
Life in prison? What would that be? One day? Three at the most.
Too true, if what I read here is a sign of what’s ahead:
Zimmerman is “dead man walking” on Twitter (via Twitchy).
“Let me tell you, the things that’s about to happen, to these honkeys, these crackers, these pigs, these pink people, these —- people. It has been long overdue. My prize right now this evening … is gonna be the bounty, the arrest, dead or alive, for George Zimmerman. You feel me?” — New Black Panther Party chief of staff Michelle Williams
They told me if I voted for John McCain that there would be violent rhetoric and racial hatred would reach new heights … and they were right
I dunno. The lady had better have damn good evidence, other then, Spike, Al, Jesse, Jeremiah, #44, Eric, NBPP word or words..
Within 3 seconds of Corey opening her mouth, it became evident that her decision is a cave-in to political pressure, not a matter of integrity of office. Almost the first words out of Corey’s mouth was about the “sweet parents of Trayvon” – parents so sweet they took out a trademark on his name and phrases associated with it, so sweet they didn’t even know he was gone that night or dead or alive, so sweet they had to go out partying and dining instead of staying home to supervise this thug who just got booted out of school for the thrid time in the school year – for ten days, which is a pretty hefty suspension.
Corey also confirmed what I said earlier about being in daily contact with the Martins and their attorneys. I think she was pointing this out to prove to the “African-American” community that she had been kissing the Martins’ asses satisfactorily. She praised and gushed over the Martins’ lawyers as well – lawyers with a financial interest in the case. She wanted to make sure that the “African-American community” knew she is on their side. No mention was made about George Zimmerman being attacked and injured. No mention was made about what changed in the evidence to convince her to go forward. She was careful to mention that the former prosecutor had not concluded his investigation, yet she doesn’t explain why she was appointed if he really hadn’t concluded that there was not enough evidence to prosecute. That way she doesn’t have to explain that discrepancy and thus, what changed in the evidence.
Corey made one or two obligatory statements about the rights of defendants, about 7-8 seconds on that. And what the hell prosecutor stands there and SMILES, almost giggling a couple times, when she’s discussing a shooting and a man’s fate? She’s about as swift as Mike Nifong.
I am truly sickened.
spot on. If there is to be any justice delivered regarding any aspect of this case, I can’t see our corrupt judiciary delivering it.
It is either the case that the more thorough investigation uncovered something that directly impugns Zimmerman’s description of the events, impeaching the whole tale.
In which case Corey is simply doing what her office requires.
Or, in the absence of such direct challenge to the facts as understood, it is exactly how you say it is.
In which case Corey should be ashamed, and is not fit for public service.
It would appear that there is more on trial here than George Zimmerman.
If the investigation did uncover such evidence, why didn’t she mention it? And in any event why the praise for the Martin lawyers? To me this goes a long way towards proving that Corey is corrupt.
How about Trayvon’s girlfriend? She claimed to be on the phone with Trayvon when this started to go down. She refused to talk to police at all. Her eventual statement to them was a recorded phone statement with Crumb(the Martin’s lead attorney of 5), who is also her attorney. She of course can say anything she likes or is told to say or is suggested to her. Did she get that statement down pat and finally give it directly to police/special pros which satisfied their need to go forward?
The crime of Second Degree Murder occurs when a person commits either:
Murder with a Depraved Mind or
Accomplice Felony Murder
Murder with a Depraved Mind
Murder with a Depraved Mind occurs when a person is killed, without any premeditated design, by an act imminently dangerous to another and evincing a depraved mind showing no regard for human life.
The primary distinction between Premeditated First Degree Murder and Second Degree Murder with a Depraved Mind is that First Degree Murder requires a specific and premeditated intent to kill.
Defenses to Second Degree Murder
In addition to the pretrial defenses and trial defenses that can be raised in any criminal case, specific defenses to the crime of Second Degree Murder are:
The killing of a human being is excusable, and therefore lawful, under any one of the following three circumstances:
When the killing is committed by accident and misfortune in doing any lawful act by lawful means with usual ordinary caution and without any unlawful intent, or
When the killing occurs by accident and misfortune in the heat of passion, upon any sudden and sufficient provocation, or
When the killing is committed by accident and misfortune resulting from a sudden combat, if a dangerous weapon is not used and the killing is not done in a cruel or unusual manner.
The killing of a human being is justifiable homicide and lawful if done while resisting an attempt by someone to kill you or to commit a felony against you.
Also known as the justified use of deadly force, self defense is a defense to the crime of Second Degree Murder. Please view the Florida Self Defense section for more information.
I don’t know. Is pounding someone’s head into the concrete a felony? I mean, if they’re part white?
Assuming facts not in evidence and all, so just a hypothetical…
If they are white or part-white, it’s just Honkey Konking.
Which in New Black Panther Party Street Law is not a crime.
The NBPP have declared they are not US citizens and therefore they have their own rules/laws, called ‘Black Street Law. I don’t know if this is recognized by the State of FL, but I bet Holder’s DOJ is just itching to implement it along with Sharia… after the election.
So by Rick Santorum’s comments – GZ is guilty because he had a depraved mind. They are almost his exact words.
..else wise, there just may be a new name for the formerly named Florida.
I’m thinkin’ Zimmerland..
Oh no – It will be Trayvonia.
Excellent. I like it, so will
FloTrayvonia, I think, maybe, uhhh.
Corey keeps talking without saying anything.
Well, this is a good way to deflect the hostility away from the Police Department and D.A.’s office squarely onto the jury and Zimmerman. Problem solved.
I must say I’m surprised. I don’t see it, but I haven’t had access to the evidence. In going over all possiblities in my head and talking to mother, a deputy d.a. for most of her career, I was thinking manslaughter at worst. I don’t see how this sticks. But again, I don’t have the special prosecutors vantage.
We do live in interesting times.
I listened to Corey and it seemed like a lot of BS she was spewing. I got the feeling this is a “political” charge. If, as it seems, there is no evidence to support this charge, Corey better be fired and disbarred. It is a lot to put Zimmerman through to placate Sharpton and the New Black Panthers.
If this is based on the GF’s statement and she didn’t vet that statement in the same way Mike Nifong never vetted Crystal Mangum’s statement, Corey could end up in some deep shit.
Like Mike Nifong, Corey is up for re-election. Like Mike Nifong, she needs to shore up her popularity with blacks who have been complaining about her: http://www.change.org/petitions/remove-angela-corey-from-office
Now she’s shining up to the Martins, calling them “sweet” and gushing over their lawyers. The presser was a sickening display of pandering.
Greta just said with this charge there is no minimum sentence. So he could plea for anything down to probation. Of course if he got probation he’d probably need to move to Peru, under a new name.
As curious as I am about all the facts, I hope he pleas to a couple years in country club prison, so as not to fire up Obama’s base with a Casey Anthony style soap opera trial, and to get focus back on the real issues of the election.
I’ll be real curious to see if this goes to trial before the election. Casey Anthony was in jail for over two years before her trial.
Well count me in the group of people who cant wait until we start hearing:
“Zimmerman was only arrested by the racist in the Police Department because he is a Mexican!!!”
Otherwise, its quite likely at least a few people became Republicans today – one of which is probably the guy now in custody for having the nerve to defend himself against attack.
Peruvian, not Mexican.
This prosecutor is a hack, continuing to refer to “justice for trayvon” pre-supposes the guilt of Zimmerman, and Then she talked about the rights of Trayvon’s family but not Zimmerman. This whole prosecution gang need to be jailed. Having let Nifong of “Duke lacrosse team” infamy run free led to shit like this.
Wasn’t she appointed to take over this case by Gov. Rick Scott???
Someone needs to announce a primary challenge now!
She said that “alibi” is an affirmative defense. That is wrong.
Yeah, it is.
Normally, a defendant has NOTHING they have to prove.
If they have an alibi, they must AFFIRMATIVELY prove it.
In an affirmative defense, the defendant affirms that the condition is occurring or has occurred but offers a defense that bars, or prevents, the plaintiff’s claim. An affirmative defense is known, alternatively, as a justification, or an excuse, defense.
Self-defense is an affirmative defense – “Yeah, I shot him, but I was justified in doing so.”
Alibi is a defense but does not affirm the prosecution’s case – “No, I didn’t shoot him, I was somewhere else when it happened.”
Because an affirmative defense requires an assertion of facts beyond those claimed by the plaintiff, generally the party who offers an affirmative defense bears the burden of proof. The standard of proof is typically lower than beyond a reasonable doubt. It can either be proved by clear and convincing evidence or by a preponderance of the evidence. In some cases or jurisdictions, however, the defense must only be asserted, and the prosecution has the burden to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that the defense is not applicable.
You’d have to prove…to somebody…an ALIBI.
I dont know, mixed on it.
I mean really, how do you combat an angry mob yelling that Zimmerman should be killed? In arresting him, at least you are ensuring the facts will be documented (instead of being left in the hands of the so-called “media” to “report”)
And if you arrested him on say manslaughter, with continually presenting “self-defense”, how do you think the “he was out hunting blacks because all whites are raaaacccccciiiiiisssstttssss and should be killed!!!” group is going to be satisfied?
I think this is sadly the only realistic outcome in this specific situation because of the dishonest media and race-baiting left – guilty until proven innocent. And once he goes on trial, the evidence is presented, and the media is proven to be the complete hacks they are; well, they’ll either just drop the story completely and move on or claim the Government is bad and wrong.
That group shouldn’t be satisfied. They should be arrested and prosecuted if they destroy property or injure anyone in their rebellion. Otherwise, they should be ignored, with some prosecuted for possible violations such as obstruction of justice, soliciting a felony, conspiracy to violate the civil rights of George Zimmerman, etc..
I hope to see a new justice department next year. I know that if it’s Mitt Romney’s justice department, there is no hope of seeing this prosecutor put on the ropes for this.
May Lady Justice shed her blindfold and direct her dword to smite this cowardly woman.
“Without a doubt the most rewarding part is helping victims get through the system. I can’t always give each victim what they want — the maximum sentence or full monetary restitution — but I can make sure their constitutional rights are safeguarded.”
From a TEN year old profile. It is what good prosecutors DO.
Is she a good prosecutor? Dunno. Neither do you.
BS. Her skills are not the question. Her judgment and integrity are.
Gawd, you didn’t even read the quote, did you? It was about what motivates her…VICTIMS, you witch!!!
Now, whether that is true or not, you or I CANNOT KNOW. What is interesting is that you have weighed her in your balances, and cursed her to hell.
She has adjudged Martin as the vicitm, you blowhard.
Zimmerman was the victim. The difference here is that this time the victim won and is being punished for it.
Obviously, Corey wouldn’t know a victim if he walked up and wept anymore than a moron like you would.
No, dummy, the LAW assigns Trayvon (the dead guy) “the victim”…’cause he’s DEAD!!!
Not ’cause he’s nice, or even ’cause Zimmerman did anything wrong.
Like being the VICTIM of an accident.
So, a shot and killed bank robber, by dint of being DEAD, is a victim?
Of himself perhaps, but of the person who shot him? I think not.
It sounds like one of those prosecutors who don’t care whether the accused is innocent or guilty, they just want to rack up convictions. The kind who will prosecute someone even if they have doubts about his guilt, and will hide those doubts — and the grounds for them — from the jury if they can get away with it.
while I agree they “shouldn’t” be satisfied – that is also unrealistic at this point.
If she doesnt charge something, there could very well be a race-riot because of all the race-baiting and lying going on. Is that worth it?
Also, if she doesnt charge something, it gives Obama and the Democrats their continual “cause” since the poor black kid didnt get his “justice” in the face of the “raccccissssst mexi… errr, white Democ… errr Killer who hunted him down like a dog!!!”
She charged something she cant possibly convict on. It cools the situation some, and removes most all of the issue. It also places him in police custody in a time he probably needs it desperately.
I hate that it had to be done, but under the circumstances…
That’s like saying obamacare is unconstitutional but it had to be done because 15% of the population don’t have coverage.
I’m sorry, but I dont follow that logic at all. Obamacare was purely manufactured, where Martin was definitely killed by Zimmerman. There were thousands of ways to get more people on Heathcare, but only one to appease the call of the Left here.
And bring a person to trial isnt actually doing anything other then giving “the people” (which included all the race-baiters and Leftists, whether we like it or not) their day in court. It doesnt mean Zimmerman is guilty, it merely means the case will be publicly documented truthfully and judged accordingly in a court of law
Ultimately, this is better for Zimmerman then letting things continue as they are; while possibly stopping a race-riot if the growing issue the media had created was ignored any longer.
Is that worth it?
Yes, it is worth it. Fiat justitia ruat caelum. If a lynch mob demands blood, arrest them all. Shoot them all if necessary. It is worth killing 100 animals to avoid unjustly arresting one person.
And bring a person to trial isnt actually doing anything
Yes, it is. It is depriving him of his liberty, and subjecting him to an ordeal, robbing him of at least a year of his life, and subjecting him and to an enormous expense that will probably bankrupt him even if he is acquitted.
“Yes, it is. It is depriving him of his liberty, and subjecting him to an ordeal, robbing him of at least a year of his life, and subjecting him and to an enormous expense that will probably bankrupt him even if he is acquitted.”
As opposed to the non-“ordeal” he has now, where his “liberty” is allowing him to hide out in secrete praying he isnt killed like a Dog as is being called for everywhere from the Streets to MSNBC?
He will only be “robbed” of his time in an effort to clear his name in a setting where he will be able to actually state his case (as opposed to the lynch mob doing it now on TV)
And as far as money, much of his defense will come from donations or probono work for people looking to advance their names recognition.
So yeah, I’m sorry, but he can either live in a cave somewhere in fear or go through the courts in an effort to clear his name. I choose the second every single day of the week, and twice on the weekend…
That said, yes, the people screaming for violence should be prosecuted – but with Holder in charge, we all know that aint gonna happen so…
He will only be “robbed” of his time in an effort to clear his name in a setting where he will be able to actually state his case…he can either live in a cave somewhere in fear or go through the courts in an effort to clear his name.
Being tried will not change that. Even if he is acquitted he will still have to live in a metaphorical cave until the fuss dies down. Being subjected to a trial cannot save him from that; all it does is make things worse. In addition to living in danger, he now has the expense and ordeal of a trial. Instead of beginning to make a life of some sort for himself in his cave, for a year or more he will be either in actual prison or in effective house arrest since he will be unable to earn a living or do anything for himself. And of course he risks getting a jury who are afraid of sparking a race riot and convict him unjustly, like the second jury in the Rodney King trial.
Any way you look at it, he is definitely harmed by this decision. That’s why in most civilised places Due Process requires that the decision to commit someone to trial be made in a judicial proceeding of some sort, whether it’s a grand jury, a coroner’s inquest, or a hearing before a magistrate. Somewhere where a neutral party determines whether the defendant has a case to answer. I’m shocked that this is not the case in Florida.
Would you be so understanding if it was your life, or your son’s or daughter’s life, placed in such jeopardy?
“When we charge a person with a crime, we are equally comitted to justice on their behalf, as we are on our victims behalf.”
The Prof. quoted that, so I guess you missed it.
Yep. That was pretty much the sum total of any balance she squeezed in between all the gushing and smiling and giggling over the Martins and their cadre of lawyers.
Exactly. She threw a crumb to justice, but then showed where she stands. If there were some piece of evidence that creates probable cause to charge Zimmerman, why didn’t she mention it? Surely she would want to crow about it. And even if it did exist, if she were an honest prosecutor she wouldn’t be so full of praise for the Martins and their unethical lawyers. That she was is strong evidence that she is unethical too.
Definitely strong shades of Mike Nifong afoot. He tried to keep up the charade of there being real evidence against those boys and that he was the guardian of blacks and their (self-separated) interests in order to get their vote. He talked about the value of all the positive free press he was getting. He never even met with the alleged “victim”, a drunken, drug-addled whore now on trial for murder, her second serious offense since the Duke lacrosse debacle that she was allowed to walk away scott-free from.
Angela Corey is up for re-election in November and she does not have good standing in the “African-American community.”
This. This is going to be nothing but a show trial. It was obvious from the start, to those actually involved in this, that the little piece of shit Trayvon, of whom the world is well rid, brought this on himself. This is cowardice, a decision to take the easy path and screw over a guy who is guilty of nothing worse than bad judgment.
I sure had her pegged wrong.
I find this woman utterly contemptable.
Yeah, another Charlie Brown moment for conservatives. We continue to hope and keep faith in the rule of law, and it keeps being yanked from us more each passing day.
Corey – channeling Mike Nifong forevermore.
Actually, looking at the catalog of Florida homicide statutes, this on seems to fit best.
Manslaugher would be a lesser-included charge.
That’ll give you the quick-n-dirty.
Had some fun with you on the other thread, rags, but I have to admit your comments here are helpful and thoughful.
Here are the Florida Statutes on homicide:
Hey Prof, did they also charge the lesser offense of manslaughter?
I heard nothing from this prosecutor about Why Murder 2 v Manslaughter
I am hearing no lessers, but I have not seen that confirmed anywhere. That is obviously a big deal.
In Texas, a jury is free to find lesser-included offenses if the big charge is not supported.
This took place in Sanford, Florida.
Really…??? Not Sanford, Texas…???
That is a bit old, and I haven’t gone (and won’t) though it, but it DOES seem to support “lesser includes”
Looks like you’re wrong A G A I N.
One charge. No lessers. Link below, go to the right hand side and click “view pdf”
(h/t justoneminute blog)
Maybe that would help explain the Casey verdict.
I wonder if the bizarre news conference yesterday by Zimmerman’s (former?) attorneys caused FL law enforcement to take him into custody, and whether the lawyers’ astonishing statements that GZ was out of FL can somehow be used against him as showing guilty knowledge?
GZ needs some different, and better attorneys, pronto.
How could being out of Florida show guilty knowledge? He had not been charged with anything, and had the constitutional right to travel anywhere he liked. Getting out of Florida would only make sense.
seems the stand ground law will be attacked per how bloomberg has been acting, can’t help but suspect brady bunch involved.
It won’t stop them from trying, but Stand Your Ground wasn’t a factor here. Either Zimmerman initiated a physical altercation and shot his opponent because he was losing (thereby being explicitly exempt from Stand Your Ground protections), or he was the victim of an attack who shot his attacker from the ground (hence no possibility, nor duty, for retreat- you can’t stand your ground when you’re lying on it).
Florida has got plenty of law on the books about self-defense. Oddly enough, the one everyone is talking about is the one that most certainly isn’t applicable.
Yes. I’ve never been able to see the connection to SYG in this case. But abolishing SYG is an agenda item for the left because it’s a solid precursor to self-defense which is a precursor to second amendment rights, so they try to make it about SYG anyway. It matters not to the “up is down, 1+1=3” crowd. They never let logic cramp their style.
Yes, you called it about the GJ thingy. Good on you. 🙂
Either Zimmerman initiated a physical altercation and shot his opponent because he was losing (thereby being explicitly exempt from Stand Your Ground protections)….
While you’re right about Stand Your Ground, there’s an exception to the above if Martin first elevated the combat to deadly force.
I know it wasn’t, technically, an issue but others are going to TRY to make it an issue.
I think, no proof just a feeling, others want to try to turn this into a litmus test.
bloomberg is salivating over this case.
Hey, didn’t some really awesome (and handsome) cowboy say yesterday that when she announced there would be no grand jury that she was going to charge him?
Human nature is pretty ugly, and if she has future political or judicial plans, well….
I am shocked he is charged with 2nd Degree murder. I thought for sure they would go with a manslaughter type charge. Is it just 2nd degree? If so, this is all or nothing (of course, if found not guilty Holder might be nuts enough to try to go after him again on some federal charge that is not barred under double jeopardy).
I am glad Zimmerman has a good attorney, because he will definitely need him.
I’m shocked she gave a political speech instead of a press conference.
She sure seemed pretty pleased with herself for having one man lose his life, and another his freedom.
The smiling and near-giggling was disgusting. The chumminess with the Martins and their attorneys made me want to heave.
I was appalled. Not since Mike Nifong have we seen a such a display of political pandering in a criminal case.
Assuming there is no bombshell evidence we don’t know about, its overcharging. I guess the idea is to have your show trial of a man you don’t want to actually convict, and so overcharge him as to all but guarantee acquittal. She gets the credit for prosecuting him, the jury gets the blame for letting him off, and nobody gets hurt. Well, except for the defendant who will be bankrupted and spend the rest of his life as a marked man.
Eh, you wanna make an omelet…
“Well, except for the defendant who will be bankrupted and spend the rest of his life as a marked man.”
She can hardly be blamed for that either though – the Media and Race-baiters have already ensured that outcome (or one even worse) no matter what she actually does.
I really do feel this is the only action she had under the circumstances – and it is one which benefits him greatly as proving Malice will be near impossible given the facts we know, where manslaughter would certainly be easier to try and possibly squeak by with
Yes, she can be blamed for that. Not for the marked man thing, but certainly for the enormous financial expense to which Zimmerman will now be subjected, as well as the year or more of his life that he will now have to devote to his trial, and the emotional and physical ordeal of a trial. She had the choice of standing up for justice, and she turned away from it. If she has some amazing piece of new evidence, I don’t see why she would sit on it.
George Zimmerman is facing a potential sentence of 25 years in prison. To roll the dice with a man’s life in order to appease one ethnic minority is evil.
Let them riot. It’s better than usurping justice.
I think she wants the conviction and wants it quickly. I don’t think she gives a damn about George Zimmerman or justice. Her undignified, ass-kissing, smarmy presentation showed me that. She has completely undermined any benefit of the doubt and respect for her office and duties that all fair-minded people gave her while awaiting the completion of her investigation by her words and demeanor at the press conference. She’s acting in her own interests – her power, her re-election, and her ambitions.
So why did she cancel the Grand Jury? Hack-tastic.
simple – she isnt charging him with Murder 1
That would be the only real reason to use the grand jury.
Do you know why grand juries were created in the first place?
I found her demeanor during the entire event – especially at the beginning – to be highly inappropriate.
Zimmerman turned himself in. This means he can collect the NBPP bounty, amiright?
Yikes; had the same thought — about six minutes later and missed your comment; my bad. 🙂
Great minds imitate the highest form of flattery… i think. 😉
The Martin “family” sure seems sweet. I mean, If my son was missing for three days I am sure that I would eventually call the police or the morgue or someone to figure out where he was. Good thing they got Trayvon’s name trademarked too.
Mr. Martin was told by police the morning following his son’s death.
Zimmerman has a $10,000 bounty on his head. Will he survive jail? Why not a charge of manslaughter?
See my comment above. If I had to take a guess, its that given the politics of the situation, she felt she had to charge him with something, even though she doesn’t think he’s guilty. So she so overcharges him that it almost forces the jury to acquit. Its been a while since I was a 1L, but I seem to recall mutual combat resulting in death is almost always treated as manslaughter.
Makes my stomach turn.
She is an incumbent and Republican up for re-election this year and allegedly has no chance to be re-elected right now…so that makes this more about politics and facetime. Dunno her district but Jax (home to oxygen thief Corrine Brown) has a large black population. This is looking more and more Nifongish all the time. And we know how that turned out for him….
Please give a link about her political prospects.
My reading indicates that Ms. Corey has no GOP opposition.
So, WTF are you talking about…???
How about Democrat opposition?
Sounds to me like this case should be done around election time. Ripe for Obama to turn out the vote.
“George Zimmerman turned himself in.”
So, if Mr. Zimmerman turned himself in, can he now collect that $10,000 reward offered by the NBPP for his apprehension … and if they refuse to pay up, can he sue them in civil court?
Corey pointed out that Martin was the constitutional victim, but the cheery start to the press conference, the lovey dovey approach to the parents, and request for prayers for the Martins and the prosecution team, seemed odd to me.
She also stated Zimmerman was “the man responsible for his death”. It seems that is yet to be determined. If Zimmerman proves self defense, it seems Martin is responsible.
The law is composed of elements. That forces you to think in terms of cubby-holes.
The State must prove that Zimmerman was there; that he introduced some instrument that is defined as a deadly weapon; that the weapon was in his control at some point in time, etc…
That makes him “responsible” in the legal context.
Poor Trayvon(tm)’s actions may EXCUSE him from criminal liability.
OK thx .. that makes sense.
I looked up “responsible” … it assigns fault or credit. Given the situation as I see it, I would give GZ “credit” for defending himself. But I don’t know what he confessed to. Unless Martin somehow squeezed the trigger in a struggle for the gun, it does seem GZ INTENDED to kill, or at least wound.
A trial AFTER the election would get this out of the way as a motivational factor for Obama’s base. After the election it would be interesting to see the darker side of Martin/Sharpton exposed, GZ exonerated, and more facts come to light. Till then, this might hurt Obama’s race card campaign, as Sharpton makes news crowing.
This is a time delay option . In the case of the horrific Newsome /Christian Tennesee torture murders (Feb 07 ) they are still being tried.
Should I pencil in 2017?
It’s telling to observe what deserves national attention. What they believe to possess sufficient merit to entangle a nation. They are playing a dangerous game.
Re-trial(s). The original trials were completed quite some time ago.
That is true . Ranging from August 09 to May 2010.-the latter after having to retrieve the charge from the Feds.
Current status – pressure for retrial.
So – mid 2014.
My bet is well after the election.
Slightly OT, BUT not by a helluva lot..
BALTIMORE POLICE CHIEF: Black Crowd’s Assault on White Tourist Not Hate Crime. Just “drunken opportunistic criminality.” Well, that’s a relief.
Via The Instaman. http://pjmedia.com/instapundit/
Something you guys take for granted -the election of Law officials is not very common around the globe.
It makes for a completely different justice system.
I am certain it has /had it’s merits but has it jumped the shark ?
Are there states with career prosecutors answerable to no one but the law?
Rogue prosecutors unaccountable to no one with lifetime appointments? I’ll pass.
“Answerable to no one but the law” means answerable to no one at all. Federal prosecutors (US Attorneys) are answerable to the President. And federal judges have lifetime appointments, and are thus answerable to nobody, except that Congress can remove them for misconduct. On the state and local level, it varies. Mostly District Attorneys (state prosecutors) are elected, but I’m sure there are states where they’re appointed by and answerable to the Governor. But of course on every level most prosecutors are not US Attorneys or District Attorneys but rather Assistant USAs or DAs, and they are employees who are hired by and answerable to their USA or DA. Patterico, for instance, is an Assistant DA for Los Angeles County, so he is not elected but his boss is.
Probably some interesting Twitter feeds out there in response to the presser..
Not being a tweeter, I wouldn’t know–
But, seems like there would be..
Have to say, the state of Florida AG’s office is just looking horrible right now. They appear to have caved to a lynch mob, both in their decision to charge murder and in their decision to officially ignore the “bounty” placed on one of their citizens.
It’s disgusting. Pam Bondi is looking like a moron. I used to like her. No more. She should have the NBPP in custody by now. Of course, now that Zimmerman has been arrested, the NBPP “Wanted” thuggery may be deemed moot and not have to be addressed – just sweep it under the carpet.
Bondi can’t make a move because she’s tied to Mitt…anything she says or does will affect his election.
A BIG MESS – she can’t go whole hog to defend FL against Obamacare, because of her commitment to Romney. She sold FL down the river for her own political gain.
Yep, Bondi put herself completely behind the 8-ball when she hopped on the Romney bandwagon. Her ambition has rendered her impotent. She still could just step up and do her job, but that would be politically difficult now. How stupid it was for her to handcuff herself this way. She will soon fade into an oblivion of her own making, and I will be glad to see her go.
A little mentioned fact is that before “stepping aside”, the Sanford PD Chief bowed to public pressure and re-opened the case and sent it back to the Seminole County Prosecuter who originally declined to prosecute it without probable cause.
The Governor stepped in and took the case away from that State attorney’s office and gave it to the Duval/Clay county office where Corey took over as “special” prosecutor.
Stinks all around.
Yeah, way to go, Rick Scott, Tea party candidate. Love that spine, that integrity. He really shines.
What is the chance that the trial will be moved to another jurisdiction?
There was an accidental transit police shooting in Oakland a few years ago. The cop was tried in LA because of the local political climate.
[…] Professor Jacobsen at Legal Insurrection disagrees with me regarding calming things down: Although Zimmerman now is charged, and the case is […]
I’ve been trying to get a bet down that Mr. Zimmerman will stand at trial before Nidal Hisan; no takers so far.
Yes – that is a complete unfathomable. Where was /is the outrage ?
I know a young person who is sometimes in charge of a whole military base that actually had a planned Muslim Terrorist attack on it. (By somali refugees no less ). THey got caught & tried & found guilty of terrorism.
The nation would be in uproar if a Muslim attacked from within & it was just a ‘workplace incident’.
Something is very wrong in the Kingdom.
“…and for AG Eric Holder verbally to praise Sharpton today”
He didn’t just praise Sharpton he quoted MLK’s I’ve Been To the Mountaintop speech:
“The nation is sick. Trouble is in the land. Confusion all around. That’s a strange statement. But I know, somehow, that only when it is dark enough, can you see the stars. And I see God working in this period of the twentieth century in a way that men, in some strange way, are responding — something is happening in our world. The masses of people are rising up.”
“Let me tell you something, the things that is about to happen to these honkeys, these crackers, these pigs, these pink people, these (beep) people, it has been long over due.” ~ Michelle Williams Chief of Staff local chapter of the New Black Panther Party.
[…] (but didn’t cover) the original story: The Trayvon Martin Shooting.William A. Jacobson of Legal Insurrection said:What irked me was to hear the prosecutor thank the Martin family attorneys — that seems a […]
She chose the easy way out. If a grand jury heard the case, there would be a record of the proceedings, meaning if she didn’t indict the “ham sandwich” she’d be subject to crucification in the media. Yes, grand jury proceedings are “secret”, but a court could order the minutes be released.
If there was no evidence and she let him go, she’d also be crucified, so the obvious thing to do- charge him and let a petit jury decide his guilt or innocence- or if they’re a hung jury, then decide to either re-try or dismiss.
Now, her hands are clean.
Put another way, she caved.
Umm, Michelle sweety, honey, babycakes..I really do wish you and your ilk would come get usins.
I can’t understand why this type person, a black racist, never did learn arithmetic in the proper fashion.
Itsa’ guzinta thingy..85% guzinta 15% ONE TIME, Michelle..
My $.02 on all this:
Mark Levin had a great discussion on this his first hour on radio tonight; Professor, if you are able, can you link to that at some point? When you’re done “riding”….. 😉
I have a feeling that the Martin family has NO IDEA what they have just entered into here. Their lives will now become public knowledge – every MINUTE detail. The defense will need to use everything he/they can to ensure that Trayvon is the REAL Travon, not the saintly media myth ginned up over the last two weeks. That alone gives me chills for this family.
The Zimmermans, once this trial starts, will need 24/7 security – that is going to be a HUGE expense, not to mention mental strain and stress over these constant death threats. If they don’t sue NBC/ABC/CNN/NYT/Sharpton & Jackson/NBPP, etc. etc. to recoup their costs and damages (their lives are ruined now), then I will be VERY surprised – whether George is found guilty or not.
And finally, if George Zimmerman is found NOT guilty, there will be blood. Someone’s, anyone’s: his, his families’, or “just” a riot that will result in death. Even if this takes two years to go to trial (which I doubt), the stoked anger and divisiveness will not be allowed to die down completely.
As Mark Levin said tonight, roughly mirroring the Professor’s last paragraph, Holder and his DoJ are a travesty, a perversion of the word “justice.” It is IMPERATIVE we get this regime VOTED OUT in November. Our nation is not going to be able to heal unless we do. No matter who the nominee is, we MUST elect Anybody But Obama for president.
Holder and his DoJ are a travesty, a perversion of the word “justice.” It is IMPERATIVE we get this regime VOTED OUT in November.——————————————
That is a true fact…
In the Westminster system an Attorney General IS a member of Parliament & can therefore be demoted by the House or voted out by the people. They are generally safe Senate seats but it is at least possible.
As an executive they serve at the President’s wishes only.
This is simply FYI. It is handy to know how others do things.
Holder can be impeached by the House and removed by the Senate. And he has given more than sufficient grounds for doing so. But of course the D-controlled Senate will never vote to remove him. I still think the House has a duty to impeach him, but they want to avoid the I word for fear of what it did to the Republicans last time around.
So that’s the equivalent of the House voting no confidence in an AG in a Westminster-style government.
As for an AG losing his seat, first of all that can’t happen until the election, so what difference does it make whether he stands for election himself or the president who appointed him stands? The effect is the same. And of course an AG in a Westminster-style government stands for election only in one small electorate, which is often safe for his party, so his chance of being booted out is small, and most of the nation doesn’t get any chance at all to vote against him. Whereas in the USA the president who appoints him stands for reelection before the whole nation.
I should also point out that not in every Westminster-style government do ministers have to be members of Parliament. It’s a common feature of the Westminster system, but not a necessary one. In Israel, for instance, ministers are occasionally appointed from outside Parliament; indeed, the current Israeli AG, Yaacov Neeman, is not an MK.
Levin also called Corey’s presser a “political statement”.
I’m worried about Zimmerman mustering the resources to mount the kind of defense that will be needed, along with all the security costs and associated expenses.
So he passed a lie detector test? If the police administered this is it now admissible? (probably not but it arguably should be).
A voice stress test.
Not admissible, but a useful investigative tool.
I wonder whose idea the voice stress test was and who administered the test. If the police asked to administer it and had one of their people administer the test, would the defense be able to get the results admitted (assuming the results were exculpatory)? Just curious.
The same rules of evidence apply to everybody.
Justice? I can understand the high emotions, but this is not helpful…
Michelle said during that interview, “Let me tell you, the things that’s about to happen, to these honkeys, these crackers, these pigs, these pink people, these —- people. It has been long overdue. My prize right now this evening … is gonna be the bounty, the arrest, dead or alive, for George Zimmerman. You feel me?”
Bubba addressed her saying, “Michelle, really? You are so much better than that, honey.”
When you combine these things with the Prosecutor thanking the Martin family, it is not looking too fair to George Zimmerman.
It isn’t looking too good for anybody. Having law enforcement on the side of such thuggery as we’ve seen from the Martins, their attorneys, Sharpton, Jackson, the “African-American community” and the NBPP is frightening.
What irked me was to hear the prosecutor thank the Martin family attorneys — that seems a little close for my liking in a prosecutor …
OK, this is my last comment on this thread (and I’m already two over my quota):
I’m guessing that somehow Trayvon’s girlfriend, who it’s said he was talking to on his phone for a good period of time as he walked along on the night in question, will possibly play a major role in the prosecution’s case, although her testimony may be at direct odds with other persons who were actually at the scene when the incident occurred.
yea, but what she said Trayvon said is hearsay-
No, what will play a major role is what Z said to the (recorded) police, and how that matches up with the physical evidence and witness testimony-
She can state what SHE claims to have heard just as other witnesses can testify that they heard cries for help, etc..
That’s what I’ve been saying. That is my suspicion. The GF did not give a statement to the police. She refused. She gave a telephone statement to Crumb a couple weeks ago, who is also her attorney. He supposedly offered to share it with the prosecution, who admits to being in daily contact with the Martin attorneys. This was as of last week or so. Crumb has had control of her this entire time. She is free to say anything she wants or is suggested to her or rehearsed with her. It’s still unknown if she’s ever actually talked to police or the prosecution. It’s unknown to what extent her statement has been vetted. If this is Duke lacrosse redux, which is what it appears to be especially after that smarmy, fawning presser today, then there’s been no vetting of the GF’s statement.
Corey is up for re-election in November and she is not – at least until now – liked by the black population.
What’s the line on whether Zimmerman will survive to stand trial? He’s been hiding out to avoid being killed until now and now he’s in a county jail somewhere in Florida which has only ‘White Hispanic’ jail guards? Doubtful. Next headline will be that he was killed in jail by persons unknown.
Irrational fears aside, I wonder what evidence the special prosecutor found that overcomes the physical evidence of an assault by Martin on Zimmerman and that Zimmerman was crying out for help? That makes out the affirmative defense of self-defense (the nonsense about Florida’s SYG law is nonsense, because it doesn’t apply) which should have prevented his being charged. Maybe his new lawyer will handle the wrongful arrest and prosecution suit against the county and the state.
The “evidence” is the mob, incited by Obama and the rest of the race industry.
This is really a setup (that isn’t a slam dunk but pretty close).
This is merely a repeat of the process that the police went through and then released him, but this time with a jury. From all the evidence available to the first prosecutor, Zimmerman can beat a 2nd degree murder charge (but possibly not a lesser charge). I fully expect at the end of the process that Zimmerman will walk.
The fact that Zimmerman was in custody immediately tells me that he may have suggested this course of action. It serves him in that it calms things down, makes the evidence do to the talking (not the press or Rev. Al), and leaves him a course to where he can be seen in public again with a more remote likelihood that he will be gunned down. I say more likely because some will not be satisfied if (and probably when) he is acquitted.
I thought about that, too, but it’s a very risky prospect. The jury may be afraid to turn in a not-guilty verdict or, if they are brave enough to do so, we know how the militant/crazy segments of the race-baiters club reacts when a verdict doesn’t go their way. He would be free but his life would still be in danger, IMO.
don’t forget there is a separate DISTINCT DOJ investigation going on too.
good old holder needs his pound of non-colored flesh to satisfy his people.
In a press conference yesterday, G.Z.’s ex-lawyer said that there were multiple pieces of forensic evidence that have not been revealed publicly and that ALL OF THEM supported G.Z.’s version of events.
Add this to the voice stress test, a solid eye witness who saw G.Z. on the ground under T.M., no eyewitnesses to the moment when the combatants met.
Add that to the initial decision of the Seminole county Prosecutor’s office to decline to press charges based on lack of evidence.
It seems justice was done, but rejected by Tracy Martin, who then contacted fellow Shriner Ben Crump.
Crump contacted former associate and demagogue Al Sharpton and the media to effectively whip up mob sentiment in order to terrorize the higher authorities in the justice system into dragging G.Z., and the nation, through hell.
All to perpetuate Tracy Martin’s denial and hope a different version of justice be declared for his son.
And because they can.
Ben Crump didn’t get into this to help an old friend in denial. He’s in it because he smells a buck.
I didn’t say they were old friends. Tracy Martin is the Grand Master of his local Eastern Orient Mason lodge. I opine that when he ran his concerns about injustice up the food chain to the regional Grand Poobah, he was referred to fellow Shriner Ben Crump from the Tallahassee lodge.
Ben Crump shows clear signs of racial bigotry, but I surmise he enjoys a big payday just like any hustler.
Yep. One doesn’t take the steps the Martins have unless it’s for blood money.
I think it’s the GF’s statement, which has been controlled solely by Crumb, the Martins’ attorney and who is also the GF’s attorney.
I think she has made a statment which puts incriminating words in Zimmerman’s mouth when the fight started and possibly claims that Zimmerman drew first blood, according to what she might claim she overheard with Trayvon with whom she was supposedly speaking. She can say pretty much anything she likes or is coached to say. She has refused to talk to the police all along, at least as of last week. The only statement she gave was through the Martin’s attorney, at least as of last week or so.
I continue to wonder why she didn’t call the police if she thought Trayvon was in danger.
I’ve been wondering if defense is possibly thinking waiving extended discovery (I can’t remember the actual terms) and pushing for a trial date asap has something to do with the oddities of last 2 days.
can’t put my finger on why but the atty’s and action sof last few hours seem odd.
I dunno, just thinking out loud with no proof or knowledge of specifics.
pontificating..pondering…will be interesting.
wonder if they will file for exemption to FL sunshine law and prevent cameras, etc.
I think Breitbart described the prosecutor as “gleeful.” This is not about justice, in the same way the Duke prosecution was not about it. It’s about feeding the beast. This can’t have a good ending.
Nope. It will not have a good ending for one undeniable reason: the “jury pool” is tainted. It needs chlorine now, but no clean-up will ever happen.
And then, if the jury rules in his favor, what do you think this POS U.S. Atty General will do? He will press Federal charges of “violating civil rights” or some b.s. of that kind.
Zimmerman was an idiot to give himself in. He should have left the country -with his family – while he still had time. He knows that in here, no matter what the verdict or the charges, he’s a dead man walking. His enemies will make sure of that.
Besides Corey’s gushing over the Martins and their attorneys, there was a strange passage in her dissertation about not having the power to compensate the Martins, her “constitutional victims”, financially for their loss but she can bring them justice…blah….blah. That struck me as a very strange thing for a criminal prosecutor to even mention…..except that she knows the “African-American community” is out for blood and want to see the Martins hit a payday. It was just totally inappropriate and off the wall. It seemed as though she wanted to seem God-like and emphasize herself as the power-center in all this.
Zimmerman’s attorney termed her “professional”.
Which seems to be the preponderant opinion of the lady.
She enjoys what she does. ZOMG…!!!
All we have to go on is her performance to date, which has been anything but professional.
You listen to that carefully, and with an open mind (impossible for some of you), and see if you hear anything that RATIONALLY you have a problem with.
Corey made statements the other day revealing bias toward the Martin’s side of the coin, with no counterbalanced mention of the Zimmerman’s plight.
Paraphrasing, she indicated the most important thing for her was to help bring justice for Trayvon and his family.
She also lamented the public scrutiny and exposure claiming that this made her job more difficult.
Considering that justice was already done, and ignored by the Martin family, and Mr Martin appealed to Crump and his demagogue associate Sharpton who enlisted the biased media and even more biased Federal executives to invoke a mob mentality in the populace that would surely pressure the Governor to let pandora fully out of the box by ignoring the initial findings and sending in a bulldog prosecutor….
How dare she complain. She seemed to revel in the spotlight well enough.
Well said. I would add that Corey seemed to also revel in her bias at today’s presser. She seemed to flaunt it, making wholly unnecessary and inappropriate statements about the “sweet” Martin parents and their wonderful, helpful attorneys that she has maintained daily contact with.
The “sweet” Martins would still have their son if they’d stayed home to discipline him over his school troubles instead of leaving him unsupervised while they went out on the town until the wee hours.
RATIONALLY this sent chills up my spine:
(at about the 2.30 mark)
“We will lead this effort to seek justice for Trayvon”
Joy, what do you think prosecutors DO…????
The comment about seeking “justice for Trayvon” did not sit well with many attorneys that I know who heard the comments. It was unprofessional at best on the part of a prosecutor who should KNOW better with a case this potentially charged. The prosecutor attempted to mitigate through her later comments, but the damage was done.
It is not to seek justice for an individual, but simply to do justice (whatever that happens to be).
It wasn’t her only Nifong moment, either.
Side note: You forgot the “TM” after using “Justice for Trayvon”, noting that the phrase has been trademarked by the “sweet” parents.
Don’t be surprised if a process server turns up at your door with a $uit for compensation filed by the Martins for having used one of their trademarked phrases. 😉
I wish that they would. I’d slap them with a Rule 11(b)(2) sanction for filing a motion wholly without merit (aka frivolous) because the legal contention would be unwarranted under existing law. This blog obviously qualifies as discussion of news and current events.
I’d get to make a lot of money off the sanction, and very quickly make a name for myself by publically embarrassing a much higher profile attorney.
They don’t hold press conferences with a feces-eating grin on their faces unless they just captured Jack the Ripper.
I spoke too soon – I should have known it wouldn’t take you long to start labelling anyone who disagrees with you as incapable of rational thought.
Wow…!!! Read what I said again.
If you RATIONALLY find stuff you disagree with, state it.
But listen to BOTH statements from BOTH attorneys. I think you’ll find that you have two professionals doing their jobs in a system that works.
That depends upon what Rag’s definition of “works” is.
Did the system work when the State atty from the Seminole county prosecutor’s office declined to charge G.Z. for lack of probable cause after their investigation with the Sanford PD found none?
Justice was done. The system worked. So why second guess the system?
This isn’t an event, but a process.
There are SEVERAL points in MOST investigations when charging is decided.
The process was over. The “appeal” circumvented the system, and propriety, by using an incited mob and a biased, powerful, agenda driven federal administration in order to blackmail the Governor to take action.
The governor then spurned his state attorney in Seminole county, cast doubt on the professionalism of the Sanford PD (without cause), and sent George Zimmerman to the wolves.
An event indeed. It is now a circus.
“So why second guess the system?”
Lemme guess. Because the “African-American community” wants yet another pund of “white” flesh and wasn’t getting it?
Nobody wants to read your crap a second time. You really are dumber than a bag of hammers if you believe what you’re saying.
I watched the whole video of the prosecutor’s statement linked above. I’m mostly in agreement with you (Ragspierre) on this one. It’s clear that Corey loves the limelight, but I’ll go out on a limb and say that’s probably not unusual in prosecutors (or defense attorneys) at her level of the profession. Most of the time, though, I’ll agree that she was very professional and doing her part of the job in our legal system, which is adversarial by design. The prosecutor is supposed to take the side of the victim, what she referred to as “the Constitutional victim”, in this case which is undoubtedly Trayvon Martin. Beyond her smiling for the camera at the beginning and every once in a while thereafter, she just seemed to be doing her job.
It’s not realistic to expect a prosecutor to get up and focus on how horrible things have been for the accused, George Zimmerman, even if she believes that to be true.
Now, it’s up to George Zimmerman’s attorney to do his job. Based on the brief bio provided earlier, it seems like he should be able to hold up his end at least as far as the legalities go. As to the circus being organized by Sharpton, Holder, and the rest, who knows?
You may not have been privy to recent statements Corey made which add context and cast further doubt on the genuineness of her performance today.
She was much less measured in her one-sided advocacy for the plaintiff. Pandering and prejudiced come to mind.
I only saw what was in the linked video for the prosecutor’s original press conference. Nothing surprising, except maybe a little excessive with the mugging for the camera. She’s supposed to be an advocate for the one who is officially the victim so advocacy is not a surprise to me. Imagine a different case, say David Westerfield who was charged and convicted of kidnapping and murdering a little girl. I imagine the prosecutors were strong advocates for the victim in that case. Ditto for the O.J. prosecutors. It’s their job.
For the defense, I really liked what I saw from Zimmerman’s new defense attorney. I thought he handled his press conference extremely well, especially considering he doesn’t have much information yet. The guy seemed very calm, very measured, and very confident without being obviously full of himself. Does that mean he’s a good lawyer? Not in and of itself, but it seems like a promising start.
I know Ragspierre can tick people off some time, including me, but I think he’s being pretty reasonable on this thread. I think he’s right that the attorneys are just doing their jobs which is all we can hope for at this point.
The prosecutor is supposed to take the side of the victim,
Yes, but only after making up her mind that the defendant is guilty. If she’s charging him then she must have made up her mind; and the question in all our minds is what basis she could possibly have had for doing so. If she has some smoking piece of evidence that made her conclude that he’s guilty, then why didn’t she produce it? I can’t think of a good reason to sit on it. It’s not as if she can keep it secret and surprise the defense with it. So why not make it public at the press conference? That would have been a worthwhile exercise. But she didn’t, so I can only conclude that no such evidence exists. In which case how did she conclude that he is guilty?
She doesn’t want that evidence scrutinized any sooner than it has to be. If she’d let the GJ have the case, she would have had to reveal it if she wanted to get the indictment. It would have been scrutinized at that point. This way, she can keep it in her vest pocket until she’s forced to give it up. I don’t think this is a new trick for prosecutors.
The only missing voice in all this is the GF. All we know is that she claims to have been speaking to Trayvon just before the incident went down. Weeks ago, she was supposedly saying that she told Trayvon to run and he said no, he wouldn’t run. Then she went silent – totally disappeared from the radar. Then Crump says he has her recorded statement by telephone and will give it to the SP and nobody else, that she “connected the dots” and concluded that Zimmerman shoved Trayvon. Then, with no other incriminating evidence extant, we get the case pulled from the GJ, charges filed, and a statement from the prosecutor that, among her activities in the investigation, was daily communication with the Martins’ attorneys. The Martins’ attorneys have a financial interest in the case on their behalf and for the Martins. The SP also remarks at her very off presser that she is doing all she can to bring justice for Trayvon, blah blah but she can’t bring the Martins the financial compensation they desrve or something to that effect.
Interestingly, Zimmerman said that just before Trayvon approached him, he reached into his pants front and appeared to be pulling out a cell phone. Also interestingly, this girl who claims she was on the phone when the altercation started, didn’t call the police even though she concluded that Trayvon was being shoved.
Adding it all up, what I tentatively take away is that this protected “witness” “connected the dots” with some help from Mr. Crump, a recording setting forth the events as she “eventually” recalled them was made by an attorney with a financial interest in the case, the witness then goes off the radar, the attorney is very chummy with the prosecutor who then cancels the GJ and issues charges without revealing what the incriminating evidence is even though much of the other evidence, or lack thereof, is known, thereby giving grounds for civil suits. As a side issue, will the recording be released just a couple days before the election, with too little time left for scrutiny by the defense before the election?
Corey pecifically identified the Martin parents as the “constitutional victims.”
If you thought her calling the Martins “sweet parents” and smiling and gushing over them and praising their attorneys who started this media lust for blood and got all the race hustlers involved, is all okay and totally appropriate and professional, I’m sure both she and Mike Nifong would agree with you.
I’ll admit publicly that the praying with martin family statement she made struck me as very odd. It seemed out of place and seemed to imply a bias.
[…] II: From Professor Jacobson: I saw on Twitter that the Martin family held a press conference with Al Sharpton by their side, […]
This case is the end of our nation as we know it. Mob rule is being pushed and egged on by the highest levels of government.
You didn’t listen to the full presser of the prosecutor and the defense lawyer I posted immediately above, did you?
I spent a career in police work in Florida. Trust me, I saw this coming but hoped some courage would prevail. I was wrong. She didn’t want a grand jury because she couldn’t control it with certainty. Zimmerman was just thrown under the bus for the “greater good” which means everybody was CYA. Here is my post on the issue.
A piece from it.
…This is as good as a time as any to remind you what my partner told me about lawyers. “They spend a hundred thousand dollars to go to law school in order to unlearn any common sense, ethics and morality they had before.”
And you see that now, in spades. Believe me, if Zimmerman gets convicted and everybody knows he was railroaded, the lawyers will sleep just as comfortably. They just don’t care.
They’ll beat Zimmerman up in the media again, convict him before the trial, intimidate the witnesses on his side, and then go to court to prove Zimmerman killed Martin intentionally, which is not what happened. (I feel sorry for the thirteen year old kid who saw Martin beating Zimmerman’s head into the ground. By the time the SAO gets done with him he’ll have a foggier memory.)
Assuming that what Zimmerman’s family is saying is correct, and the facts and witnesses support it, Zimmerman is the second victim in this situation. The first was not Martin, because he chose to act out, it is Justice.
I was told by a senior State Attorney in charge of the Felony Division once after I complained about the unfairness of their process that I didn’t understand the situation. She said, “Justice, injustice, right and wrong, good or bad, innocent or guilty have nothing to do with the law.” I remembered the statement for the rest of my career. The law exists for itself and is often used to protect those who hold power over it. …
Perhaps Shakespeare’s “Dick the Butcher” was right about what to do about lawyers.
As Milton Friedman taught me, “You have to compare something with something”.
If you hate your legal system, what would you replace it with?
Ditch the admiralty and commercial courts. Ditch the bar.
Reinstate Common Law Magistrates and Justices of the Peace, with classical attorney advocates.
For sure. Nothing is forever -& if there is a problem start looking around for alternatives. If you can’t find any think some up.
It is not as if William The Conquerer thought his orders would be fully intact 1000 years on.
Not like the famous South El Paso School of Law & Line Dancin. That is immortal.
Curious as to just what kind of crank you are.
Admiralty law is authorized in the Constitution.
Do they have groups of archaic legal re-enactors?
They were never meant to replace common law of the land courts wholesale, and you know it. Excuse my hyperbole, but British Social totalitarianism makes me cranky.
Dick the Butcher is a villain, who proposes killing the lawyers so they won’t be able to stop him and his gang from carrying out their criminal plot.
Ironically, Dick was led by his communist rabble rousing Idol ” Cade”to the right idea for the wrong reasons.
Taking the concept of “killing” to mean “dis-empowering” of course.
Not so. They were joking about an ideal world, sarcastically lamenting the destruction of a man caused by lawyers.
“The law exists for itself and is often used to protect those who hold power over it. …”
I’m working on my thesis on this something like this … but my college is just the school of hard knocks. The enclaves of power walk all over good people, and horse trade “favors” using clients as collateral … as I’ve seen it.
Piles of paperwork that are convoluted and twisted are used as a weapon. Preferred players that will deliver the money or grease the right wheel are never held accountable. People like GZ are routinely sacrificed as “non-players”.
Of course I’m in Illinois where our governors usually go to prison, and the Chicago way dominates … but I certainly relate to your point. My old friends here recognize the problem, but if push comes to shove, they chose to play along, or at least not stand up.
At higher levels there seem to be some that are genuinely concerned about rule of law. But on the day to day level it often never gets even to a judge, and even there odds are often stacked. But when it is occurring at higher levels like this, or the highest, we have serious trouble.
Very well said.
Poor George Zimmerman didn’t know any of that, though. He gave himself up to their system, cooperated with it, believed in it, and was cast to the wolves for his faith.
This is all so sick, so discouraging, and so bloody damned wrong.
Greta just covered it .. she and the Florida woman were pretty good, the two guys in studio were not. (IMO) Diana Tennis (criminal defense attorney) said this does not look like a SYG issue… but rather “I was lying on the ground and getting the poop pummeled out of me, and I grabbed my gun in desperation”. Self defense.
The first thing the black guy said was if it was Trayvon that had done the shooting he would have been arrested. So throw that guy out … except they need him for the racist point of view I guess. He seems clueless on every comment.
The other in studio guy says GZ can’t claim self defense because “he put himself in the situation, after everybody said, 911, don’t go there.” So he seems pretty confused too. Can’t they find people to interview that know as much as folks on this blog? 🙂
The second guy is usually pretty sharp. It was disappointing to hear him misquote the 911 tape.
Not only that – the SPD issued a statement early in the controversy that dispatchers are not LEOs, cannot issue a lawful police order, and Zimmerman didn’t disobey.
It’s on the City website, and has been for weeks now. Getting that wrong when you are on TV as an “expert” shows you are lazy and ignorant.
It also hows he’s not an expert. 🙂
Unlikely that they would be able to find people to interview that have even half the knowledge-base of the individuals on this blog, and even less likely that the media would learn anything from it.
I’m willing to bet a large amount of money that the prosecution attorneys involved in this case don’t have a clue about how Florida’s Castle Doctrine works and would have a difficult time explaining the nuances of how a “self-defense” defendant is or is not acting appropriately. Oh, they can (and will) make emotional appeals to a jury, because that’s how you win jury convictions; on emotion.
The long-and-short of it is that you CAN claim self-defense even IF you put yourself into the situation IF the other party escalated the situation beyond reasonable force. Thus, if Trayvon punched Zimmerman down, and then got on top of him and started beating his head against the pavement with Zimmerman screaming for help (as seems to be the case from the evidence released so far), Zimmerman could have RATIONALLY feared that Trayvon was going to kill him by beating his skull into the pavement (FL Title XLVI, Chapter 776, Section 776.08). That, right there, is sufficient for EITHER the Common Law Self Defense Doctrine (under FL Title XLVI, Chapter 776, 776.041) OR Florida’s Castle Doctrine to take effect (under FL Title XLVI, Chapter 776, 776.013(3)) for the purposes of “forcible felony.”
I may be wrong about this part, but I seem to remember that the standard of proof for Castle Doctrine or Self Defense purposes was preponderance (aka “more likely than not” or 50.1%) and the JUDGE makes the decision on whether the burden by the defense has been met (it’s an affirmative defense). Thus all Zimmerman has to prove is that he would have suffered “great bodily harm” had he not shot Trayvon in order to stop the battery that was occurring.
Levin had a GREAT short break-down of exactly what will have to be proved for a 2nd Degree Murder Charge. As it stands, the Prosecution is going to have a VERY difficult time on its hands unless there is some piece of forensic evidence that wholly and utterly contradicts the current evidence released thus far.
GZ doesn’t have to prove what would have happened, just convince the judge it was reasonable on his part to fear for his life. If the judge doesn’t dismiss, the jury might still believe him.
Before it gets to the point of presenting the affirmative defense (although some states require you declare this intent), the prosecution still has to present a case. Second degree requires malice be proven. If they don’t, the judge might dismiss with prejudice right then on the Murder 2 count at least.
The fact that malice must be proven is why I think the GF’s statement through the Martins’ attorney is in play in terms of the charging. She can say anything she wants to or was coached to say. As of last week or so, she was still refusing to speak directly to the police. Yet today Corey stated she was in daily contact with the Martin attorneys. Without some claim of verbal/ear evidence pointing to malice, it seems to me the most they could have charged would have been manslaughter.
All the G.F. can give is “earwitness” testimony with nobody to corroborate her version. Talk about hearsay.
As we know, Trayvon’s cell phone microphone may easily have picked up the entire vocal exchange between T.M. and G.Z., the same way the 911 call from inside a house picked up screams.
IF this was the only strong evidence that could indicate how the confrontation began, and Corey really needs it…
Since it is public knowledge that every word spoken by telecommunication is recorded and analyzed by NSA Echelon supercomputers using algorithms to flag suspicious patterns related to terrorism, is it a stretch to think that a cell recording could be subpoenaed for use in a court case?
It could be subpoenaed, but the feds don’t have to honor state court subpoenas and probably wouldn’t. They would never open that floodgate, even if they still had the call. I don’t think Echelon is strictly a U.S. venture, anyway.
I know nothing about it for sure, but logic tells me that all calls examined by Echelon would first be reviewed electronically, then electronically prioritized/categorized and then electronically discarded if irrelevant to Echelon’s interests (which probably isn’t listening to 17 yr.old NO_LIMIT_NIGGA yammering with his 16 yr.old girlfriend 🙂 ).
Well said. This buttresses my evolving cynical conspiracy theory as to why Corey wouldn’t just let the grand jury handle the thing.
After all, originally the state attorney from the Seminole county prosecutors office declined to press charges citing no probable cause. And when the Sanford PD Chief kicked it back to them under pressure from the mob, they immediately convened the grand jury.
A grand jury who was set to rule the day before Corey disbanded them.
Add to this the fact that a sizeable amount of witness testimony and evidence has entered the public domain, including yesterday’s testimony by G.Z.’s ex legal team that the forensic evidence not made public was fully supportive of their client.
It is a strain to believe that somehow Corey found some silver bullet testimony or evidence that would negate the preponderance of what we already know.
So why take the burden and risk on herself AND go for Murder 2?? In Florida where a jury cannot settle for a lesser inclusive charge??
It is not a stretch for me to believe that powerful forces beyond the Governor have influenced the direction this “event” should take.
If you were really trying to play the mob, you would give them false hope with an arrest and the biggest charge, and then send them crashing back to rock bottom with an acquittal, and synchronize the timing to fit your needs.
A telling sign will be when the full trial schedule is announced.
some other “notable quotes” from corey were her repeated calls for “justice for trayvon” and her startling admission that she “prayed with the martin family” when she first met them. no mention of prayers or concern for george or the zimmerman family.
“no mention of prayers or concern for george or the Zimmerman family.”
Well, for the Zimmerman family, as it is said where I come from, “que les parta un rayo.” [“Might as well they’d be hit by lightning.”]
Remember, he has been classified as “white”. Easier to hate that way…
Shwboating for the black vote she’ll need come November.
Look, you have to be an idiot to believe the SP was appointed due to any legal problem with the police or local prosecutor’s investigation and disposition of the case. It was political in its entirety, to avoid rioting by the mob.
I hope some good attorneys step up and help GZ. But his situation is another example of why talking to the police CANNOT help you. http://youtu.be/6wXkI4t7nuc
Murder 2? Really? I see six possibilities in order of probability.
1 – She’s deluded enough to think 12 jurors will vote for a conviction on this, or she has some sort of super-secret evidence that nobody else on the planet knows about.
2 – She thinks she can get a plea-bargain out of him by starting high and working down.
3 – She’s playing for time, a murder trial could take place *years* from now, and the Sharptons of the world may lose interest and wander off as the facts become known. At which time the charges can be quietly dropped and he can rejoin society, with no dirt on her shoes. Zimmerman on the other hand will have been dragged through the mud and well-mangled by the press and other predators by then, sucked dry of cash and thrown into yesterdays news.
4 – She’s shooting *too* high intentionally, so the case will be thrown out of court fairly fast. (somewhat like the trials of the police officers in the Rodney King beating who were originally charged with the equivalent of Attempted Murder)
5 – Politics. (Although I’m fuzzy on the details of how this is going to get anybody votes)
6 – Aliens (most likely)
If they’re going to prosecute Zimmerman for murder, why did they leave him run around loose for 45 days after the event? I would think/hope that a prosecutor who believes they have a case “beyond a reasonable doubt” of murder, would maybe…arrest the guy? There was even a question during the press conference that brought it up, and was promptly brushed off. Quite a few good questions really, and the most amazing tapdance from the SP worthy of a future politican. Not that I think she’s looking to use this as a stepping-stone. Really. Honest.
#2 if this charade was actually on the up and up.
#4 if the Men in Black (pun intended) gave her an order she could not refuse to foment roller coaster emotions in the mob leading to further racial division and likely riots.
#5 have your media spin doctor lackeys blame #4 on conservative republicans (including the foolish SP Corey who blew the case) and assure a broader voting base.
#6 Run the Fed Gov and de facto the whole show.
The thing is, there’s no telling what 12 jurors will do. They may well vote to convict him, either because they’re racists or because they’re afraid of a race riot if they don’t. That’s essentially why the second jury convicted the policeman who hit Rodney King six times too many, and his supervisor who didn’t stop him. (They acquitted the other two policemen, who only hit him as many times as they had to, and stopped when he stopped resisting.)
It’s also the reason the Oakland transit authority cop was charged and convicted.
Skinner is correct on the law. Zimmerman was well within his rights to kill Martin. Martin caused the potentially lethal contact by hitting Zimmerman and then pounding on him while on the ground. I’ve worked these cases, one blow can be lethal.
As for no grand jury, in my post I reason that it was not called to indict was it wasn’t going to, and that made the SP force the situation. All the parents wanted was an “arrest” according to Sharpton and their spokesman. SAO gave them the arrest. A grand jury would have kicked the case.
A jury trial will be tough for the prosecution. I worked a case where and older drunk man got into a fight with a younger man. He was dropped and then kicked in the head until he died by the younger guy. we arrested him for murder, SAO prosecuted the case. The jury found him not guilty. Their reason? The older guy started the fight and should have known the risks.
As to Martin knowing he was jumping an armed man, something he would realize if Zimmerman was aggressively stalking him, I’ll guarantee you Martin didn’t know. Bravery and courage are not synonymous with acting like a thug. Actually, “thuggin'” takes on a flavor more like what happened in Gainesville or Baltimore.
Since the NBC lout was found out, I think charges from the feds are unlikely. Especially, when it was discovered he’s not white, has black family and friends and didn’t pick Martin out by color. That’s good news. Unless of course, Obama needs to swing the minorities in Florida this fall, in which case, Zimmerman may be in more trouble.
Amazing how corrupt we have become. It is not even a straight line graph anymore, it is a “J” curve.
Obama won’t need to sway the black vote in FL this November. They’ll fall in line and follow their marching orders like always. He’s more likely to have trouble with the Hispanic vote, though.
People keep talking about how fomenting this case gives obama an advantage. I just don’t see it.
He has a broader agenda. You may be able to find some hints if you do some deep research, but I will give you the skinny.
Barry, his handlers and underlings have not struggled for 60 years to attain power just to be elected out.
There are powerful elements in the military complex who have decided not to allow Barry back in the Oval office, and may not even let it get to election day. Especially as Barry has initiated plans to unionize the military.
Barry knows of this unstoppable opposition, and though he will continue the facade of a campaign, votes mean nothing to him.
His primary goal is to create deep class divide, and deep racial divide, leading to nationwide unrest. Then his weather underground friends along with whoever and whatever they snuck across the mexi border will be used to cripple a city or three, setting the stage for executing martial law and REX 84.
The white hats are carefully monitoring the situation and if they need to they will move early to pre-empt such catastrophe. And if they cannot prevent it, they will slam an iron fist down to quash the rebellion quickly and decisively.
Okay, I just read about Rex 84.
Who are some wearing the white hats you speak of?
Hasn’t this claim about martial law been said about each administration for about the last thirty years or so?
To what eventual end does obama want to initiate martial law? To suspend the constitution so he can cancel the election? Besides fomenting racial strife, what other steps has he taken to lead us to the anarchy necessary to this plan? Ruining the economy? Or is that just a reflection of his marxist values and hatred for capitalism?
If you read the archives of the Ulsterman report, specifically each of the interviews from the past year of “White House insider” and “Wall street insider”, including the comments to each interview, that will paint a pretty good picture of the network of corruptocrats which Obama is a major player in, and their deeper agenda. Breitbart.com is playing catch up, though doing it admirably.
As for the white hats, they largely remain anonymous, are few and far between but have the ear and loyalty of well placed patriots, as well as friends in even “higher places” who have vested interest in the near term destiny of America, the center of light on this blue green jewel of a planet.
3 percent. David and Goliath. Watch the sky in July.
I hate to say this, but WH Insider/Ulsterman has been discredited as a fraud.
I think that if you think this through, charging Zimmerman with the most he can be charged with, and playing out the evidence in a public trial is the only way that both sides ever would be satisfied. It’s the jury that is going to be in the hot seat.
I’m sure the jury will be threatened and intimidated, but it really is poor George Zimmerman who is in the hotseat. He’s the one in true jeopardy now.
I wonder if George is seeing the error of his ways in voting for dimocrats. Even thoough Corey and the governor who appointed her are ‘pubs, it is black America and their supporting libtard handmaidens that have fomented this and put George where he is now, and they are 93% dimocrat.
Why should both sides be satisfied? What has satisfaction got to do with anything? It’s meant to be about justice, not politics. In any case, unjustly arresting someone and putting him through a trial is hardly satisfying for that person, is it?
that’s Greta on the case
seriously, there is no way he is going to get a fair trial cause if he did he would most likely be found not guilty and the rodney king crowd would riot in the streets and steal tvs and jewerly while doing it. this prosecutor needs to be disbarred for this nonsense. it is time to stop having to apologize for being non-black.
It is time to start fighting back.
There are a lot of blacks right now strutting their stuff and bragging about all the power they have now to put whitey in his place so we don’t fight back against their violent attacks. I read a bunch of their crap on several of their websites earlier tonight. Some of the idiots were bragging that this case is going to make “crackas” lose our guns so we can’t defend ourselves.
Al Sharpton at the press conference:
“And I think that that credit should go to the nameless, faceless people, black, white, Latino and Asian all over this country that put hoods on and said take another look at this, and that look has lead to where we are tonight.”
The South and the Democrats, of course, have a rich history of “nameless, faceless people” “that put hoods on” when they felt that legal authorities were not acting to their satisfaction.
How much damage will be done from the riots after he is found not guilty?
Kiss that white Spaniard’s ass goodbye. Now they will make sure they go to trial before election day.
If the law is squarely on Zimmerman’s side, as it seems to be given what we know, is the any chance that he would waive a jury trial and have the decision rendered by the judge? In a case where the jury might reasonably feel physically threatened if they returned a Not Guilty plea, it seems like it might be a reasonable option.
Ultimately it would depend on the judge assigned and the evidence, but that would really be rolling the dice and very foolish, imo.
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