I’ll be brief.
I can’t add much to what I’ve written the past 17 months about the facts, evidence, law, witnesses, lawyers, judges, politics, and media.
So here you go:
Despite the heated demands of powerful societal forces and the State, six women just said No, and thereby did justice.
Amen.
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Comments
That is exactly what it means.
And it also means Angela Corey, Barack Obama, Judge Nelson, and Benjamin Crump were wrong.
Sign the Angela Corey DOJ investigation petition.
http://wh.gov/lan25
Need 150 signatures to get it posted on the website.
Cut and paste to facebook, twitter or other forums.
You need to put the name of the case in the title. A ssearch under “Zimmerman” only yielded two attempts to commit double jeapordy.
Turns out it is because there aren’t 150 yet, so it seems.
You know the White House ignores the ones they don’t agree with, correct? Plus you have to give them personal information in order to sign a petition, which they are not getting from me.
After all is said and done, I would have loved to see a final post that was an executive summary of the whole mess, giving a final perspective, that I could link to to show my friends that the Not Guilty verdict was just, without making them wade through huge amounts of detail.
I’m disappointed that most people who look at this case look at it tribally and not based on the facts or evidence. I understand that people have been whipped into an emotional frenzy by men with axes to grind, but it’s sad to see how uninterested they seem to be in facts and truth.
David
Well said. the low information crowd won’t let little things like “facts” or “the truth” stop their train.
Have to admit that I was hoping for a little more than this after the day long wait. It would be nice to have a one place summary with links to the details, but that would take quite a bit of work. Perhaps in a few days…
Yes, was just thinking tonight that those 6 jurors came out of sequestration and suddenly saw what a divisive political and media circus has been going on out here.
We owe each and every one of those 6 Jurors a Huge Debt of Gratitude.
They did their job of protecting our judicial system with great dignity and honor.
Thank You Jurors!
They knew. They were only recently selected. Certain jurors may or may not have been politically informed or engaged, but they knew the outcome of their decision would either affirm or reject Liberalism’s Big Lie.
Those six jurors are profiles of courage.
And yet I had thought they had given in to the “Poor Little Angel Trayvon!” emotion… I was wrong.
The best thing we all can do for these members of the jury is to grant them absolute privacy. These women have done plenty. Have you seen the death threats flowing around Twitter against them? They don’t deserve it.
I am glad I sent the defense a donation.
David did beat Goliath again!
I am really glad I sent the defense a donation too. They did an outstanding job, in full knowledge of all the gross misrepresentations, misconduct and hate mongering going on – To O’Mara and West & Team – Thank You All!
Yes, we sent a donation to the defense fund. They did a fabulous job. We think William did too with his website. So we also sent a donation here for the LI building fund.
Goliath beat David in this trial.
I agree David. I have no idea what to expect at work tomorrow. I know there are quite a few who are Traybots and parrot the falsehoods promoted by the media and still are in many cases. Anyone have any suggestions ?
Be armed ?
A big bowl, with a sign: “FREE Skittles for everyone!”
Yep . “Do not bring skittles to a gun fight. ”
And smile.
If you are well versed in the facts, particularly the actual trial testimony and evidence consider yourself well armed.
What I usually try to do is get the other person to tell me all they know about the facts in a non-aggressive way. Make them argue their case and I assure you most of them do not have facts but just talking points and conjecture. Then I lay out my case giving the real facts that they cannot dispute.
Most of all try to be a calm and cool as MOM. No histrionics, just straight forward.
You can’t reason with those unreasonable any more than you can nail Jello to a tree.
What I’m trying on my Facebook is to be neutral. This is a case about real people and can only be judged by the facts, not symbolism. Check out the facts over at Legal Insurrection (and here I give a link to the defense summary, although I sure wish there was a better link for a good summary of the case from the experts).
If you talk only about facts, I’m thinking you can make people curious, instead of thinking you are talking about the case thanks to your own axe you need grinding. Get your ego out of it, in other words. The case isn’t about your need to be right, or my need to be right.
If you can get them to see and consider the facts, you’re halfway there.
The irony of this is that members of the Black community are holding up Treyvon Martin as though he was a saint. He was actually someone with highly violent ambitions, who openly discussed fighting, breaking people’s noses and making them bloody, and getting guns with his friends. Quite remarkable how clearly his means of death was foreshadowed by his text messages. And his friends were worried that he would come to a similar fate.
Furthermore, he was also a low-grade burglar. He was caught with stolen property and a burglar’s tool. The real tragedy of this case is that Zimmerman was perfectly correct about him being a suspicious person. He was. Not because he was black, but because he was probably doing exactly what Zimmerman thought he was: Casing the joints, looking for soft targets.
If it’s any consolation to anyone, I’m going to say he died as he wanted to, in a fight he was confident he could win, at the prime of his life, doing what might have been the only thing other than texting that he truly loved to do: fight. More than anything, the real guilty party here is the culture that elevates and worships violent men, especially violent black men. If we really want to prevent this kind of incident, we have to look at our culture and try and figure out where it went wrong.
We should not worship violent thugs, who are for example rap musicians and drug dealers, or people like Treyvon Martin will grow up wanting to become them. It’s hard to blame Martin for wanting to be what he became, with all our cultural forces egging him on.
How to harness these forces into something more productive? I don’t have any answers. But at least I think it’s the right question to raise, and that’s a start.
David
People who live in ghettos know full well that young thugs can kill them. I feel sorry for a lot of them who think Trayvon is the “kid” portrayed as being “oh, so young, he’s just a “boy.”
Nothing new, is it? How about the glofication of a multiple-murderer named Billy the Kid?
Christopher A. Darden is an attorney in private practice in Los Angeles who wrote an editorial in the Daily Beast in which he opined ““Our national collective expectation of equal justice is based on our feeling of morality—not legality. We want the morality of a situation to match the criminality. That is often not the result in our court system.”
I posted his editorial board the following re: which I now find your remarks reflective to what he evoked from me.
Re: Yet it is this very same legal system which exists as the best, above and beyond any other form of governments.
In your life time, embracing the heritage of your parents and grandparents, which must be a part of you who writes these words, you must know, even though it may not be a perfect system, it is a really good system. A proven system.
In reference to your writing the above statement on the Zimmerman case, I take exception.
I have greater concern of legal and moral injustice of the racial violence which exist by black people done unto other black people as to the injustices you expound in reference to white*-on-black or black-on-white* crimes. (*anyone non-black). Violent crime and personal degradation which is self-inflicted upon blacks within their own families and communities. That is the outrage. Where you state “Racial disparity in killings that are found justifiable demonstrates that black life is not as valued as white life in this country” is only second to the fact they do not value their own life or the lives of those they claim as family and community. The high incidences of this type of violence in our country today outweighs any Zimmerman case as a crime of injustice and immorality in the legal system, for these maiming, mutilations and murders have not been held to the same standard as the case you have editorialized.
As a bench mark of the culture which is emanating and endorsed by the black community I relate the use of the most profane speech and music which portrays with emphasis on sexual and violent themes of themselves as being black and the style of life choices they find socially acceptable. Over the last 15 years it has moved into mainstream where the transformation is being witnessed as being the “black community”. It is now a philosophy which has ingrained itself as a segment of pop-youth culture. This aspect has disenfranchised a large segment of “All Others” as well as I personally know, the silent black community. Placing both the black inter-community violence with the projected transformation of the black culture, it ends with being a racial miscarriage of justice collimating in the Zimmerman Trial.
Respect. First for yourself, your family, your immediate neighborhood, your neighborhood at large and your country. It cannot be bought, sold, traded or demanded. It is earned. This value is being subverted by a segment of the black community upon the black community. The only non-black voices you hear are the ones who have subscribed to this phenom are having an identity crisis about not being labeled racist in the court of public opinion.
Look to any of the non-white American’s who are immigrants or generational immigrants and the one common value they share is respect for self, family, neighborhood and country. They have and are finding their path in this same society deemed racial and lacking. As a non-white class, they have brought their fundamentals with them to this country and are finding a foundation for growth. I’m sure whatever they chose to leave to come here, would resonate with the black community of 50 years ago. But to move forward, one must stop looking backwards.
Yes, an interracial society is something we all strive for where both a legal and moral court for equal protection exists. But there is a lot more that has to be forthcoming from the black community to earn the respect deemed lacking. The black community needs to stand up and hold accountable those in their own community who cast them in a derogatory way and those who within do harm to their own. Anyone else would be called racist. I know many solid black families who are battling this war but are at loss on how to confront it individually. Their hard work and values are being torn away by a growing sub-culture of black community that is held up to the light by the public media and at the same time the media ignores the instigated violence and deaths until they can wrap it around a token white* on black crime. The true values held by those of the black community are not different than all others who call America their home and country, but like the rest of us those values are not glorified, but chided by the mainstream media. Larger than the total sum of all these parts, is NO One, but No One holds the media accountable for such a disservice.
As a member of the black community, if you cannot condemn those who would bring you down and glorify those who share your values, how do you expect others in the “village” to convey legal morality values to those you claim are denied them. If justice is to be served for Trayvon Martin, the black community needs to look within too and call out their own.
David, your analysis is excellent. May I copy and paste on my Facebook page and give credit to you, or would you prefer to be anonymous?
Certainly and please do give me credit and send me a friend request since I’d like to see your stuff too.
Own the narrative. just say to them …
“You cannot escape the reality that after TM escaped GZ by running away, yes, running away, four minutes later, TM sneaked up on GZ from behind and became the violent and vicious aggressor.”
That four minute pause in the closing of the defense was, I believe, what won the case for GZ. POWERFUL!
Ask them why they are aware of this case. What made this case national news in a country that has more than 15,000 homicides per year? Ever heard of Channon Christian or Christopher Newsom? If not, why not?
Speak about the media showing a picture of a 12-year-old and a falsified tape?
If Holder’s DOJ is really interested in investigating the death of a young black man, may I suggest they head north:
http://my.chicagotribune.com/#section/-1/article/p2p-76593070/
How about Ramarley Graham?
Not to worry, Eric Holder & Co will fix that little oversight.
Any riots yet? I have my hot chocolate & raisin toast .
They’re burning stuff in Oakland, flags & what looks like a cat,? … hop e it’s a fake one.
Here in Melvis, they marched downtown carrying skittles & Watermelon drink. Mostly female, all young.
I doubt there is much in Oakland you could destroy without being a net benefit to the city. Screw trash can fires, it needs dynamite and bulldozers.
I know what I will say to tomorrow. My secretary (from Ithaca) walked in last week while I was watching the trial. She asked me what the outcome would be. I said they will vote not guilty, this case was a travesty that should never have been brought to a jury. She taunted me, saying NBC commentators (lawyers) disagreed with me.
I laughed and said you can’t believe the MSM. I told her I watch the trial and read legal insurrection.
Seems like a good time to gloat.
Seriously, don’t gloat. Kindness kills the hardest.
No, I think that only works with normal, intelligent people.
With someone like that, he needs to GLOAT.
It’s the only thing she’ll understand.
Maybe start looking for a better secretary? One with, say, some useful amount of brainpower?
Lawyers on NBC. Seriously. Abut as useful as citing Space Unicorns.
I keep hearing that Treyvon Martin was unarmed. I always thought (not being any kind of lawyer) that a boxer’s fists were considered to be a weapon – it this true or have I been watching too many 1950’s movies?
And, nobody goes after Rao and Bao with complaints that Trayvon’s hands weren’t bagged. And, his knuckles did bare (bear?) abrasions. So, IF the Black community never goes out seeking the truth, they won’t find it.
There are more homicides committed with fists, elbows, and kicking than there are committed with guns.
Do you have a link with information to verify that?
Approximately 10:1, firearms:fists/elbows/feet, according to the FBI.
Here is the link that shows the exact opposite of what you and the previous poster are claiming:
http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2011/crime-in-the-u.s.-2011/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-8
8600 (firearms) to 700 (Personal weapons (hands, fists, feet, etc.)
Oops! A bit unfocused without my full three cups of coffee! Please remove the “you” from my previous post. My bad!
That is true of RIFLES, not firearms generally.
Good morning Rags! I posted a link, did you click on it? Where is that one completely wrong bit of information coming from, what is the source(s)?
Total firearms: 10,129 9,528 9,199 8,874 8,583
Handguns 7,398 6,800 6,501 6,115 6,220
Rifles 453 380 351 367 323
Shotguns 457 442 423 366 356
Other guns 116 81 96 93 97
Firearms, type not stated
1,705 1,825 1,828 1,933 1,587
Personal weapons (hands, fists, feet, etc.)1
869 875 817 769 728
This seems like a misunderstanding. Ragspierre was correcting herm2416 by pointing out that herm2416’s assertion was true for rifles but not guns in general. This is upheld by what you just posted:
Rifles 453 380 351 367 323
Personal weapons (hands, fists, feet, etc.)1
869 875 817 769 728
Rifles come out to less than half of personal weapons for all but the first year in that sample, and for most years from 1998-2011 as well.
For most years, rifles + shotguns < personal weapons.
Handguns make up the overwhelming majority, and far outstrip personal weapons.
http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2011/crime-in-the-u.s.-2011/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-8
http://www2.fbi.gov/ucr/cius2009/offenses/expanded_information/data/shrtable_08.html
http://www2.fbi.gov/ucr/cius_04/offenses_reported/violent_crime/murder.html#table2_9
http://www2.fbi.gov/ucr/cius_02/html/web/offreported/02-nmurder03.html#t210
The Bible certainly does. It also provides a “rule of thumb”, that all other things being equal (average age, etc.), a piece of stone or wood the size of a fist can kill. Too bad the juror in the Reginald Denny case (victim of Rodney Kind riots – juorors did not consider a brick a “deadly weapone”) weren’t aware.
A sidewalk is a deadly weapon.
For a couple of the Martin apologists, this is how I handled it:
“Shall we reenact the scene? You be on the ground, your head against the floor, not the carpet, and I’ll straddle you and start beating you in the head and face. Tell me how long it takes for you to think that you’ll be seriously hurt or suffer a concussion with potential brain damage. And then tell me how you might stop me from doing that.”
It is about self-defense. Period. All the other “stuff” doesn’t relate. I say “Irrelevant to the case.” Or “Tell me how that is illegal. What statutes?”
—————-
For others, I’ve used the following:
“I agree, it is a shame that Martin is dead and it should never have happened because the reasonable action would have been for Martin to have gone home when he felt threatened by an older individual and called the authorities. Of course, that means that Martin brought this on himself by his choice to go back and confront Zimmerman. Every time we make bad decisions there are consequences we can’t foresee, as Martin thought he could get away with beating Zimmerman.”
There really is only one weapon in this world. We each carry one on our shoulders.
Everything else is just a tool used to serve the purpose we put it to.
Speaking of tools…
I wonder if those NBC talking heads think Zimmerman tricked TM into making a felonious assault on him?
They probably have a tape of him saying exactly that. Sounds a little jumpy in places, but what do you expect on short notice?
Just laughing realizing that Sunny Hostin, the omnipresent legal analyst who flits from CNN to HLN to Fox to MSNBCc, has batted zero from day one on every possible outcome she’s predicted. Now she’s confident that DOJ will come in and do something. She had better read the FBI report in the Miami Herald last week that says the feds have thoroughly investigated and found not one racial overtone to the facts of this case.
Saw her again today. It is remarkable 1) that she still has a job, and 2) that she is doubling down on the belief that murder 2 was absolutely proved by the prosecution. Still stirring the pot.
Her facial contortions are epic, and like a train wreck, I just have to look.
Do not underestimate the skankiness of our DoJ. They will come out and say that the previous FBI investigation for civil rights violations was brief and narrow by design, and that the DoJ’s ongoing in-depth investigation has located new witnesses who will testify to evidence of Zimmerman’s racism. This is easy as pie.
The decision will be based on whether the White House thinks going forth on civil rights violations is politically advantageous to them. EVERYTHING is politics now.
http://youtu.be/m5JZcwXpjqM?t=1m35s
In the words of the immortal George Carlin, “Some things don’t mean anything.”
Amen !
You may have said enough, Mr Jacobson, but you haven’t done enough to right the wrong done to George Zimmerman. After the trial, after a surplus of evidence showing he was at fault – and after the continuing drumbeat of negativity directed at him in the media from various sources perpetuating the same false narrative – and especially after Obama’s statement that gives the impression Zimmerman got off on a technicality of law, but is guilty as charged. Why aren’t any of your notable Republican or Conservative or Libertarian or Tea Party spokespersons publically speaking out to defend him? And why aren’t any of you vociferously condemning the Republican Governor for his role in facilitating a show trial, and demanding him to speak out against the continuing demonization of George Zimmerman?
Except for Zimmerman support from the commentators on blogs like this, and a very few Conservative commentators, the silence from the leadership of the Conservative Right has been deafening.
Lots of votes could be lost on the right.
They don’t want to turn off nearly every black voter, when few vote on the right side of the spectrum in the first place. No sense in losing nearly all.
Maybe if the polls come in with some balance within racial groups they can be more frank, but I doubt that will happen.
Sarah Palin may knock one out of the ballpark. And, Ann Coulter already did.
Plus, if politicians on the right are peeing in the pants, then the obama team needs super-duper Depends.
I think Prof. Jacobson has done plenty to help George. LI.com has, because of his early posts over the past 18 months and then his bringing Andrew in for the intensive writing, become the prime place on the nets to read the truth about the Zimmerman trial.
Is cheering offensive, given that “a boy died”?
Perhaps the response should be: “What difference does that make”?!
I will quote the rabbis in the law of the wayward son, “let him die (relatively) innocent and not die guilty (after having killed someone).”
It would have been open season on crime vicitims.
Hey, Zimmerman is (was) a big Obama supporter. Conservatives are the only ones ethical and decent enough to support someone’s rights even if they disagree with them politically. I think we’ve done plenty.
Dr. Manning, Trayvon Martin: Son of Satan’s Son
Oh, this is a good video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4KcfsZL3iI
This is really good. The race-baiting symbolism of Obama’s embracing Trayvon Martin as his own son, and how whites now have killed the son of the first black president.
Whites? How were they involved in this?
Of course, on the jury, five whites found for the Hispanic guy. But that was long after the shooting.
I can’t take credit for this myself. I hijacked the idea from the thread of a James Delingpole article, “Another Day, Another Wind Farm Scandal”.
Bored by all the repeated nonsense you hear when listening to a climate speech by an alarmist, or watching a climate report on TV, or just reading a newspaper report on climate? Then try playing “CLIMATE BS BINGO”.
It seems to me that the Zimmerman Persecution screams for an equivalent bingo game based on the campaign of endless myths, fabrications, twisted narratives and half truths; let’s create a Bingo game based on the Lies the Media Told Me:
GZ BS BINGO.
I echo my thanks for all the good insights these past weeks.
Quandry for wacko tree-huggers: what to do when a wind farm turbine threatens an endangered
red-throated woodpecker…….
Heh! Yet these “environmentalists” completely ignore the deaths of millions of birds and bats. Bats die, insect population explodes, thereby necessitating increased pesticides and insecticides in agriculture.
Dumb environmentalists.
‘Dumb environmentalists.’
Redundant.
1. Iced tea
2. TM was a little boy in a red Hollister t-shirt
3. ‘Police’ said ‘not to follow’
4. Rachel Jeantel (in general)
5. TM was screaming on the 911 call
6. Fucking coons
7. TM was ‘visiting’ his Dad
8. There was no SPD investigation
I don’t think Team Obama (ab)using the justice system to sacrifice a peasant for political gain is exactly justice, even if the peasant escapes with his life.
Thanks to extraordinary effort, in this case GZ won his individual fight, but the propaganda battle may have been won by Team Obama, in the war for our federalist state. Many warriors are lost in unpublicized battles, most overwhelmed by sabotage with forces posing as believers that swore an oath to our constitution, but are sold out to the machine.
Obstruction, delay, denial, misdirection … are the same as victory for the enemy, even if “justice” occurs occasionally for a much publicized individual. If ONLY extraordinary efforts free a Zimmerman, then most will be lost.
Saying “the system worked” reminds me of Janet. The system did NOT work. The system was used to abuse a good man, to overwhelm the police, and the propaganda war was won by the enemy. They are still reaping the rewards since the base is more stirred up than ever.
“The System” did not work, simply because the shoe bomb failed to explode … this time.
As I see it.
I beg to differ. This is an outstanding chance we have to go after those ignorant savants around us who pretend to know everything and make them feel stupid and foolish.
Say you are going to do a Trayvon on them figuratively so they should be okay with what you are about to do figuratively.
So here it goes. Punch them in the nose with …
The fact is that George Zimmerman as a mixed race man is more of a minority than Trayvon Martin.
Throw that into their face again and again.
Any federal case that would be brought on would pit a pure black victim claiming a civil rights violation was committed by a 1/8th black, Hispanic, and German man.
Throw that into their face again and again.
In other words, arguing a pure race’s civil rights violation trumps a multi-race civil rights violation ( Martin’s attack on George Zimmerman ) would, in fact, set civil rights back, not forward. The majority cannot trump the minority in a civil rights fight.
Throw that into their face again and again.
That which has melted into the melting pot of diversity has, by definition, less racial animus than those whose parents have chosen to remain true to their racial heritage.
Throw that into their face again and again.
And lastly, it is the race whores who defined George Zimmerman as white and they are the ones to blame for their ignorance and unjustified racial animus towards George Zimmerman.
Throw that into their face again and again.
Then, for the final blow, tell them you don’t want to be associated with bigoted, hateful racists like them and you are reporting their racial hate speech against the true minority, George Zimmerman, who was more of a minority than Trayvon Martin.
you have a point … and perhaps the most vocal are only driving the silent majority away from them. But indeed the voices for “justice for George” need to take advantage of this teachable moment.
With your Trayvon comparison, I’d put it that our justice system has been punched and beaten by the likes of Holder/Corey, and we need to at least fight back just as hard. But to really win would mean impeaching Holder and removing Corey, and perhaps winning some civil suits.
But as that first sheriff (?) that was fired said, “they just wanted an arrest, and didn’t care if it was dropped later. We don’t do that”
The jury of peers was the last stopgap measure, and it did indeed work. The citizens stopped an unrighteous prosecution. But I was just making a different point.
Oakland Protestors speak out! Arggh!
http://www.insidebayarea.com/breaking-news/ci_23660050/zimmerman-acquittal-hits-oakland-hard
High praise from the Instapundit blog:
“Let me just note, in passing, that his Legal Insurrection blog has had the best blog coverage of this case around.”
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/07/14/1223517/-An-Open-Letter-to-George-Zimmerman
Love these liberals. The short version of how the liberals feel is that George Zimmerman should have just laid on the ground and got his ass beat for doing nothing illegal. Plain and simple.
“I believe you mean “should have let Marti kill him”.
George made up that remark about “tonight you are going to die mother f*cker,” IMO. I do believe the rest of his story, but that one piece was created afterwards, perhaps in his mind he needed to justify his shooting his gun at another person. He felt like he might die, he freaked, pulled his gun and fired – Treyvon never saw it coming.
One other thing: there is a lot of time during the fight that George basically talks about doing nothing, just lying there getting beat up and not defending himself. He was defending himself and resisting with everything he had, that is why the fight kept going, and it is why Treyvon did not stop.
All of the above is just my opinion. Don’t freak out! George is still free! Maybe he can take a few boxing or karate classes before he rejoins the NHW…
Have to disagree with your remarks. You don’t know that “George, just made that up.” So stating it like that is meant to perpetuate a false narrative. You also seem a little glib about the entire event, and your “Trayvon Martin never saw it coming” is also misleading. It’s obvious from the facts of the case, including that Zimmerman had injuries all over him, that Martin had jumped him and was beating him up.
BTW, a cement sidewalk is a lethal weapon, so there is that.
I said that except for that one piece, that one sentence, I believe everything George said. Did he minimize what he was doing during the fight, I think so because he did not say exactly what he was doing during the fight.
But he also used very poor judgement by trying to find out where a menacing teen had gone for the police that were on the way, and he almost got sent to the penitentiary for a very, very long time! I’m glad that did not happen to him, but…
First, it wasn’t a “fight.” It was a beat down, and IMO a brutal one. In my experience, when one is being physically assaulted one usually 1) tries to deflect blows as best one can, and 2) tries to get away. So, IMO, that’s what GZ was “doing.” Trying to minimize the assault as best he could. Good grief but I’m tired of this ridiculous “fight” meme.
That’s right, apply a dose of “blame the victim”.
A person has a right to self-defense. This is true for everybody. If an assailant is trying to crack said person’s head open on a piece of concrete, he has a right to forcible self-defense. Should the assailant die of this forcible self-defense, that’s what we call “tough shit”.
It is not up to the law or the peanut gallery to decide that some other form of forcible self-defense, particularly one not available at the time, would have been more appropriate.
My second visit to the Kos Kids playhouse. It will be my last. We are afforded opposable thumbs and the capacity for sequential reasoning. They’re batting .500
Easy to spot that going after a single, innocent individual is easy. Here, the motivations of the democratic party are also obvious. It was an election issue that would swing Florida away from Mitt Romney.
You do anything to win. (And, if you’re a professional athlete you take enhancement drugs.)
What the Internet does, however, is make available instantaneous responses. I don’t Twitter. I don’t Facebook. And, it’s very possible people are NOT getting into arguments over this. And, if you’re Black, people are assuming you like the free things provided by Affirmative Action. We’re not going to spit this out, ahead. Let alone in one day. Or one week.
The good news is that George Zimmerman had excellent attorneys. The trial was televised. (Imagine if we were not allowed into the courtroom.) And, I, myself, found watching the trial mesmerizing. Coming here to this site to follow along the explanations posted by Andrew and other lawyers … helped me see what was going on.
Because the jurors were women. And, only six of them, at that. I worried that Zimmerman would be railroaded. But not after hearing Mark O’Mara’s close! Down the road, and way into the future, I hope O’Mara’s close makes the rounds. He alluded to our Framers. And, to John Adams. And, Thomas Jefferson. And, his explanation of how jurors come together to view EVIDENCE was breathtaking.
Then the jurors reached their verdict, and I knew there’s no place like America.
As to Obama’s remarks, today, what can I say? I think he’s incompetent. Nothing he said made me change my mind.
There’s a pretty good article in today’s Miami Herald at: http://www.miamiherald.com/2013/07/13/3499114/state-never-proved-its-case-legal.html
I’d like to think that would quell the drumbeat for further legal proceedings against Mr. Zimmerman.
Probably not, since most of the drum beaters aren’t exactly big readers….
What this world needs is a good Carol Herman filter.
I loved the coverage on France 24.
They merely stated that George Zimmerman shot and killed an unarmed Black youth.
Apparently all the rest is subject to interpretation.
I loved the coverage on France 24 …. Apparently all the rest is subject to interpretation
Germany is the same IMHO.
My experience here has been that in the first 24-36 hours of an international breaking news event German media presents data that may differ from US reports, but then moves to a presentation that recapitulates US major media coverage.
When I consider how hard it is for myself, as native English speakers, to ferret out enough pertinent information about a US event in an attempt to form a rational opinion, I am convinced a non-English speaker has zero likelihood of being able to do so.
FBI records: agents found no evidence that Zimmerman was racist
The evidence includes bank surveillance videos from the day of the killing, crime scene photos and memos from prosecutors.
Among the documents is a note from the prosecutor who said one of the witnesses said her son, a minor, had felt pressured by investigators to say the injured man he saw was wearing a red top. The boy’s testimony had been considered key, because it backed up Zimmerman’s allegation that he — wearing red — was being pummeled.
Federal agents interviewed Zimmerman’s neighbors and co-workers, but none said Zimmerman had expressed racial animus at any time prior to the Feb. 26 shooting of Martin, a black teen, in a confrontation at a Sanford housing complex. As Sanford police investigated the circumstances of Martin’s death, the FBI opened a parallel probe to determine if Martin’s civil rights had been violated.
http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2012/07/12/155918/more-evidence-released-in-trayvon.html#.UeM9mT7DVoY#storylink=cpy
Heard a black lady on the radio who insisted that the jury was paid off by someone. No evidence but that must of happened because they needed money. So sad.
I feel like this is the Jim Crow south where politicians prey on the racists for political power and whites are destroyed by the injustice system.
I
Just spewing out her Community Agitator lines according to the script.
Sickening. Borderline criminal. Talk about hate-speech.
Did someone mention Alanis Morissette?
Wow. Just heard Mark Geragos theorize that this trial was over before a single witness took the stand after Nelson granted the defense’s Batson challenge. Makes sense…. that exposed the prosecution’s naked racial motivation to those six women from the get- go.
I thought it odd that it was the prosecution who excluded the last Black male
776.032 Immunity from criminal prosecution and civil action for justifiable use of force.—
(1) A person who uses force as permitted in s. 776.012, s. 776.013, or s. 776.031 is justified in using such force and is immune from criminal prosecution and civil action for the use of such force …
Apparently, the Martin family lost the ability to sue George Zimmerman when he was found to have used “justifiable use of force” in regard to Trayvon Martin, at least at the state level.
A couple of quick notes:
re: Judge Nelson – I watched her expressions during the verdict and during the individual polling of the jurors. She seemed genuinely pleased. Perhaps she was an even better chess player than O’Mara or West. The most rabid TM supporters thought she was ‘theirs’ almost the whole time. Haven’t yet seen a bitter comment about her. Maybe she got the verdict she wanted while appearing to be (and, in my opinion, being) totally pro-prosecution, so she gets a bit of a pass all the way around. Yeah, she may get a nasty-gram from MOM and DW, but she’s a gubmint employee…
re: Race. One of my best friends, who is black, met me for a drink today. The verdict, of course, was discussed. He’s one of the wisest people I know. He carries the wisdom of matriarchs, being raised without a Dad, and he doesn’t have much of a conversation without mentioning his grandmother. I seek advice from him. His comment was this: ‘The guy should have stayed in his car like the police told him.’ He was resolute, not mad. But, I could feel the sadness in his heart as he discussed the police and the courts. My heart is with the guy. It’s tough to argue with logic when he tells stories of vindictiveness by the system. Food for thought…
By the way, and for what it’s worth, we met in Scottsboro, Alabama. Yeah, that Scottsboro. At the local golf club. So, again, for what it’s worth – drinking a beer with a black guy in Scottsboro-fucking-Alabama the day after a significant race trial. Poignant? You tell me.
Hold up. I thought that a 911 OPERATOR told GZ they “didn’t need him to do that” after he confirmed he was following TM on foot?
So, am I wrong?
Yeah like the 911 person told Amanda to just stay there until the police came . Yes dear the first available car will be there.
But I am Amanda & I’ve been missing for 10 years & everyone is looking for me .
Yes dear . Tell the police your story when they get there.
Can’t always be lucky to get a good dispatcher.
First, he called the non-emergency number, not 911. More than just semantics. He spoke to Sean Noffke, a dispatcher who is not a sworn law enforcement officer. Sean testified in court that he is prohibited from giving lawful orders due to issues of liability. Chief Lee also discussed this early in the investigation.
Here’s the quote from Sean:
‘Okay, we don’t need you to do that.’
That’s only a lawful order when issued by your spouse, ya know…
The whole ‘didn’t do what the police said’ is part of a narrative, and is simply not reflective of the truth. It is, indeed, misinformation – a lie.
One can argue that the Zimmerman thought the dispatcher wanted him to follow TM. Here is the transcript that the MSM will not give the light of day
SPD: Let me know if he does anything, okay?
GZ: (anxiously) See if you can get an officer over here.
SPD: Yeah, we’ve got someone on the way. Just let me know if this guy does anything else.
…..
SPD: He’s running? Which way is he running?
GZ: Down toward the other entrance of the neighborhood. [2:14]
SPD: OK, which entrance is that he’s headed towards?
….
SPD: Are you following him? [2:24]
GZ: Yeah.
SPD: Okay. We don’t need you to do that. [2:26]
GZ: Okay.
I live just south of you in Oxford/Anniston area and suffice to say AL is not this hot bed of racism that the outsiders would like you to believe.
Did you clarify for him !) that Zimmerman was already out of the car when, 2) the dispatcher (not a police person or a police order) said, “you don’t need to do that, Sir.”? The timing of the car door opening and closing makes it clear the request came after Zimmerman got out of the car, not before. Zimmerman is also heard to say “ok” when the dispatcher made the request and was waiting by the mailboxes for the police…
Of course, the friendship is important, but its the twisted facts and false narrative perpetuated that continues to allow people to believe that justice was not done and that the jury got it wrong…when, in fact, this should never have been brought to trial.
The police did not tell him to stay in the car. He was already OUT of his car when the comment “We don’t need you to do that” occurred.
He was walking BACK to his car when TM attacked.
Media brainwashes everyone, even those seeking the truth. As the old saying goes, “A lie can travel around the world twice before truth even gets its pants on” or something to that effect.
SPD: Are you following him? [2:24]
GZ: Yeah.
SPD: Okay. We don’t need you to do that. [2:26]
GZ: Okay.
That conversation occurred before George walked in to the pathway to the “T” IIRC. If I am incorrect on that, I am sure many will let me know! 🙂
One night I had a drunk driver in front of me, so I called 911. I was nearing the turn to take to my house, but I offered to continue following the car to help the police and they told me that would be fine. They instructed me to not break any traffic laws (speed, run a red light, etc..), they said that to me several times up until a cop pulled the car over. If they had said to me, “We don’t need you to do that.” I would have taken that to mean, “Stop following him, we’ve got this!” and I would have just turned and gone home.
On this point George was going out of his way trying to help the police and his community by going to the other side of the complex, in the darkness and in the same direction that Treyvon took, to get an address (after they had told him they did not need him to follow). He was helping too much (in my opinion), and he should have just gone to Target for his groceries instead, because the police were on their way and George had not witnessed a crime, he was just suspicious.
Just my two cents.
Having friends is all well and good, but if he’s one of the wisest people you know, you really have to get out more. The inability to distinguish fact from fantasy is not normally considered a sound foundation for any claims to wisdom.
That’s a wonderful story, Fabi, except for this part:
“His comment was this: ‘The guy should have stayed in his car like the police told him.’”
Except, the police didn’t tell him to stay in his car. What your friend said is one of the most oft-repeated and easily disprovable erroneous statements that people make about this whole event. He was already out of his truck when he was advised “We don’t need you to do that,” at which point he said “OK,” and started heading back to his truck.
What would I say at work:
Crystal Magnum. You have been misled. Yet again. And I will not discuss the case. Watch as events unfold.
I just hope the feds don’t trump up some obscure child abuse rights charge
For Over at Andrew’s site he’s got a link to a “Downfall” video that is rolling on the floor funny…
http://lawofselfdefense.com/angela-cores-downfall-lmao-funny/
Here is a quote from the CNN article that Drudge has linked under his banner ‘NOT GUILTY’:
A 911 dispatcher told Zimmerman that officers were on the way and not to follow the allegedly suspicious person. But Zimmerman still got out of his car…
Getting the facts right is a fundamental requirement of morality.
-P.J. O’Rourke
Let’s compile a list of media quotes (with links and complete citation) that were flat-out falsehoods. (It could be helpful to Zimmerman’s libel suit too.)
‘We’re gonna need a bigger boat.’
The worst aspect of all of this is that none of the bullsh!t we see going on today, and I mean NONE of it, would be happening at all if the Media had not flat out LIED to the American people about what happened that night in Sanford.
And they are STILL lying. They have been exposed as propagandists of the worst kind. I hope Zimmerman cleans NBC’s clock in civil court. Maybe that will be a wake-up call.
And CNN (displaying GZ’s SS #), and ABC and, of course MSLSD.
The go after the papers: NYT, LAT, WaPo, etc.
“Stupid women”…said every liberal who complained about the “War on Women”.
We don’t know if justice was done. Holder may yet weigh in, perhaps in response to that petition site.
What happened to the defense’s complaints against the prosecution. Will they do forward?
There is no cause for celebration at all. Sure, the jury did their job honorably – is anything less expected or acceptable? Since when does just doing the right thing get a merit badge?
But despite the verdict, millions of dollars have been wasted on this travesty. Most was “only” taxpayer money, but I don’t see Florida laying off any state employees over it so they will recoup it from the suckers, I mean public. And perhaps close to a million for the defense, including the services in kind without charge. All of this money was misdirected, it might have gone to more productive use (even the State of Florida might spend money better than a show trial for nothing).
And if there is one irrefutable economic fact, it is that growth promotes health, welfare, and life expectancy. It is the one constant correlation. So wasting money, public or private, actually costs lives in the long term.
How many black or Hispanic children will die in the ensuing years due to the lack of compounding economic growth that was lost to the persecution of George Zimmerman?
Ben Crump and Al Sharpton are the murderers of young black kids.
That’s one heck of a macroeconomic butterfly-flapping-causes-hurricane hypothesis you’ve constructed. Perhaps you should familiarize yourself with the theory of zero-sum. Or the basic formulation of wealth, as defined by Smith.
Economic growth promotes nothing, per se. Just sayin’…
Private money is at the disposal of its beholder. It cannot, by definition, be wasted, as the possessor alone freely chooses the best method of its application, whether it be lap-dances or raw land.
I suspect he knows about zero-sum. And rejects it, as he should.
I believe the DOJ has already positioned themselves not to file any Civil Suit charges based on Obama’s “MY SON” statement. I might be wrong but feel they have precluded DOJ injecting any more politics into the Zimmerman case and will try to distance themselves from Obama’s shoot from the mouth. Obama is currently paying hell in the military courts for his too public “legal” opinions. I reference the fallout of current cases tied to his remarks on military court sexual assault cases. The military court is now dismissing cases left and right using Obama’s own words for the defense on sexual assault: “(military personnel) should be “prosecuted, stripped of their positions, court-martialed, fired, dishonorably discharged” as bias and prejudicial to prosecution by their Commander In Chief.”
Holder would need Jay Carney to spin Obama’s remarks for the prosecution. And we all know how credible he is.
If you have the stomach for it, read the letter of termination re: Kruidbos. Another layer of the onion. And boy, oh boy, does it smell…
http://www.scribd.com/doc/153621847/Cheryl-Peek-Fires-Ben-Kridbos
Cheerfully plagiarized from a link above:
‘Riding the mannequin’ should be the new ‘Jumped the shark’.
lol
The legacy of this case will be that the media never gets it right, and worse, that a group of lawyers, with the aid of a public relations team, who had a financial stake in the outcome of pending and anticipated civil litigation, were allowed to commandeer control of Florida’s criminal justice system, in pursuit of a divisive, personal agenda.
Their transformation of a tragic but spontaneous shooting into the crime of the century, and their relentless demonization of the person they deemed responsible, not for a tragic killing, but for “cold-blooded murder,” has called into question the political motives and ethics of the officials serving in the Executive branch of Florida’s government, ruined the career of other public officials, turned the lives of the Zimmerman family, who are as innocent as their grieving clients, into a nightmare, and along the way, set back any chance of a rational discussion of the very cause they were promoting, probably for years. . . .
http://www.talkleft.com/story/2013/7/14/145748/759/Colo_News/The-Legacy-of-the-George-Zimmerman-Trial
Yeeeeup. If I had a corrupt, race-baiting national leader, he’d look like Pres. Snoop-Dog.
I love this site. The articles and comments are so measured and thought provoking.
[…] h/t Instapundit here and here. And Glenn Reynold own commentary here. Legal Insurrection: What this verdict means… Prior EBL Post: The Downfall of Angela Corey… Will Eric Holder pursue civil rights violations […]
Hmmm. If donates to defense funds of people whom a government (state or federal) is trying to railroad into prison were tax-deductible, thereby hitting the government in the wallet, maybe we’d have fewer such prosecutions. It sounds trivial, but given the way all levels of government fetishize taxes, it might be significant. Unfortunately, we’d have to say which defense funds were donated to, and the Obama IRS Harassment Squads would be all over us.
OK, never mind.
Fabi said: “re: Judge Nelson – I watched her expressions during the verdict and during the individual polling of the jurors. She seemed genuinely pleased. Perhaps she was an even better chess player than O’Mara or West. The most rabid TM supporters thought she was ‘theirs’ almost the whole time.”
It is an old joke among judges that the most important rule for a judge on evidence objections is to “always rule on objections in favor of the side that you know is going to lose the case.” I was wondering throughout whether Nelson was following this bit of advice.
I saw that someone posted that Angela Corey is, this morning, describing George as a “Murderer” and at first I thought that it was some kind of joke. But no, it wasn’t a joke…
How would Florida State Attorney Angela Corey describe George Zimmerman in one word?
“Murderer.”
http://www.hlntv.com/article/2013/07/15/george-zimmerman-prosecutors-angela-corey-bernie-de-la-rionda-vinnie-politan-interview
I don’t understand how she gets away with this. At what point does it become slander?
Covered in chocolate? Cloaked in chocolate?
If the Twix contradict, you must convict!
Dirtbag prosecutors gave an interview yesterday saying if they’d just been able to cross Zimmerman they’d have nailed him. They ‘respect the jury’s decision’ but he was just ‘lucky’, they know he’s guilty of murder. Still makin’ shit up, too.
Jeff Foxworthy probably never intended his “You might be a redneck” line … Oh never mind.