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Perp walk

Perp walk

The media must be fed:

Mug shot:

Charges:

The Speech

Let me emphasize that we do not prosecute by pressure or petition.  We prosecute cases based on the relevant facts of each case and on the laws of the state of Florida….

Update:  The Jury Instruction:

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Comments

Joan Of Argghh | April 12, 2012 at 8:56 am

Why, he’s as white as Obama.

The speech: “Finally, we implore you to allow this case to be tried in the
proper arena…”

Open the gates, bring in the sacrificial lamb and let the games begin!

Fluffy Foo Foo | April 12, 2012 at 9:10 am

I wonder what more evidence there is.

    Corey better have something significant that nobody has heard, otherwise this thing is going to blow up in her face.

      Fluffy Foo Foo in reply to ThomasD. | April 12, 2012 at 10:41 am

      I tend to agree.

      It also worries me that she didn’t try and get an indictment from a grand jury. It only makes sense to not take it to a grand jury if the evidence she has is overwhelming or because she was was afraid the evidence would underwhelm a grand jury.

        JimMtnViewCaUSA in reply to Fluffy Foo Foo. | April 12, 2012 at 12:47 pm

        On another web site, local Floridians pointed out that lack of a GJ for a case like this is common in FL. This case is getting extensive, exhaustive coverage at justoneminute.typepad.com for anyone interested.
        Scroll back a week or two and then start reading…lots and lots of details in the comments.

      n.n in reply to ThomasD. | April 12, 2012 at 3:56 pm

      Perhaps this trial is simply about saving face for Obama, Sharpton, Jackson, and other community organizers.

      n.n in reply to ThomasD. | April 12, 2012 at 3:56 pm

      Perhaps this trial is simply about saving face for Obama, Sharpton, Jackson, and other community organizers.

I may have believed this statement if the “Special” Prosecutor hadn’t appeared to be accepting an Academy Award while announcing the charges.

    janitor in reply to ClinkinKy. | April 12, 2012 at 2:38 pm

    I confess that I was somewhat surprised and put off by Angela’s demeanor. I am wondering who wrote her speech and/or coached her. The speech seemed to be mostly read, with that odd lilt that some do when reading, and she was smiling as if it were a campaign speech.

Let me emphasize that we do not prosecute by pressure or petition.

Part of this fellow’s defense has to be that this prosecution is solely about responding to pressure from interest groups.
1-the decide not to charge
2-the race industry and the media go cray
3-they charge

My argument would be, they got it right the first time, before the pressure hit.

    GrumpyOne in reply to Karl Rogue. | April 12, 2012 at 9:38 am

    You have it exactly right.

    What I find particularly troubling is the fact that Obama and Holder making disparaging remarks prior to any charges being filed. Not only does this place a extraordinary burden on the trial judge, it makes finding an untainted jury nearly impossible.

    I think that the country is heading to some sort of implosion beginning with a long hot summer of discontent…

      Reynolds88 in reply to GrumpyOne. | April 12, 2012 at 12:15 pm

      While it is serious in every respect, I can’t help thinking of “The Doors”, The Soft Parade (1970)

      They (FL) finally pardonned Jim Morrison for his crimes 43 years after the fact, and 41 years posthumously.

      “Since the original charges and trial were a publicity stunt to begin with, it doesn’t surprise me in the slightest that the pardon should follow in those footsteps,” she told CNN. Her husband “did nothing to be pardoned for” and his record should have been expunged, Patricia Morrison (his widow) said.

      Jim Morrison: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1XlqCFi6o-E

      “When I was back there in seminary school, there was a person there Who put forth the proposition, that you can petition the lord with prayer Petition the lord with prayer, petition the lord with prayer
      You cannot petition the lord with prayer!
      Can you give me sanctuary, I must find a place to hide, a place for me to hide Can you find me soft asylum, I cant make it anymore, the man is at the door…”

This whole thing is taking on most of the major themes found in Wolfe’s Bonfires of the Vanities (1987) which appeared just as the Tawana Brawley “incident” was unfolding.

Read the book (or at least the Wiki entry) to see the predicable outcome awaiting Geo. Zimmerman, the “white” Hispanic, and to see how predictably all of the leftist characters and leftist institutions will behave.

We’re looking at you, A.S.

If you think the media has finally quit using that old mug shot of Zimmerman the hefty, bruising thug since they have a brand new one–and no excuses…

…you’d be wrong:

http://www.freep.com/article/20120412/NEWS07/120412009/Trayvon-Martin-prosecution-hurdles-George-Zimmerman?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|FRONTPAGE

    Joan Of Argghh in reply to Browndog. | April 12, 2012 at 10:42 am

    Don’t hold yer breath. They haven’t found a new picture of Rush Limbaugh in about 10 years.

    Midwest Rhino in reply to Browndog. | April 12, 2012 at 11:00 am

    and “the young child” Trayvon is never shown as an older and aggressive gang banger, proudly showing his gold teeth. And his nasty tweets never make the news.

    The most disturbing aspect to me is the level of choreography.

    For one thing, the NBC editing of the tapes and facts, so from the time this became national (long after the event) everyone “knew” GZ had hunted down “poor child Trayvon” because he was black. Martin’s GF found a lawyer, not the cops. But the story seems more than just the lawyer’s narrative. Did it just fit the leftist media’s narrative, or was their higher coordination?

    Holder is still stonewalling on the gun running, but a reasonable person would suspect “working on gun control beneath the radar” was a motive in walking so many guns to cartels, without bothering to try to arrest anyone.

    Now Holder praises Sharpton and thanks him for his “partnership”. How in the world can the DOJ be in partnership with Sharpton, who has only incited race based violence? Is this more coordinated gun control (beneath the radar) manipulation? Didn’t Obama’s “if I had a son he’d look like Trayvon” line seem scripted, indicating coordination with media?

    White vigilante guns down child with candy because “he looks black”.

    They couldn’t have headined it better if they’d planned it … or maybe it was just a script, since the facts don’t fit. How about …

    Hispanic man assaulted and beaten by black male, uses deadly force to defend himself.

    GZ was the first victim, according to all reports. But three weeks later a very different headline emerged, and the rest is history. Just a coincidence?

DINORightMarie | April 12, 2012 at 9:27 am

You know, this is worse than the Lindbergh baby trial “media circus” nightmare!! That insanity of media malpractice led to heavily curtailing the media (mostly the printed press, some newsreels) in such a way that the privacy and dignity of the individuals involved – families, as well as the accused – were protected as much as possible from a “media circus” and “trial by media”…..what this has now become.

I saw that Mr. Zimmerman’s lawyer has asked for the trial to be moved, as there is no way for a fair trial in Florida.

Is there ANYTHING that can be done to stop this nightmare – for all involved?!

(Of course, I know there is no way Holder and the DoJ – let alone OFA and Obama – want this to be reigned in; after all, the Republican Convention is in Tampa, in August. Oh, and the Mormon church has a “racist history”, don’cha know.)

Unfortunately, being charged was probably the best thing for Zimmerman at this point. The mob may have taken their “justice” by force if he wasn’t.

Innocent until proven guilty…… oh wait.
After the President, the Attorney General, NBC editing the 911 tapes, the entire “mainstream” media have weighed in, and how does Mr. Zimmerman get a fair trial based on the relevant facts of each case and on the laws of the state of Florida….?

    GrumpyOne in reply to tazz. | April 12, 2012 at 9:51 am

    He Doesn’t… So move the trial over here in Texas where the law is even more accommodating for concealed carry and self defense.

    I’d love to sit on the jury and oh yeah… It would have gone to a grand jury first and the result would have been, “No Bill.”

    The only reason that there is prosecution in this case is because of the Obama, Holder, Sharpton, Jackson and the rest of the pre-judging zealots out there!

… evincing a depraved mind …

Gosh! I’m no expert here, but it sure doesn’t seem to me that a “depraved mind” would bother to calmly call 9-1-1 two minutes before the event went down.

    Valerie in reply to Samuel Keck. | April 12, 2012 at 9:46 am

    “Depraved mind” is boilerplate for an element of the crime. It’s akin to gross negligence. So, that will be the subject of some sort of proof at trial.

I appreciate you Professor for following this. Could you however post the picture of the “white racist” everyone kept talking about?

Have to agree with Tazz and awing. Of course, even if he is found not guilty, Holder will probably charge him again. Double jeopardy yo say? Holder’s DOJ has already shown they interpret the law however they want, and Constitution is just an obstacle to get around.

DocWahala, will keep praying for Mr. Zimmerman, his story is far from over.

This reminds me of the scene in “My Cousin Vinny” where Gambino tells his cousin ‘there’s no way this isn’t going to trial..” But I’ll reword here to keep it current :Hey, George. You’re in Frickin’ Florida. You’re a white hispanic. You killed a preferred minority. There is NO WAY this is not going to trial.”

I wonder how this will play out…..Trayvon’s mother says the shooting was an accident:

http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/04/12/11159111-trayvon-martins-mom-says-she-thinks-his-killing-was-an-accident?lite

    Browndog in reply to Joy. | April 12, 2012 at 9:52 am

    Thinking she knew he was out of control..

    Thinking that’s why she sent him to his dads after his latest school suspension-

    DINORightMarie in reply to Joy. | April 12, 2012 at 10:11 am

    All this – and more – is going to come out at this trial, and it won’t be pretty. These statements by the Mom, the one by the Dad (that he later changed) that the screaming on the 911 tape was NOT Trayvon screaming……the troubled past few months/years of Trayvon’s life, their home life……

    I shudder to think how this will all be broadcast, while it unfolds. The MSM will have no mercy, no shame, and will not respect ANYONE – except Obama and Holder, of course.

    Zimmerman must go elsewhere for a fair trial, and indeed there is virtually no way to get an untainted jury of peers, which reveals a more serious problem: since 2008, it’s been blatantly obvious to anyone even remotely aware of reality that the media has become a monster, making the news and pre-determining outcomes, not merely reporting it. Candidates are being picked by them (Obama vs. Hillary “it’s MY turn” Clinton, McCain vs. anyone else!, etc. etc.); narratives being spun without any evidence, or any modicum of journalistic integrity (I believe Rush’s term “drive-by media” is a good way to put it); I could go on, but I’ve illustrated my point.

    Is there a limit – a point too far? How to reign in, to neuter, this poisonous monster?

    We know, of course, that if this regime is NOT voted OUT in November, this will become not only the norm – but even worse, the relentless meat grinder of lies and hate told as truth and “news.” Pravda will pale in comparison. Or are we there already…..?

    caambers in reply to Joy. | April 12, 2012 at 11:36 am

    Thinking she can afford to be magnanimous now that a big pay day is in the offing….

    Not exactly. The mother said, The meeting was accidental, the killing was cold-blooded murder. She said, “My son was profiled, followed and murdered by George Zimmerman, and there was nothing accidental about that.”

Prosecutor Corey said what?

“Our oath will be upheld for our victim, Trayvon Martin and for the man responsible for his death, George Zimmerman.”

Ummm … seems to me that defining the victim as Martin in advanced is prejudicial as is declaring Zimmerman as the man responsible for his death.

Since Zimmerman evidently suffered injury as a result of Trayvon Martin’s actions, Prosecutor Corey is way off the reservation with her victimization of a victim.

Along those same lines, if Zimmerman is the victim, then he is entitled to self-defense under the law.

I would hope that GZ’s new lawyer will take up this subject with the judge.

    Fluffy Foo Foo in reply to gad-fly. | April 12, 2012 at 10:46 am

    The State of Florida says George Zimmerman is the murderer of Trayvon Martin… so George is not a victim in the prosecutor’s eyes now; Trayvon is.

    The State of Florida is totally against George Zimmerman now.

    Milhouse in reply to gad-fly. | April 12, 2012 at 1:33 pm

    Of course it’s prejudicial; she’s supposed to have already judged the matter. She’s not supposed to be neutral; on the contrary, if she does not believe he’s guilty then it’s unethical for her to charge him and put him through a trial! Indeed, what we’re complaining of is that we don’t believe she really has concluded he’s guilty; because to do so she’d need strong evidence, and if she had such evidence surely she’d reveal it. Therefore we suspect that she’s behaving unethically in charging him. But the fact that her words show that she’s prejudged the case and is assuming his guilt is not grounds for complaint against her, because if she is behaving ethically then that’s exactly what she would do.

Any chance Zimmerman will waive a jury trial?

    ThomasD in reply to OCBill. | April 12, 2012 at 10:34 am

    Interesting question. Would he know who his judge would be prior to such an election?

    If so, it might be a viable option.

    Fluffy Foo Foo in reply to OCBill. | April 12, 2012 at 10:47 am

    He probably can’t waive a jury trial on the charge of 2nd degree murder. Don’t know Florida law though.

      Cowboy Curtis in reply to Fluffy Foo Foo. | April 12, 2012 at 12:06 pm

      He can waive it. You can even do so in capital murder. But honestly, unless the facts are very different from what we know right now, and the trail isn’t held in some ridiculous jurisdiction, he’s probably as well off, if not better off, with a jury. Judges are politicians, too.

        ThomasD in reply to Cowboy Curtis. | April 12, 2012 at 1:33 pm

        If you concede that the judge might prove as political as Corey appears to be then whatever Zimmerman does will have little bearing on his fate.

        Given what the judge controls – everything the jury hears and what specific directions they are given for deliberations.

The mother’s comments about the shooting possibly having been an accident are interesting. Wonder why she’s saying this now? Could she be concerned that Trayvon’s Twitter account and some of his more belligerent remarks could be used at trial to show that he was trying to cultivate a bad-ass persona? Any Florida lawyers here who can shed some light on what’s admissible?

I would like to hear the elements required for “self defense”. I understand that in FL it is acceptable to use deadly force not only for defense of self when you fear for your life, but also when you fear imminent bodily harm – couldn’t ones EASILY argue that, even if the shooting was done at a distance of 5 feet, Trayvon was advancing again?

“I’d managed to get him off me for a few seconds, drew my gun, and he started to come towards me again…”

    Lina Inverse in reply to Scott Jacobs. | April 12, 2012 at 12:00 pm

    The standard in Florida in section 776.012 of the law is “great bodily harm”.

    States tend to have clear standards, but interpreting them is obviously case specific and self-defense against an unarmed person is of course the most difficult to establish.

    That said, in the situation you posit, it would make a difference if Martin had already elevated the conflict to the level where Zimmerman could use deadly force; in general he would not be allowed to shoot once Martin started retreating (and Florida has some standard law that addresses that) but it doesn’t apply if Martin immediately reengages in combat.

    Once a gun becomes visible the situation changes; for example, in this sort of context if your opponent starts to try to take your gun away, as one or more Zimmerman relatives has claimed and which appears to be supported by his gun not fully cycling, you have to assume if successful they’ll then try to use it on you. At which point you don’t have much choice about what you’re going to have to do, as the relatives pointed out.

Aww, how sweet. This county of Florida gave Zimmerman a hijab.

DINORightMarie | April 12, 2012 at 11:14 am

Just saw the update of the jury’s directions to bring a judgement of guilty – and I was reading the Florida definition of “murder in the second degree.”

This will play out in the courts, of course, and I don’t have access to the evidence. But what is known to the public now (NOT the doctored 911 tapes, etc., but the full tapes, witness comments, etc.) seems to make this case NOT “murder in the second degree” or at least not beyond a reasonable doubt, IMHO.

What a nightmare for all. And to think: Holder and/or Obama could have neutralized this by just giving a brief statement.

Gee, thanks again, for being president to “all of us” and justice department for “all of us.”

Yeah, riiiiiggggghhhhhhtttt.

In the Jury Instructions #2 it would seem impossible to convict RZ unless there is evidence that has not come forward to the public. Where is the “ill will, hatred, spite, or evil intent” evident from the information we have so far. If Trayvon was beating his head on the pavement while sitting on top of him, how could you ascribe #2 as his intentions for shooting him? With the information I have heard, this is a clear not guilty.

    As generated through precedent, “evil intent” is inferred by the commission of the fore-mentioned “criminal act.” There does not have to be a separate “spite,” “hatred” or “ill will” beyond that criminal act.

I think this will all fall apart as soon as the forensic evidence comes out. If George Zimmerman’s story is accurate, then the point, direction and blast of the gunshot wound will prove it. If Trayvon was over Zimmerman, punching him, then Zimmerman must have shot him on his left side, with the barrel of the gun directly against or very near Martin’s side, lower ribcage, with the bullet traveling upwards, etc.

The prosecution is going to have to jump through way too many hoops to prove that it was Zimmerman’s fault that there was a guy sitting on his chest, punching him the face for long enough that he could pull out his gun and fire.

I still don’t see that the elements of second degree murder are satisfied, particularly after reviewing the jury instructions. I’m hoping that there is information that I dont’ know to justify this charge and that the prosecutor didn’t succumb to pressure. But after seeing the “the lady doth protest too much” press conference yesterday, I’m starting to have my doubts.

Let me emphasize that we do not prosecute by pressure or petition.

I actually laughed out loud when she said this.

Ever seen a news conference or a statement from a professional athlete, and he says, “It’s not about the money?” And inevitably, it’s always about the money?

That’s exactly what I thought when she said this yesterday.

The administration continues to stonewall on F&F, green energy, a budget and the Obamas’ outrageous spending on vacations while we ignore all of the above and hang breathlessly on every story about this case.

How can people not see what is happening here?

“…and performed pursuant to a single design or purpose.”

That seems like a mighty high bar to get over, particularly if it is a fact that Zimmerman ended his pursuit and was attempting to return to his car/meet the responding officer.

Cowboy Curtis | April 12, 2012 at 12:16 pm

She overcharged him as a political move. She doesn’t want him to go to jail, and so overcharges him that it virtually forces the jury to convict (or maybe even have the judge toss in pretrail). The judge and jury get the blame, she gets credit for prosecuting the Great White (hispanic) Defendant, and Zimmerman goes free with an empty bank account and ruined reputation.

Seriously, short of Zimmerman physically attacking Martin and then shooting him, or shooting him while standing over him, how does the evidence support a 2nd degree murder charge? The answer is that it doesn’t, and isn’t supposed to. Death resulting from mutual combat is almost always treated as manslaughter. But if she charged him with that, a biased jury might talk itself into a conviction. Corey is trying to look like the hero by tossing the book at him, knowing all the while that he’ll walk. For her, its win-win. That of course, assumes there is not bombshell evidence in the wings about Zimmerman’s actions, and given the media’s behavior, I have a hard time believing we wouldn’t know about such a thing by now.

    Cowboy Curtis in reply to Cowboy Curtis. | April 12, 2012 at 12:17 pm

    *That first “convict” is supposed to be acquit.

    If Zimmerman beats this charge (and his attorney’s make it CLEAR that the charge should NOT have been brought in the first place, this appears to be a prime candidate for a “abuse of prosecutor discretion” civil suit.

    It would be REALLY tough to win, but it would be terribly embarrassing to the Prosecutor, even to be brought, and would certainly survive a summary judgment motion . It’s also highly possible that the NRA would bankroll it simply to put their boot to the ass of the Florida Attorney General’s Office and Prosecutors on the idea that “citizens can protect themselves, stop abusing those who choose to do so.”

      Cowboy Curtis in reply to Chuck Skinner. | April 12, 2012 at 1:11 pm

      AG Pam Bondi has (or had) an A rating from the NRA. Its pretty tough to get elected in FL without it. In all honesty, I don’t know how much influence her office has over any of this. State Attorneys are elected by their district, two and three counties each per judicial circuit. I don’t believe the AG has much control over them.

      If there’s no more meat to the case than what has already been shown, then Corey might well have some problems, if not legally, then certainly politically. At least if she plans on running for anything outside of Duval County. Its not much of an exaggeration to say Florida is just about gun owner heaven, and the NRA is mighty damn popular. And I don’t think that really contradicts what I’ve proposed as her political motivations earlier. What looks great on paper (splitting the Zimmerman baby in this instance) has a way of not going well in practice. And, of course, she might very only have ambitions in the Jacksonville area, in which case this isn’t going to hurt her. Finally, she might just feel she doesn’t have any other viable political option, given the circumstances, and is just going to play the cards she has been dealt. I suppose there is another option- that she’s convinced herself an unjust prosecution will calm things down and diffuse the situation- but given her prayers with the Martin family, I’m pretty doubtful this is her primary motive.

      Again, all of this assumes there is no bombshell evidence hidden in the wings.

    Milhouse in reply to Cowboy Curtis. | April 12, 2012 at 1:39 pm

    If that’s what she did then she deserves to be disbarred. But I think your analysis doesn’t make sense; on the contrary, charging murder allows the jury to “compromise” on manslaughter and feel virtuous about it.

      Cowboy Curtis in reply to Milhouse. | April 12, 2012 at 8:02 pm

      I might be wrong, but I don’t think this is a lesser and included situation. I think its 2nd degree or nothing.

The purpo$e of thi$ noisy campaign is not to get George Zimmerman CONVICTED – just to get him ARRE$TED.

Not to make GZ pay – but to make $omeone anyone with deep enough pocket$ pay – handsomely. Without an arrest, no civil suit could be filed against the community, city, police, etc.

http://theconservativetreehouse.com/2012/04/12/arrest-delivered-trayvons-parents-closer-to-payday-attorney-general-provides-the-key/

(scroll down to see the Martins’ lawyers with the million dollar check)

However, any money awarded will be split between the Jackson/Sharpton/Panther sharks for their helpful services, the lying/evidence-tampering lawyers, their paid ‘witnesses and experts’ and the family (two parents/two step parents) who will exhaust themselves fighting over the little that remains.

I’m still waiting for the Prosecution to actually trot out and say exactly WHAT the underlying felony criminal act was.

There are several possibilities, ALL of which are bad for the prosecution:

1.) Carrying a concealed weapon without a license (Did Zimmerman have a Concealed Pistol License[CPL]?) Open carry is generally prohibited, unless Florida recently changed their law and I missed it.

2.) Discharging a firearm in public (Title XLVI Section 790.15). Self Defense or Castle Doctrine applies. I think this one the most likely. See below.

3.) Does Zimmerman have some prior felony conviction that we don’t know about (Felon in possession)?

4.) Aggravated Assault with a firearm. Did he fire in Trayvon’s general direction not meaning to hit Trayvon and actually hit him? Self Defense or Castle Doctrine applies.

My best guess at this point is that the Prosecutor is going to try to hang her hat on Discharging a firearm in public (Title XLVI Section 790.15) by saying that it was an “unlawful” discharge (i.e. that “Zimmerman was not in imminent danger of great bodily harm. If they attempt to do this, Zimmerman’s attorneys will have a FIELD DAY with the broken nose and gashes on the back of Zimmerman’s head and the narrative that Trayvon was slamming Zimmerman’s head into the pavement REPEATEDLY.

Also, I think there will be a LOT of public backlash if the underlying “crime” to push this to a 2nd Degree Murder charge is a simple “unlawful discharge” given the circumstances surrounding this particular case. This is not your standard “depraved heart” random shooting where that sort of “felony-murder” charge would be appropriate.

1. A quick look through the intertubes suggests that prosecutor Corey is hardnosed and competent. I say, let her do the job she was elected to do. If the evidence at trial is too flimsy to be taken seriously, that will be the time for reprisals against her. Ditto if she has overcharged Zimmerman with 2nd-degree murder when, e.g., the evidence at most supports manslaughter by negligence.

2. Pure conjecture:

Afaik the ballistics report has not appeared in the media. My understanding is that it will reveal the angle of the bullet and perhaps the distance between shooter and target.

3. DocWahala | April 12, 2012 at 9:45 am

Have to agree with Tazz and awing. Of course, even if he is found not guilty, Holder will probably charge him again. Double jeopardy yo say? Holder’s DOJ has already shown they interpret the law however they want, and Constitution is just an obstacle to get around.

Yes. The Constitution forbids double jeopardy. Apparently the “living Constitution” forbids double jeopardy…unless some official muckety-muck claims there was a miscarriage of justice, or there is political pressure for a conviction.

The police who beat Rodney King were acquitted by a California court. That may or may not have been a miscarriage of justice, but IMHO it was a miscarriage of justice when they were retried at the federal level on a civil-rights pretext.

    Cowboy Curtis in reply to gs. | April 12, 2012 at 1:20 pm

    Right now, I think Holder’s civil rights violation noise is just talk for the mob. Zimmerman was not a state actor, he was not acting in any sort of governmental/official capacity. Law school was a while ago (and it wasn’t my area of practice), but I’m pretty sure the feds can only intervene on those grounds when the party in question is working for, or on behalf of, the government, and the event takes place while acting under the color of that capacity. That’s how they got involved in the Rodney King mess.

    As a general rule, private citizens cannot violate anyone’s civil rights.

    As for the issue of double jeopardy, the state and fed are two different things with two different bodies of law. Assuming both have applicable statutes, each can try you for the same violation separately. For instance, if you shoot a postman, the state can try you for simple murder, and the feds can try you for murder of a federal employee. An acquittal in one will not protect you from trail for the other.

      Milhouse in reply to Cowboy Curtis. | April 12, 2012 at 1:49 pm

      I’m pretty sure the feds can only intervene on those grounds when the party in question is working for, or on behalf of, the government, and the event takes place while acting under the color of that capacity. That’s how they got involved in the Rodney King mess.

      As a general rule, private citizens cannot violate anyone’s civil rights.

      This is not true at all. For instance, Lemrick Nelson was convicted for infringing, out of racial hatred, my friend Yankel Rosenbaum’s right to walk on a public street.

        Cowboy Curtis in reply to Milhouse. | April 12, 2012 at 8:07 pm

        I swear I posted a response to this, I guess it there must have been a pile-up on the interwebitubes. Are you positive it was criminal and not civil, and no government actor angle? If so, was it some sort of hate crime charge? I’m not being a smartass, I’m really asking.

      Thanks for your knowledgeable response, CC.

      1. I’m not a lawyer, but I wonder if the feds could claim, in a tactically chosen venue, that Zimmerman’s neighborhood watch role makes him a government actor.

      2. As for the issue of double jeopardy, the state and fed are two different things with two different bodies of law. Assuming both have applicable statutes, each can try you for the same violation separately. For instance, if you shoot a postman, the state can try you for simple murder, and the feds can try you for murder of a federal employee. An acquittal in one will not protect you from trail for the other.

      Understood, but IMHO that damn well shouldn’t be the case. Both here and in my previous comment, I put ‘IMHO’ because there presumably are aspects to the issue that escape me at first sight.

        Baladas in reply to gs. | April 12, 2012 at 4:04 pm

        Sanford PD puts out a watch manual and implies that they are in cooperation with the Official National Sheriff’s association Watch Program.

        But each local watch group must register if they are to be bound by those rules. If registered, G.Z. may be construed to be a govn’t actor.

        It is possible that Twin lakes watch was an unofficially organized group that used the Sanford PD watch manual as guidelines.

        Some cite the fact that George was not scheduled on watch duty that night. But anyone registered for Watch who takes steps to contact the PD regarding some incident is automatically bound by the regulations, regardless if they were scheduled for special patrol or not.

        If he was not registered, I don’t think they could make such a case against him, whether he was scheduled for his unofficial volunteer patrol or not.

        Cowboy Curtis in reply to gs. | April 12, 2012 at 8:20 pm

        gs, sorry, I missed that IMHO part in your post. I’m sort of inclined to agree with you on the point. But then, in a dual jurisdiction criminal case, if the government only got one bite at the apple, my guess is the feds would take over every time. And I’m not sure that’s all that great an outcome.

        Personally, I think that except where the crimes are truly interstate or international in nature, federal criminal law should mostly be removed from the books. The feds got into the business in the 30’s because sophisticated criminals were operating interstate operations and many local jurisdictions, whether by lack of communication or training, simply were not up to the task in dealing with it. That is no longer the case, and hasn’t been for some years now.

    jimg in reply to gs. | April 12, 2012 at 1:49 pm

    A quick look through the intertubes suggests that prosecutor Corey is hardnosed and competent.

    Sorry, but any prior reputation along those lines went out the window at yesterday’s presser.

    Smiling, glad-handing and acting like you’re accepting an award – while announcing a 2nd degree murder charge – are not the actions of a hard-nosed and competent prosecutor.

      gs in reply to jimg. | April 12, 2012 at 2:44 pm

      I do not cross out a career’s reputation because of one poorly conducted press conference.

      I await the evidence.

          Ragspierre in reply to Baladas. | April 12, 2012 at 7:34 pm

          Did you even read that crap…????

          “Angela Corey’s pro death penalty stance is also something of concern. On June 20 of 2011, U.S. District Judge Jose E. Martinez declared Florida’s death penalty unconstitutional. Interestingly, Florida has the highest number of death sentence reversals in the US with 23. Illinois repealed the death penalty this year to become the fourth state in the last five years to put an end to what is not only an archaic practice but essentially state sanctioned murder. Nationwide, opposition to the death penalty has hit a 39 year high with 35% of people wanting it abolished.”

    Baladas in reply to gs. | April 12, 2012 at 4:33 pm

    I found this.

    http://www.change.org/petitions/remove-state-attorney-angela-corey

    Honestly, if she had any integrity she would have said the following.

    Dear Governor. In regards to your request for me to act as a special prosecutor in the case of Florida v. Zimmerman.

    It has come to my attention that after completing their thorough investigation on March 15th, the Sanford PD sent those results to the State atty at the Seminole county office, who had original jurisdiction in the case.

    That prosecutor has made the decision to convene a grand jury, who is scheduled to meet on 4/10 to decide on the matter.

    It seems to me that, considering the intricacies of Florida Stand your ground law, that the Sanford PD and Seminole county have proceeded with due diligence, and see no reason to intervene, unless you can provide me with probable cause that will indicate some malfeasance on their part that may lead to a miscarriage of justice.

    Respectfully,

    Angela Corey

Trayvon Martin’s mother:

“I believe it was an accident.”

I believe Al Sharpton and the New Black Panthers want a word with her.

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout/trayvon-martin-mom-sybrina-fulton-zimmerman-shooting-accident-122512394.html

Whoa Nelly, has the date of the public execution of this miscreant “White His.” person been announced yet? What’s the holdup on that most important announcement, eh? Come on now, does this public viewing of “revenge justice” really have to have an “R” rating? What will MSNBC think about that, Kenneth? MSNBC really could use that rating boost afterall!

Perp walks should be illegal.

What a sane observer takes from this…

A judge looked at the charging instruments, and found probable cause, supporting the decision by the prosecution. (This does not mean Zimmerman is guilty of anything.)

“Victim” is used by the State to identify “the dead guy” in promulgating the jury charge. It has no value as a sign of “bias” by the prosecutor.

The propriety (or lack thereof) of the charging by the prosecutor will never be mentioned in court at trial. It would be irrelevant to any element of either side’s case, and no (good) judge would permit it being argued to a jury.

    Baladas in reply to Ragspierre. | April 12, 2012 at 4:11 pm

    When those evidential instruments are closely examined during the trial, the judge may discover that their relevance was misrepresented by the prosecutor in a way that his original cursory examination could not reveal.

    Baladas in reply to Ragspierre. | April 12, 2012 at 4:21 pm

    If the Orland Sentinel report is to be believed, Corey’s got squat.

    “The Orlando Sentinel said it had obtained a copy before it was expected to be filed with the courthouse.

    The newspaper says that Martin’s mother identified screams heard in the background of a 911 call as her son’s. There had been some question as to whether Martin or Zimmerman was the one calling for help.

    Prosecutors also interviewed a friend of Martin’s who was talking to him just before the shooting. The affidavit says Martin told the witness he was being followed and was scared.

    Martin tried to run home, the affidavit says, but was followed by Zimmerman: “Zimmerman got out of his vehicle and followed Martin.”

    The affidavit says that “Zimmerman disregarded the police dispatcher” who told him to stop, and “continued to follow Martin who was trying to return to his home.”

      Ragspierre in reply to Baladas. | April 12, 2012 at 5:03 pm

      Sorry, but isn’t that account fundamentally at odds with the “Martin attacked Zimmerman” meme?

      You don’t find that significant?

        Baladas in reply to Ragspierre. | April 12, 2012 at 6:39 pm

        What I find significant is how weak the evidence is.

        1. Tracy Martin is on record stating that it was not his son’s voice. He later recanted saying the first recording he heard wasn’t clear enough.

        The only eyewitness on record to have actually seen the altercation before the gunshot claimed it was Z on the bottom screaming for help, and positively identified the clothing type and color worn by both men in his account.

        2. The 911 recording distinctly indicates that George was not in hot pursuit except for perhaps 10 seconds after exiting his car, as the next 2 minutes reveal a calm and measured conversation with the dispatcher.

        So a 17 year old wide receiver was prevented from running a city block to his house by the very fact that George exited his car and gave chase for 10 seconds? Please.

        And unless Corey can convince the NSA to admit they record every phone call of every American and hand over a recording, how will she corroborate the testimony of the girlfriend anyway?

        3. Sanford PD issued a statement to the effect that 911 dispatchers are not official L.E. and have no power to issue a lawful order that anyone must obey, which is why the dispatcher phrased his statement as advisory.

        And regardless, George (probably out of ignorance) showed deference to the advice, acknowledged the advice in the affirmative, you could hear he stopped breathing as if running.

        Later in the call, he agrees to meet the police near the mailboxes. Later still he changes his mind and tells dispatch to have the cops call him so he can tell them where he will be at. Dispatch agrees. The call ends.

        His father claims that he went around the street corner at that time to the front side of the row of homes to note the address of the house behind which was the last place he saw Trayvon.

        He then returned to his truck and had to pass the path that ran between backyards of the 2 rows of homes, which is where Trayvon allegedly emerged from and approached him. The place of the final struggle was behind the first home in the row, about 15 feet off the “backyard” path and 30 feet from the main sidewalk which lay perpendicular to t.

        That main sidewalk ran along the street and was what George would likely have been walking along to go back to his car.

          Ragspierre in reply to Baladas. | April 12, 2012 at 6:52 pm

          But trials are MADE of one side or the other placing credence in evidence…or NOT.

          You LIKE your evidence, which is fine. No sin.

          But that does NOT preclude another weighting of the evidence. Again, no sin.

        Milhouse in reply to Ragspierre. | April 12, 2012 at 7:25 pm

        How is it inconsistent?

        Baladas in reply to Ragspierre. | April 12, 2012 at 7:28 pm

        If you will note, I never disagreed with your three observations of what a sane person would take away from the situation.

        My point was that Corey has presented weak evidence.

        I implied that I believe it will be found to have been less than probable cause.

        But obviously, it was enough for the judge to admit the case to trial and I never denied that fact.

        After I made my point by expressing my opinion, you wrote…

        “Sorry, but isn’t that account fundamentally at odds with the “Martin attacked Zimmerman” meme?

        You don’t find that significant?”

        Which was a non-sequitur in essence, so I went on to say what I find significant.

        So why do you continue to point out the obvious as If it escapes me?

        My tack in all this overall discussion is to point out the travesty of justice that has already occurred ever since the mob, whipped up by Crump and Sharpton, has pressured the Governor to take the case from the prosecutor with original jurisdiction.

        Which ultimately led to dubious evidence being used by an obviously biased “special” persecutor, directly resulting in George now being treated in many ways as guilty until proven innocent by virtue of being artificially subject to the dangers of incarceration until his arraignment.

          Ragspierre in reply to Baladas. | April 12, 2012 at 7:42 pm

          Shorter Baladas:

          I like my story.

          Corey is bad. As are all the elected and unelected officials in Florida.

          The American criminal legal system will kill Zimmerman.

          Baladas in reply to Baladas. | April 12, 2012 at 8:35 pm

          Not all, I was very specific in mentioning who is obviously crooked and why. Enjoy your rose colored glasses and the utopic view it affords if you like, but you will have to make extra effort to ignore when I and other realists around me point out the egregious corruption you condone as reasonably inevitable status quo.

          Ragspierre in reply to Baladas. | April 13, 2012 at 6:57 am

          Nobody is “obviously crooked”.

          And IF they were, there would be a HUGE cast of equally crooked people, and an even MORE HUGE cast of complicit enablers.

          And you slime all these people on your thin gruel of sanctimony, based on your construct of how things have to be (which is [1] remarkably stilted, [2] based on NO personal knowledge of ANY-FLUCKING-THING…including the law, and [3] reliant on a number of stupid ASSumptions).

          Your dystopic “everybody is crap but me” version of “realism” is just as delusional…and mean…as anything the Collectivist embrace. And it comes from the same drive to find some cheap moral superiority. It is just as fundamentally anti-American, as well.

    Milhouse in reply to Ragspierre. | April 12, 2012 at 7:23 pm

    OK, now you’ve seen the charging document. Do you think it amounts to probable cause? I don’t. And since it doesn’t, those who claim it does are lying through their teeth.

After Zimmerman exited, O’Mara asked the judge to seal documents in the court file containing other information — including witness statements and information.

“I am seeking on my clients behalf… that we do a complete sealing of that record,” O’Mara said, adding that the sealing would be temporary. The judge agreed. [As did the prosectution, if I understand correctly.]

After the hearing, prosecutor Bernie De La Rionda asked reporters gathered outside for patience. [Another necessary member of some dark, tyrannical cabal, BTW…]

“In the rule of law, we have jury trials for a purpose,” De La Rionda said. O’Mara echoed that sentiment.

“It really, truly, it works,” O’Mara said of the judicial system, telling reporters that in a case of this profile, if it doesn’t work, “you’ll tell us.”

O’Mara said it made more sense to forgo a bond hearing at this point, electing to give time to allow the fervor surrounding the case to die down. He said his client is in protective custody.
—————————————-
Huh. Both those guys sound like a certain…well…me…

    Baladas in reply to Ragspierre. | April 12, 2012 at 7:08 pm

    Yes. Paying lip service to the purpose of a jury trial, yet no mention of the fact that the Seminole County prosecutor had already enlisted and convened a grand jury, who was scheduled to rule on 4/10, after a thorough investigation by the Sanford PD which concluded on 3/15.

    Only to be relieved of their jurisdiction by the whim of the Governor.

    What probable cause of malfeasance did the Governor have to make such a move of no confidence?

    Benjamin Crump is on record as being astonished that no charges were made against G.Z. just 2 days after the incident.

    Yet how long did it take Corey? She was appointed the case on March 22. 4/11 is 3 weeks later!

    Ben Crump was contacting media a week after the incident, while Sanford PD was still doing detective work, prohibited from charging George BY LAW, until they could meet the stringent criteria for probable cause according to the SYG statute, that would convince the D.A. to issue a warrant.

    11 days after the incident Crump had the following to say to Huffington post on Thursday, 3/8

    ** Crump said the family is demanding that the Sanford Police arrest Zimmerman, and that the Seminole County State Attorney’s Office review the case and press charges.

    “They say they are still investigating,” Crump said. “I’m not sure what there is to investigate. What’s suspicious about this kid? That’s what the family is crying out, that our kid is like any other kid.”

    A call and an email to Chief Bill Lee of the Sanford Police Department were not immediately returned on Thursday. A phone number listed for Zimmerman has been disconnected, and his current whereabouts are not known.

    Lynn Bumpus-Hooper, a spokeswoman for the Seminole County State Attorney’s Office, said that the office has not received the case from the police, and until an arrest is made, it will not be involved.

    “We have not received a case [from the Sanford PD] yet, but we will give it our full consideration when we do,” Bumpus-Hooper said. She said it is not rare for several weeks to pass before the State Attorney’s Office receives a homicide or murder case from the police. ***

    So, Crump made a call to Sanford PD demanding an arrest no later than 3/7 or 10 days after the incident.

    Bumpus Hooper says sometimes several weeks may pass.

    Why wasn’t Crump and Sharpton foaming at the mouth at Corey after 10 days had passed?

    This whole thing reeks of hypocrisy and political posturing/pandering.

In her statement yesterday, State Attorney Corey asked prayers for Martin’s family and prayers for the team of special prosecutors. “We thank all of those who have sent positive energy and prayers our way. We ask you to continue to pray for our team as well as Tracy and Sybrina and the rest of Trayvon’s family.”

No prayers for George.

BannedbytheGuardian | April 12, 2012 at 6:41 pm

Ok . That’s done. Florida Legal was a flop.

What is next on the show?

Kudos to the poster who has brought in The Hunger Games. We are now past the sexy Vampire era .

Unfortunately still on West Wing channel @the White House.

Will Big Love be soon to take over ?

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